[ENTJ] why the ENTJ hate?!

[WoodsWoman]

My roommate is ENTJ and has a 4.0, which we were both really going for before I got sick. Upon coming back, I wondered for a moment if that 4.0 made him legally a TA, because all I heard out of his mouth was stern advice and instructions to "work hard."

Eventually my ENTP champagne-cork popped and I let my mouth say the meanest things my brain could think of to him. He lasted like eight seconds before saying he was sorry and admitting that he'd been an uptight asshole.

+1 for ENTP

My experience with ENTJ was that they respect those who stand up to them. Good for you.

 

[Aleksei]

So it seems like absolutely everyone on the NT forum is hating on ENTJs like we are hitler.

I've seen some seriously offensive shit here along the lines of
- uninteresting
- not friendly
- controlling
- closed minded

Where is this coming from? Have you met some super assholes in your life that youve labelled as ENTJs? Do you just assume when you see this kind of behaviour that the person is an ENTJ? I seem to find that alot of you describe ENTJs as ESTJs, which is not cool.

Oh and one more thing I see alot of is people saying ENTJs just try to convince others to see things their way. That seems to contradict the most commonly stated ENTJ trait that they constantly seek to take in knowledge and to grow, and that they are extremely interested in other peoples ideas and thoughts.


Stop hating!

I have no idea what you're talking about. I have three very close ENTJ friends, and they're a blast.

 

[MacGuffin]

My experience with ENTJ was that they respect those who stand up to them. Good for you.

Why?

It implies the ENTJ is acting like a bully or at least disingenuously. Respect is then given when they are called on it?

 

[entropie]

With the ENTJs being the leaders, they most of the times have better ressources to counterreact an uprising. Therefore we have to hate and plot in the shadows.

Problem solved, anymore questions ?

 

[WoodsWoman]

Mac - So they are act in these ways - sometimes unconsciously. Most of them are aware of their ability to be overbearing, but not always aware of how they come across to others. They can be intimidating even when they aren't trying to be. My husband had a deep voice - and had been a drill instructor when he was in the military - he could sound mean/angry and not realize it: call him on it and he'd thank you.

 

[Jaguar]

It implies the ENTJ is acting like a bully or at least disingenuously. Respect is then given when they are called on it?

I happen to agree with you.

Anyone who only "respects" someone for "standing up to them" would indeed be a bully.
I respect people who have a creative/innovative mind and operate with integrity. It's that simple for me.
The phrase "standing up to" evokes an image of a barroom brawl with a bunch of drunks.

No thanks.

 

[MacGuffin]

Mac - So they are act in these ways - sometimes unconsciously. Most of them are aware of their ability to be overbearing, but not always aware of how they come across to others. They can be intimidating even when they aren't trying to be. My husband had a deep voice - and had been a drill instructor when he was in the military - he could sound mean/angry and not realize it: call him on it and he'd thank you.

Yeah, but why would respect then follow? Your example of your husband does not seem to be an example of someone challenging him, just that he's getting a bit loud (metaphorically speaking).

I happen to agree with you.

Anyone who only "respects" someone for "standing up to them" would indeed be a bully.
I respect people who have a creative/innovative mind and operate with integrity. It's that simple for me.
The phrase "standing up to" evokes an image of a barroom brawl with a bunch of drunks.

No thanks.

Right. Any good leader/friend/person would not need "standing up to". They would engage the other person and find out what they think/feel before that.

 

[WoodsWoman]

I think we're seeing the phrase "standing up to" a bit differently, though I admit the initial incident here does lean more toward what you seem to be aiming at. Part of what I see 'standing up to them' is using your voice to hold a place in the conversation, a refusal to be ignored. I refer to respect as an alternative to agreement - he might not be won over, but the better reasoning in the background the more respect would be given.

In this case I think there was possibly some immaturity involved from both parties and that both parties seem to have learned something from that incidence and gained a bit of maturity in the process. It required that they BOTH speak up, not just one of them.

I do not agree that any good leader/friend/person would engage the other person to find out what they thought if that other person had yet to express themselves one way or another. Only when an expression (one that had apparently been withheld) of a position can it then be engaged.

 

[FDG]

Why?

It implies the ENTJ is acting like a bully or at least disingenuously. Respect is then given when they are called on it?

Yeah that attitude is totally idiotic. When I meet ENTJs that behaves like that all I want to do is stab him-her in the cerbellum. Although I do have a loud voice and if people think I'm angry because of that...I don't know what to do

 

[Johnfloyd6675]

We hate to be trifled with.

I think, as with ENTP, there's also a strong desire to come across as The Man who you just don't mess with.

I like ENTJs. My MBTI didn't reveal a strong preference for Perception in me, and, to a greater extent than I think many 19-year old male ENTPs, I make an effort to employ Judgement in drawing up long-term plans and in maintaining perspective during disputes, and am getting better every day about ensuring Ti supervision of my Ne monster.

Of course, there is a sort of sworn-enemies, trying-to-look-at-the-other-guy's-dick-in-the-urinal sort of dynamic between these two types. ENTJs obviously Intuit and Think, but they lead with their Te, whereas ENTP is led (at gunpoint) by Ne. This leaves young ENTJs to work hard and play the game better than everybody else in class, except for that one smirking boy who leads class discussions and sets every curve without ever displaying one whit of discipline, sincerity, or work ethic. While ENTJs are battling their political enemies on the Student Council, ENTPs are stockpiling Soviet flags and nerf guns.

That's my high school. Tiny, like, 100 kids, and that picture was taken while everybody inside was taking a science exam. We played the Soviet anthem so fuckin' loudly that our speaker system blew out the school's electric power. Then headmaster came and ate barbecue with us. That's ENTP. And of course, we, or maybe I, wouldn't do things like that if people thought of me as the sort of person to run the Student Council. So ENTJs do inspire envy. But we inspire awe.

 

[ceecee]

Unfortunately, understanding other people is not the ENTJ's strong suit.

It's not your strong suit or you just don't want to make the effort with something so trivial?

 

[Weber]

Mainly jealousy. They are the ultimate leader type, and people who are not confident in themselves obviously envy that quality.

 

[yenom]

Because they are not P.

Mainly jealousy. They are the ultimate leader type, and people who are not confident in themselves obviously envy that quality.

ummm, I can name at least one great leader from history that is not an ENTJ.

 

[StephMC]

I've been best friends with an ENTJ for years. He's a very charismatic, bright, motivated guy. He has a huge social network, and people generally like him when he's in his charming mood. However, I'm one of the few people that is very close to him, mostly because people can't handle large doses of his obnoxiousness. Granted, he had a rough childhood, so he may not be a very "developed" ENTJ. This rarely got to me, however, because well... ISTPs are pretty indifferent to a lot of things. But when ENTJs are in an unhealthy, self-destructive state (which hopefully doesn't happen all that often, if ever), that's when I draw the line. This has been the case for my friend for the past year, and it was a violent, downward cycle. First, the obnoxiousness and his ego increased 10 fold. Next, the way I lived my life and the people in my life was heavily critiqued. Somewhere in there I tried confronting him about his destructive behavior (Something I really don't like to do), and he listened, but did nothing. My patience wore with him and he did one last thing that compromised our friendship. I'm sure we will make amends sometime in the future, but it's nearly impossible right now when everytime I try to explain to him why he upset me somehow it's not his fault but as a result of my own actions. Anyways, I know first hand ENTJs can be charming, wonderful people. But just like everyone else, they have unhealthy behavior. I think EXTJ's unhealthy behavior seems just a little more "In your face" than others, although that's obviously debatable.

 

[eagleseven]

Because ENTJs make dangerous enemies.

 

[surgery]

Mainly jealousy.

cha chinggg

 

[yvonne]

i've become to greatly respect one ENTJ i know. i still don't know this person really well, but so far - awesome!

 

[Tamske]

It's not your strong suit or you just don't want to make the effort with something so trivial?

Trivial???

You just don't want to make the effort to do something trivial like computing the range of a cannon ball, given initial velocity and angle? You may assume there is no air friction.

To me, computing the range of that cannon ball is easier than understanding other people. And I'm not even an ENTJ.

What I want to say is this: what is easy (or even trivial) to you can be really hard to other people. You (general you, everybody does that) forget easily which effort you've needed to learn something once you mastered it.

 

[Hate]

I just found out today that one of my Psyc teachers is ENTJ and she's one of my favorite teachers. I think my perception of ENTJs could change because of her. I think I have a biased towards them because my dads an ENTJ and he's an asshole.

 

[ceecee]

What I want to say is this: what is easy (or even trivial) to you can be really hard to other people. You (general you, everybody does that) forget easily which effort you've needed to learn something once you mastered it.

I never said it wasn't hard, quite the opposite. I just mean not everyone feels it's worth their time and effort to learn. There is a difference between chalking difficulties up to not being ones strong suit and feeling it's unnecessary to master and yes, people could easily see understanding others as trivial. I also hate using type as an excuse for acting like an assclown and way too much of that goes on.