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  1. #51
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    I agree with the first part. Approaching indirectly is fine, yet if male doesn't take it to the next level in a timely manner this often kills the physical attraction for women whether they admit it or no.
    Nope, not true. Not taking it to the next level may be a turn off for other reasons. It won't "friend-zone" you forever, but it may make things more complicated than it has to be. There's nothing concrete for this stuff anyway...feelings change, people change, circumstances change, and all of these open up possibilities. It's a matter of all of these lining up at the same time for two people.

    As for the second part have a hard time thinking that women who have a bunch of FZ orbiters floating around them really only believe that the guys "just want to be friends". Think some of them mostly keep the orbiters around as an ego boost. I don't see anything wrong with it per se, I just think it creates an odd incongruence because usually the orbiters are putting them on pedestals.
    Well, I believe men and women can have platonic friendships. Instead of jumping to negative conclusions, why not consider the possibility that you can enjoy someone of the opposite sex without wanting to be in a romantic/sexual relationship with them? I think men who cannot admit to that are usually harboring misogynistic feelings. They only like/value women who they see as sexual objects to desire. They cannot value a woman on the same level as a male friend otherwise.

    Women don't read minds either, which is part of the problem with your "FZ orbiter" ideas. How should a woman know if a guy has honest intentions of friendships or is really just spineless hanger-on hoping for more? If you like someone as a friend, you tend to not assume the worst.

    Men and women usually become friends in a group also, so it's often not clear if a guy is singling a woman out if they also communicate outside the group. It's a different situation if a guy comes out of nowhere and expresses interest in getting to know you and repeatedly makes effort to see you alone, and then you feign ignorance of his romantic intentions.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  2. #52
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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  3. #53
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Instead of jumping to negative conclusions, why not consider the possibility that you can enjoy someone of the opposite sex without wanting to be in a romantic/sexual relationship with them? I think men who cannot admit to that are usually harboring misogynistic feelings. They only like/value women who they see as sexual objects to desire. They cannot value a woman on the same level as a male friend otherwise.
    This is exactly the truth. Men have to work with women now, how does that work if male/female relationships are always looked at as potential partners? What about people who are married, can they not have any friends of the opposite sex since they aren't "looking" anymore? (I've had people tell me yes to this)

    I wonder how males with this "can't be friends unless I'm romantic with a chick" theory would make it if they were stuck in a mostly female major or profession once they realized they were with (maybe) a few guys total that they could befriend. If you don't like those friend options you dont GET any friends unless you branch out. In engineering I was the only female both freshman and sophomore years, (and only 4 females in my major, including me, the rest of college) I didn't have the choice of ignoring everyone who wasn't my gender if I was not interested in them romantically.

    (ok, ok, so I contributed to this male/female friend thing that crops up in every male/female thread)

  4. #54
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    This is exactly the truth. Men have to work with women now, how does that work if male/female relationships are always looked at as potential partners? What about people who are married, can they not have any friends of the opposite sex since they aren't "looking" anymore? (I've had people tell me yes to this)

    I wonder how males with this "can't be friends unless I'm romantic with a chick" theory would make it if they were stuck in a mostly female major or profession once they realized they were with (maybe) a few guys total that they could befriend. If you don't like those friend options you dont GET any friends unless you branch out. In engineering I was the only female both freshman and sophomore years, (and only 4 females in my major, including me, the rest of college) I didn't have the choice of ignoring everyone who wasn't my gender if I was not interested in them romantically.

    (ok, ok, so I contributed to this male/female friend thing that crops up in every male/female thread)
    Well, friends and coworkers are not necessarily the same thing. Someone can be both, but there's plenty of room between "ignore them entirely" and "be friends with them."

    I don't think anyone said anything about men and women not being able to be acquaintances or coworkers or classmates; that's a much less intimate relationship than "friends."
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  5. #55
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    This may seem dismissive but what women say and what happens in the field are two different things. In other words often a man will ask a woman how to seduce another woman and she will tell him to give flowers and candy. This, unless the guy looks like Brad Pitt, will likely not work.

    Of course there are exceptions and ideal scenarios but these are often only exceptions which prove the rule.

    At some point SOI, statement of intent (i.e. sexual/romantic interest or lack thereof) despite the clarity of nonverbal language is preferred and often avoided by both parties.

    Don't blame the player(s) [both male and female] blame the game.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  6. #56
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Well, I believe men and women can have platonic friendships. Instead of jumping to negative conclusions, why not consider the possibility that you can enjoy someone of the opposite sex without wanting to be in a romantic/sexual relationship with them? I think men who cannot admit to that are usually harboring misogynistic feelings. They only like/value women who they see as sexual objects to desire. They cannot value a woman on the same level as a male friend otherwise.
    For sure, its fun to talk to female friends about relationships and stuff. Its fun bc I can tell them stuff I couldn't tell my gf, and its as therapeutic as writing in a diary.

    Also, you can connect with a female friend, sometimes in ways you just can't with your sig other.

    When your single, female friends can introduce you to their other single female friends too.

    Also, you can introduce her to your guy friends, and its always good to have girls around when you go out drinking.

  7. #57
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    This may seem dismissive but what women say and what happens in the field are two different things. In other words often a man will ask a woman how to seduce another woman and she will tell him to give flowers and candy. This, unless the guy looks like Brad Pitt, will likely not work.

    Of course there are exceptions and ideal scenarios but these are often only exceptions which prove the rule.

    At some point SOI, statement of intent (i.e. sexual/romantic interest or lack thereof) despite the clarity of nonverbal language is preferred and often avoided by both parties.

    Don't blame the player(s) [both male and female] blame the game.
    There is no game unless you create one :rolli:. You're terribly gullible with these dating theories. Life and love are not all theories or systems where you put in one action and receive one in return; there are way too many variables, particularly human emotion.

    Your first paragraph just confirms the misogynistic tones to those theories anyway. It's this "us vs. them" mentality. Don't trust THEM, the "women".
    Your "field" will always be a battlefield with that attitude. You'll never know any woman as a person because you cannot accept what one tells you as her truth, but you must fit her into a system that makes sense in your fabricated game world.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  8. #58
    . Blank's Avatar
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    I think someone just got friend zoned.
    Ti = 19 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
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    Si = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
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    Se = 11[][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fe = 0

    -----------------
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  9. #59
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    There is no game unless you create one :rolli:. You're terribly gullible with these dating theories. Life and love are not all theories or systems where you put in one action and receive one in return; there are way too many variables, particularly human emotion.

    Your first paragraph just confirms the misogynistic tones to those theories anyway. It's this "us vs. them" mentality. Don't trust THEM, the "women".
    Your "field" will always be a battlefield with that attitude. You'll never know any woman as a person because you cannot accept what one tells you as her truth, but you must fit her into a system that makes sense in your fabricated game world.

    Didn't create the game. It has always been there. Long before you or I were born. I would prefer if there was no game but since it is a reality adaption seems in order. Not saying this to be cute only to shine a light of truth on an amoral reality. If you wish to kill the messenger, then thats on you.

    I don't put a value judgment on this therefore there is no right and wrong player. I don't appreciate the ad hominem attack of alledgedl advocating game theorys which are misogynistic (in other words; in this context not politically correct or obscure drivle or group think). A person could call you names too or associate you with malign terms; I on the other hand just make it a point for the sake of polite debate to give you the benefit of the doubt. Female friends are cool if you want them as friends; if you don't want to make each sexual interest a platonic friend then its not so cool. I differ in the ladder theory in that I value female friends that that are sexy if they earn their friend status by merrit and not false pretenses.

    Have often seen a lot of young men get very bad advice from those who are unable to explain the introduction into game, the strategies etc. where I see a lot of frustrated chumps failing. They are often too proud or too scared to speak up and if they do settle it is often for less.

    Mid-late game, long term seduction and well into a relationship I find majority of western females appreciate the process well…but until someone gets the beginning down they don't reach that point with a high caliber target…and if women are ignorant and unable to read the nonverbal body language and other cues by their orbiter then even better to acknowledge this all too common occurrence.

    Not trying to be seductive and in fact know it is somewhat antiseductive to break down what society has romanticized and demonstrate it in an simple and straight forward explanation (as least as much as possible/practicable.)
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  10. #60
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    Not trying to be seductive and in fact know it is somewhat antiseductive to break down what society has romanticized and demonstrate it in an simple and straight forward explanation (as least as much as possible/practicable.
    You know, I totally know what you mean here, but for some reason, I think this is really hard for a woman to understand (or admit to understand).

    Which if you think about it, thats pretty great. To live a life so carefree and fun based. Which is why I aspire to (continue to) live the male version of this life. haha (well right after I get some serious studying done the next two weeks). Im gonna try friend zoning girls blatantly too, to see their reactions. (although, when I do it blatantly and unknowingly, it has led to some drama situations or unfavorable situations), but i want to try to frame all women in this sort of immediate classification for a while, kinda just for fun for a bit. haha. after all, its the 21st century! =D

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