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  1. #111
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    You don't think it's fair for people to form an opinion about you based upon what I'm saying? Why would they do that? I formed my opinion of you based on posts you made yourself, and any one with any sense would do likewise. I don't know anyone on this forum that would just blindly agree with me just to be doing it.
    No, you formed an opinion based on your feelings, not for what I was saying. Our 1st real interaction was you telling me I was arrogant for talking about how much I pay in taxes. When I wasn't being arrogant, I was making a larger point in regards to the topic we talked of.

    And pretending people don't see what someone says then assimilate it into a bias is absurd, because lots of people do that. Its sort of why women are called "catty" isn't it?

  2. #112
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i'm going isfj 3w4.

    i still get Fe, but it's unhealthy Fe that can only see one side of any equation. no Ni whatsoever. reading the blog shows attempts at strong self-assertion, resiliency, fighting back after feeling picked on. very Fe, just undeveloped and unaware of how to balance itself properly. the internal and external pressure is way off.

    i think the stories are mostly well-written, but they lack self-awareness. they're too much focused on their own e3 image control, and unaware of the cheese of tangerine lip gloss (from an infj perspective). it's an obvious mistyping.

    i'm sure entjs line up armies of isfj cronies when they need help on a scheme to fuck over their neighbors.
    So you are saying I am Si dominant? ha ha ha.

  3. #113
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I'd be interested to find what other people think of your type, in general. Just out of curiousity.
    Part of Fe is soaking up the etiquette specific to the type of people in your environment, not always acting according to an inner concrete set of etiquette rules.

    If/when Iím in a situation with NT types long enough to become acclimated to the way they behave towards each other; Iíll almost invariably begin to behave that way myself.

    I think itís the empathy. I pick up on how much directness I can get away with. And in situations where I can get away with being incredibly direct without hurting feelings, Iíll be incredibly direct.

    This is just speculation from my own experience, but Iíve been in situations where Iíve been perceived as confrontational; and itís usually because Iím accustomed to dealing with one type of person and it takes time for me to Ďsoak upí the new rules for this other type.

    Granted, I usually hold off on engaging in dialogue until Iíve become acclimated to a given situation. But something Iíve noticed (being relatively new to dialogue in an online forum) is that itís much more difficult to read people over the internet. It is for me anyway. And I have little doubt that I also come across as more arrogant and/or confrontational online than I do IRL.

    Marmalaide: I kind of had similar thoughts after reading a couple of his posts in other threads. I can see how his attitude is coming across as being too coarse for that of an INFJ. But- for what itís worth- once I read something about him having an ENTJ as a mentor (?) earlier in this thread, his attitude kind of made sense to me.

    And in regard to the op, I really donít think one type ultimately has more potential to be scary than the other (at least between the choice of ENTJ or INFJ). I think it depends entirely upon the individual.
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari

  4. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    No, you formed an opinion based on your feelings, not for what I was saying. Our 1st real interaction was you telling me I was arrogant for talking about how much I pay in taxes. When I wasn't being arrogant, I was making a larger point in regards to the topic we talked of.

    And pretending people don't see what someone says then assimilate it into a bias is absurd, because lots of people do that. Its sort of why women are called "catty" isn't it?
    First, you said "you're welcome non-tax payers" in regards to health care reform, and my reply was that it was arrogant to assume that the people who will benefit aren't employed full-time, or paying taxes, or working just as hard as you do. You flippantly replied that you pay as much in taxes as some working class families make in a year, which seems arrogant to brag that you have that much to give away considering the topic at hand. You further compounded this by arguing with an INTJ - who was not arguing from her "feelings" - that people don't have health insurance simply because they made "shitty choices" in life? That's not arrogant? There are libertarians on this site who are humble enough to admit that even though they have their libertarian principals, everyone who doesn't have health insurance didn't necessasarily make "shitty choices" in life.

    However, people in political discussions sometimes get nasty, but then here you are over here in a thread talking about how selfish you are, and destroying people's minds, and killing your mentor's neighbor's trees whilst offering to "help him" chop the wood, there by benefiting yourself with free fire wood.

    I think with the two things combined, and other little things observed, it was fair of me to say that you seem to lack Fe.

  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i'm going isfj 3w4.

    i still get Fe, but it's unhealthy Fe that can only see one side of any equation. no Ni whatsoever. reading the blog shows attempts at strong self-assertion, resiliency, fighting back after feeling picked on. very Fe, just undeveloped and unaware of how to balance itself properly. the internal and external pressure is way off.

    i think the stories are mostly well-written, but they lack self-awareness. they're too much focused on their own e3 image control, and unaware of the cheese of tangerine lip gloss (from an infj perspective). it's an obvious mistyping.

    i'm sure entjs line up armies of isfj cronies when they need help on a scheme to fuck over their neighbors.

    Hmm, based on the journal I would either agree with ISFJ, or even say INFP. There is definitely Si going on here, and the way he flatly defends his own poltical value system within emotional opinions actually seems Fi ... he's made the mistake of assuming that Fi doesn't care about other people. That just isn't true. It just means Fi brings values from within, and Fe bases theirs on cultural values.

    His writing actually reminds me of my writing about ten years ago when I was much younger, and I would attribute it to an Fi-Si loop, honestly, which would indicate INFP.

    It could be ISFJ - Si combined with hurt Fe.

  6. #116
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Hmm, based on the journal I would either agree with ISFJ, or even say INFP. There is definitely Si going on here, and the way he flatly defends his own poltical value system within emotional opinions actually seems Fi ... he's made the mistake of assuming that Fi doesn't care about other people. That just isn't true. It just means Fi brings values from within, and Fe bases theirs on cultural values.

    His writing actually reminds me of my writing about ten years ago when I was much younger, and I would attribute it to an Fi-Si loop, honestly, which would indicate INFP.

    It could be ISFJ - Si combined with hurt Fe.
    Fi feels weighty to me. one way i look at the difference between Fi and Fe is that Fi keeps the emotional resonances of its experiences and Fe doesn't. when i remember emotional states, it's not a concrete element, but the relationship between various things, the mood of something. but even then, the mood is difficult to recover, and what is left over is what is articulated as i attempt to understand that mood, a statement produced. what is stored is perceptual information, ideas, concepts, webs of relationship that can be imagined from various external representations of self, from my perspective. we keep more embodied voices around to judge these ideas thru Fe employing a highly advanced contextualization. whereas you keep all of your specific feelings. you use Ne to give articulation and to FIND or CONNECT your disparate and amorphous blob of Fi values into concrete metaphors. you use concrete to build analogies. we keep the analogies, but get rid of the concrete until they're just pure ethereal mind-stuff.

    i don't see weighty Fi. i see wounded Fe that is trying to over-project an image to provide internal space, distance from the actual responses of others and actual recognition of self by others. hence the e3.

    when i need space, i just shut the fuck up and walk away. maybe say something extremely pointed first (or probably later). that's the 5w4 vs 3w4. 5s hyperinflate themselves in their own private world, whereas 3s try to do it in the eyes of others. the 4w is the easily wounded part, reading negative experiences as personal defects and terrified of feeling ashamed before self and others.

  7. #117
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    Fi feels weighty to me. one way i look at the difference between Fi and Fe is that Fi keeps the emotional resonances of its experiences and Fe doesn't. when i remember emotional states, it's not a concrete element, but the relationship between various things, the mood of something. but even then, the mood is difficult to recover, and what is left over is what is articulated as i attempt to understand that mood, a statement produced. what is stored is perceptual information, ideas, concepts, webs of relationship that can be imagined from various external representations of self, from my perspective. we keep more embodied voices around to judge these ideas thru Fe employing a highly advanced contextualization. whereas you keep all of your specific feelings. you use Ne to give articulation and to FIND or CONNECT your disparate and amorphous blob of Fi values into concrete metaphors. you use concrete to build analogies. we keep the analogies, but get rid of the concrete until they're just pure ethereal mind-stuff.

    i don't see weighty Fi. i see wounded Fe that is trying to over-project an image to provide internal space, distance from the actual responses of others and actual recognition of self by others. hence the e3.

    when i need space, i just shut the fuck up and walk away. maybe say something extremely pointed first (or probably later). that's the 5w4 vs 3w4. 5s hyperinflate themselves in their own private world, whereas 3s try to do it in the eyes of others. the 4w is the easily wounded part, reading negative experiences as personal defects and terrified of feeling ashamed before self and others.
    You sure talk the talk, but you seem like you lack any real understanding in terms of internal processing. I notice you pick up on things in my journal that strike you in an emotional way and I know you are probably just trying to defend your friend which is why you are obtusely trying to paint me as an ISFJ, but I think that is sort of like doing a disservice to yourself intellectually. Do you think she will like you more for coming to her rescue oh white knight? Because you are so far off base with your assertions that i am actually laughing. Did you roll a nice fattie before you wrote that tripe up? I am guessing you straight up didnt read anything I had written or read 2 lines and thought you came away with enough ammunition to "get me" had you kept reading though you might have seen another story unfold. But why am I even bothering to tell you this. Its pretty clear you arent interested in knowing anything, you just want to blurt out a bunch of BS, par for the course I guess. Are you sure you're an INFJ? I am aware in how contradictory it is for me to say that, but in this case I truly am curious. Did you ever test as INFP and INFJ and waffle back and forth?

  8. #118
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    First, you said "you're welcome non-tax payers" in regards to health care reform, and my reply was that it was arrogant to assume that the people who will benefit aren't employed full-time, or paying taxes, or working just as hard as you do. You flippantly replied that you pay as much in taxes as some working class families make in a year, which seems arrogant to brag that you have that much to give away considering the topic at hand. You further compounded this by arguing with an INTJ - who was not arguing from her "feelings" - that people don't have health insurance simply because they made "shitty choices" in life? That's not arrogant? There are libertarians on this site who are humble enough to admit that even though they have their libertarian principals, everyone who doesn't have health insurance didn't necessasarily make "shitty choices" in life.

    However, people in political discussions sometimes get nasty, but then here you are over here in a thread talking about how selfish you are, and destroying people's minds, and killing your mentor's neighbor's trees whilst offering to "help him" chop the wood, there by benefiting yourself with free fire wood.

    I think with the two things combined, and other little things observed, it was fair of me to say that you seem to lack Fe.
    Did you even read what I wrote afterward about the trees etc? And saying we kill peoples minds is called a joke. I tend to understand people and their motivations pretty well, I figure things out about people I am talking to and they ultimately let me in and I know their secrets, its sort of stereotypical Ni crap. I live almost entirely on Ni. The problem we have with the land owner next to us is that he is incredibly sloppy and he is destroying the land value by not caring for it properly. I wrote that shit with a sort of tongue in cheek feeling which I later explained. It does neither of us a service to ignore some of the things I do and say and focus entirely on a narrow view of things I say and do.

    And as I have said, online I don't sugar coat much of anything, there are no consequences here for me to worry about officially, I don't have to read it in your face so to speak.

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    You sure talk the talk, but you seem like you lack any real understanding in terms of internal processing. I notice you pick up on things in my journal that strike you in an emotional way and I know you are probably just trying to defend your friend which is why you are obtusely trying to paint me as an ISFJ, but I think that is sort of like doing a disservice to yourself intellectually. Do you think she will like you more for coming to her rescue oh white knight? Because you are so far off base with your assertions that i am actually laughing. Did you roll a nice fattie before you wrote that tripe up? I am guessing you straight up didnt read anything I had written or read 2 lines and thought you came away with enough ammunition to "get me" had you kept reading though you might have seen another story unfold. But why am I even bothering to tell you this. Its pretty clear you arent interested in knowing anything, you just want to blurt out a bunch of BS, par for the course I guess. Are you sure you're an INFJ? I am aware in how contradictory it is for me to say that, but in this case I truly am curious. Did you ever test as INFP and INFJ and waffle back and forth?

    Actually, while I might feel geniality or respect for this individual, the state I am in have not enjoyed any sort of particularly close friendship before this thread, so I'm going to say that these are probaby the state I am in's real opinions, and that it's not some sort of situation where two people who are BFFs are ganging up on you. Not the case at all.

    I see Si in your writing, too, and also in the basis for your political opinions (all people at the bottom are getting "free drugs"? you shouldn't have linked to your journal, it showed me where your prejudice toward people without health insurance began) - and while I feel sad for you as a person with disheartening childhood experiences, it's given you a (totally understandably) skewed, emotional impression upon which you have based your political opinions, which gives me a veerrrrry strong sensation of Si. Possibly Fi/Si loop - I wouldn't rule out INFP or ISFJ for you, seriously.

    On one hand you have my sympathy, but on the other ...

  10. #120
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Actually, while I might feel geniality or respect for this individual, the state I am in have not enjoyed any sort of particularly close friendship before this thread, so I'm going to say that these are probaby the state I am in's real opinions, and that it's not some sort of situation where two people who are BFFs are ganging up on you. Not the case at all.

    I see Si in your writing, too, and also in the basis for your political opinions (all people at the bottom are getting "free drugs"? you shouldn't have linked to your journal, it showed me where your prejudice toward people without health insurance began) - and while I feel sad for you as a person with disheartening childhood experiences, it's given you a (totally understandably) skewed, emotional impression upon which you have based your political opinions, which gives me a veerrrrry strong sensation of Si. Possibly Fi/Si loop - I wouldn't rule out INFP or ISFJ for you, seriously.

    On one hand you have my sympathy, but on the other ...
    Yes but thats what I am saying, you seem to think these things made me skewed, but they didnt, they made me realistic. Which is why I get into trouble with these ridiculous healthcare debates. I have been on the bottom of the totem pole and scratched my way up on my own merits, no one gave it to me. I dont know if you OR he have the intuition as INFPs to see where I am coming from because you cannot disassociate your logic from your feelings. Believe it or not, INFJs do disassociate their logic from their feelings, we just realize that we still have feelings and we make a decision based on logic AND feelings. And the way that works out is that we tend to say things like "oh I know this isnt logical or right for me and the best thing for me to do would be to leave this situation, but I cant because I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I hurt her because it will kill her if I left her." This is the thought I had running through my head for 8 years while dating my ex gf. I know exactly logically what is what, but I make the choice any way. If that's not Fe for example, I don't know what is.

    And you guys picking up on my projecting an image, doesn't mean Si, what it actually is is me protecting myself from everyone around me because my Fe gets me into trouble constantly when I try to fix people and fix things for people because I don't want them to feel bad. This is why I know that dude isnt an INFJ or he is an INFJ who is lying because he has an ends justify the means attitude, which in this case is lying. Because to read the stuff I wrote and say there is no Ni in there is laughable at best.

    ALL INFJs project an image, we project a differnt image to every person we meet based on the person I said this in this very thread.

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