[ENTP] ''only friends'' relationship between male and female

[epp]

there are two types of male friends for me - 1) buddies, 2) close friends. the difference is that I don't really see buddies as men, they actually have no gender for me. also - these are guys that I just hang out with, usually in groups. so we are not close, but we are still friends.

close friends are different. I do believe women and men can be friends. real friends. I also truly believe if a man and a woman have an emotionally close friendship there actually is something in the air... sexual tension... because, really, besides them having a very friendly and nice personality, they have also been attractive to me. I know they have liked me as well.

then again - I can admit someone is attractive to me, yet never feel the urge to try it out. that there are always reasons not to do it.

for example - my best male friend at this moment is... I don't know what his type is but I know his stories with women etc, I know I might hurt him. he is a gentle soul and I might be too harsh sometimes. no, he is not a crybaby or an emo or something . I also have a feeling we might get too attached to each other.

all in all - our friendship is better this way. I don't see much potential for a good relationship, I'm quite sure it would be shitty.

not to mention that I have a boyfriend that I'm madly in love with

 

[OrangeAppled]

I think male emotions and sex are very intertwined with each other and harder to separate out than women's emotions and sexual interest. I think women are open to a wider variety of people, but are pickier in some regards when it comes to relationships. However, people grow on them as a romantic prospect sometimes through proximity. Men seem to be able to be attracted to a larger section on the population but are less likely than women to develop attraction if they didn't feel it initially.

From a practical standpoint, I don't think they tend to spend time on relationships that they feel have no potential to go anywhere. Since sex is inextricably (in many cases) a part of the equation, if there is no possibility of romance, it either becomes very uncomfortable for them, or else they move on.

In most cases, neither sex invests the amount of time and energy needed to create a close emotional relationship unless one or both parties have romantic emotions or sexual interest.

I just wonder why a man would feel, in the case of friendship with a woman, that the friendship must "go somewhere". If two men are friends, it does not have to "go" anywhere....the friendship is enough in itself. Why not the same between men and women? I realize that physical attraction can be an issue, but it's not always. I get the feeling that the underlying reason is that many men mainly value women sexually and they put them in a different category from themselves, instead of seeing them as a fellow person they can relate to.

 

[proximo]

I've many friends of both sexes, and have never had or seriously considered having romantic feelings for any of them. In fact I've not had romantic feelings for anyone except one person, for many years. And I'm bisexual.

So yeah, it is possible.

 

[proximo]

I think male emotions and sex are very intertwined with each other and harder to separate out than women's emotions and sexual interest. I think women are open to a wider variety of people, but are pickier in some regards when it comes to relationships. However, people grow on them as a romantic prospect sometimes through proximity. Men seem to be able to be attracted to a larger section on the population but are less likely than women to develop attraction if they didn't feel it initially.

From a practical standpoint, I don't think they tend to spend time on relationships that they feel have no potential to go anywhere. Since sex is inextricably (in many cases) a part of the equation, if there is no possibility of romance, it either becomes very uncomfortable for them, or else they move on.

In most cases, neither sex invests the amount of time and energy needed to create a close emotional relationship unless one or both parties have romantic emotions or sexual interest.

I'm not sure I can agree with that. I can honestly say that the idea of romance with any of the old matrons at church is pretty repugnant to me, and yet I very much enjoy and value them as friends and have a lot of time for them!


Same applies to the many married women I know, who are so far off limits in my mind that they might as well be giraffes for all the chances there are of me trying anything sexual on them! And yet again, I have much time for them and value them greatly as friends.

 

[Snow Turtle]

I'm a believer in strictly platonic friendships between male and female.

If I'm not interested in somebody, whether he be male or female, it's unlikely that I'll bother trying to become close friends with them. But it seems that whenever I'm interacting with the opposite gender... I'm also evaluating whether there might be potentially more if we did get close to each other.

So it's kind of a lose-lose situation. I can't become close friends with someone without feeling some sort of initial attraction. The only way around this is if I find them interesting, and know that they are already taken. This means that I don't evaluate them at all since I know that they are with someone else. In these scenarios, I become close and become the brother-sister friendship.

 

[Snow Turtle]

I have to say: Maybe an important factor that plays in all of this is the exposure to the opposite sex. For me, since I've never really been friends with many girls. When I do interact I start feeling drawn slightly.

However had I been to a girls school, there's a chance I might not fall for girls so easily and develop these friendships more easily.

 

[Nescio]

I'm a believer in strictly platonic friendships between male and female.

If I'm not interested in somebody, whether he be male or female, it's unlikely that I'll bother trying to become close friends with them. But it seems that whenever I'm interacting with the opposite gender... I'm also evaluating whether there might be potentially more if we did get close to each other.

So it's kind of a lose-lose situation. I can't become close friends with someone without feeling some sort of initial attraction. The only way around this is if I find them interesting, and know that they are already taken. This means that I don't evaluate them at all since I know that they are with someone else. In these scenarios, I become close and become the brother-sister friendship.

sounds like somthing I could agree with.

What really awesome sucks is when you end up being good friends anyways... because that's what life wanted to do to you.

Thanks world... for making such hilariously akward situations... and the less hilarious ones... and the ones that are only akward to me.... and making me such and awesometastic person... and for... delicious food?

 

[mcmartinez84]

I think the only potential for a real male/female friendship only is if they are mutually unattracted to each other. However, I don't think there's ever potential for it to become a really deep friendship like two males or two females would have without developing some kind of attraction. Normally, when I see this kind of situation the male and female are in the same social circle but not really best friends.

That is a ridiculous statement. I can guarantee my ESTP bff and I can tell each other almost anything in the world, go on all kinds of crazy adventures and neither one of us is remotely interested in the other romantically. I can't say his girlfriend (now financee) feels the same way all of the time, but he's told her she can't pick his friends for him. And that's why I love him to death. He's one of the best FRIENDS I could ever ask for. And there's never been anything romantic between us. Not even a drunken smooch. Gross!

I open up to the ESTP more than I do with most girls (there's just one INFP girl I can tell almost anything). I don't have many girl friends either. I'm a programmer...it's the industry I'm in to be friends with boys and that's fine with me. I like watching football, playing some video games and just having a relaxing good time - which boys tend to do much better than girls.

Having said all of that, I had a group of friends in college, mostly boys, and I think each one of them had a crush on me at a different time. Neither of those is the ESTP I was talking about. They're all introverted nerds like me. Since I was nice to them and actually hung around them, I think they got the wrong idea. Most of them also went to an all-boys school for 8th-12th grades... I'm pretty sure that hindered their ability to relax around girls and just be friends. I don't think I lead them on or anything. After they'd ask me out on a date or something, we weren't as good friends. The main reason being that I didn't wanna lead them on, another 'cause I kinda felt awkward being just as friendly around them when I knew they had feelings for me.

I'm not saying it happens all of the time, but I definitely believe there can be great platonic male/female friendships, just as deep as same gender ones.

 

[Totenkindly]

Interesting thread.

In my experience, there are a few friendships that manage to stay platonic (esp if the people are in committed relationships w other people), but the bulk, guys have tried to sexualize things if the bond grows too deep and you maybe if you derail that early and have the understanding of where things need to go, then the friendship can work. I'm still thinking about it, the data is a bit confusing.

I think there's some dependency on how/why the two started interacting in the first place and what their expectations were or were not.

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

I'm guessing that everything that has been said is true in some context, but very little applies universally. It is difficult to define romantic interest and connection. There is the assumption that it is overtly sexual, but there are lifetime bonds resulting in marriage that are not of a particularly sexual nature. How might one define such a relationship? Is it a friendship between the sexes? A romance? Then people describe "friends with benefits" where there is a sexual connection, but little or no intimacy. I don't think a sexual connection to someone necessarily correlates to the intimacy of the bond. Each relationship will interpret a sense of intimacy and loyalty differently. How would people define a relationship in which two people are married, but do not have a sexual bond (or more commonly the bond once shared is gone), and have emotionally intimate relationships outside that marriage that are similar to the relationship within the marriage? If one member feels it is disloyal by recreating their bond elsewhere, is it still innocent because of its lack of sexual connection? I don't know, but I do think the topic has very little universal application regardless of the particular conclusion.

 

[Snow Turtle]

Most of them also went to an all-boys school for 8th-12th grades... I'm pretty sure that hindered their ability to relax around girls and just be friends.

There's something about this statement that is annoyingly true. I've attended a boy school and it seems that when I'm interacting with girls, I have a tendancy to evaluate the potential of a relationship with them. I'm certain had I attended a mixed-sex school, it would be much easier for me to just have normal female friendships.

Having said that I do have one really close female friend. Initially I had contemplated the idea, but afterwards I just ignored the idea since she was interested in other people. So we've sort of developed the whole brother-sister bond.

It's obviously a problem when people have expectations for more, when the other person just wants friendship. However I do believe that for some people, when they get rejected and promise that they will just stick with friends, do have the ability to do so. They completely switch off the idea of relationships forever, and place you permenantly in the friendship category which allows you to develop the brother-sister bond.

Curious, do you feel that you have that bond with your ESTP friend? How would you label it?

 

[Feops]

I think they can and do happen, but it's hard to tell if a guy is really a friend or someone who wants more but got stuck in the friend zone.

As a guy, the friend zone is a frustrating place to be. Either you try to ignite interest and likely lose the friend, or you don't try and never know what may have come from it. A high risk gamble... I've lost friends by misinterpreting their interest in me and I've always felt terrible afterwards for ruining it.

There's probably a subtle technique for testing the waters without tripping alarms but I've yet to figure that trick out. I bet a lot of women would like to know as well.

One of my better female friends said bluntly (while drunk) "you're a fun guy but I'd never date you". At the time it got a "gee thanks" reaction from myself but in hindsight it established some pretty clear boundries.

 

[JHBowden]

What is your opinion about male and female ''only friends'' kind of relationship and why and do you try to avoid that?

I *do* avoid Platonic relationships with single women, and I really haven't thought about why. Married women tend to do a much better job keeping the appropriate distance.

At the risk of getting myself into trouble here, shopping, complaining, and relationship psychobabble-- the things unmarried women stereotypically do-- have no interest to me in themselves. Tragically, if I like a single woman as a friend, it is probably for the same reasons why she would make a good Mrs. Bowden-- perhaps she is caring, helpful, laid back, insightful, points out alternatives without confronting-- personal qualities that are tough to impersonalize. If something doesn't look like it has potential, I cut my losses, and move on to other things.

 

[Matthew_Z]

In my defense, I do consider most of my male friendships as capable of going "somewhere." Getting friend zoned with someone of the same gender is just as limiting in a relationship.

 

[EffEmDoubleyou]

My humble advice to anybody who starts to fall for your friends- Never, EVER "confess your love" to them. It's a terrible idea with a ridiculously low success rate that's highly misrepresented by romantic idealism. It puts them in a very difficult, uncomfortable and very awkward spot.

Maybe. But sometimes it's toxic to hold that kind of thing in. The wondering can kill you. The relief of a "no" is better than the wondering. And I think there's something noble about taking that kind of stand, even if it doesn't work. As long as you speak about it honestly and earnestly, many good friends can stay that way.

 

[miss fortune]

I've never understood the whole When Harry Met Sally mindset that its impossible for a guy and girl to be just friends and not sleep with one another! One of my very best friends through college was an INTP guy- we hung out every day, knew more about each other than anyone else did and never made plans in which the other would feel left out- we even occasionally synched our class schedules so that we'd be in the same classes! However, we never even considered dating each other, or even sleeping with each other- it just would have felt wrong, like sleeping with a brother

After getting out in the real world, I met another guy who I even dated for a month because we got along so well, but there was NO sexual chemistry there- we couldn't even stand the idea of kissing each other even though we slept in the same bed- it just seemed wrong. We broke up, I started dating his best friend/roommate and we still remained friends just the same as ever- he even hangs out with the two of us from time to time

I think its completely possible for girls and guys to be just friends- to say otherwise would be like saying "lesbians can't be friends with other girls because they might get romantic feelings for them" or something silly like that. The friendship isnt based on gender

 

[tcda]

As a male I don't think it works for me to have close female friends, though obviosuly I have acquantainces who I am friendly with but if I ever had a close female friend who I felt a real "connection" with, I was also interested in a sexual-romantic relationship with her.

Depends how people define "friend". To me if I only meet up with someone in groups and don't hang out just the 2 of you, I don't consider them a "friend".

Also I'm pretty sexually liberal so I don't see a big deal in casual sexual relationships with women, I don't think this necessarilly has to develop into a full-blown monogamus relationship. I think our cousins "across the pond" call it a fuck-buddy or something.

 

[OrangeAppled]

In my defense, I do consider most of my male friendships as capable of going "somewhere." Getting friend zoned with someone of the same gender is just as limiting in a relationship.

So if your friendships with other men do not or cannot turn into romantic and/or sexual relationships then you have no need to be friends?

Someone like that would have no platonic friends then....

 

[mcmartinez84]

There's something about this statement that is annoyingly true. I've attended a boy school and it seems that when I'm interacting with girls, I have a tendancy to evaluate the potential of a relationship with them. I'm certain had I attended a mixed-sex school, it would be much easier for me to just have normal female friendships.

Having said that I do have one really close female friend. Initially I had contemplated the idea, but afterwards I just ignored the idea since she was interested in other people. So we've sort of developed the whole brother-sister bond.

It's obviously a problem when people have expectations for more, when the other person just wants friendship. However I do believe that for some people, when they get rejected and promise that they will just stick with friends, do have the ability to do so. They completely switch off the idea of relationships forever, and place you permenantly in the friendship category which allows you to develop the brother-sister bond.

Curious, do you feel that you have that bond with your ESTP friend? How would you label it?

A brother-sister bond? Sure! That might be a good label for it, altho I don't really think "Hey, he's like my brother" or anything. I just think "He's a great friend!" I love him to pieces, but the most kissing action we see better be on the cheek!

 

[Matthew_Z]

So if your friendships with other men do not or cannot turn into romantic and/or sexual relationships then you have no need to be friends?

Someone like that would have no platonic friends then....

Not quite the point I was going to make. I was more trying to hit at the point that sometimes setting strict boundaries can limit a relationship more than said boundaries were initially designed to.