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  1. #1

    Default INTPs at the university

    I'm curious about how some of you older INTPs did in school and what you did immediately afterward. What did you study? Did you find studying to be soul-crushing, as I do? More importantly, do you have any advice on how to deal with this? Did any of you pursue postgraduate study, and how does it compare to being an undergrad?
    Ti = Ne > Fi = Ni > Te = Si > Fe = Se

    "I've never seen a child who didn't want to build something out of blocks, or learn something new, or try the next task. And the only reason why adults aren't like that is, I suppose, that they have been sent to school and other oppressive institutions which have driven that out of them."
    -- Noam Chomsky

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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    I never went to university and not planning to go. I went to vocational school and studied to be machinist. My average was around 2.5(on scale 0-5, 0 being F), because i didnt care about that school and you can get a job with those grades as easy as with better ones. My middleschool average was about same, or bit lower. However i dont do that job enymore and atm i got this trainee job as photographer and ill try to get to photography school next year(again).

    To me studuying something that im not intrested is so boring that its just not worth it.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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    Member brilliantwomble's Avatar
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    I did go to college. I just graduated in May so it hasn't been that long since undergrad. I absolutely detested studying and found most lectures to be awful. There were a few lecture classes that occasionally were decent, but not many. Discussion classes on the other hand were much better--if they people in the classes were competent. As for passing classes, I did quite well really. I mean, I have a great short-term memory so studying right before tests usually worked out great for me. That is pretty much what I did in undergrad.

    Now, for postgrad, I am in medical school where studying is a lot more of a necessity. I am struggling with the studying part, but to combat my natural reluctance to study I try to find ways to make the material interesting. That way I will want to learn it rather than feel forced to learn it. I think that is the key for me. Normally I see it as a waste, but really if you like the subject matter just turn it into a theoretical discussion or a debate or whatever else gets you interested. But if studying isn't necessary to pass or achieve your future goals, go the easy route. Seriously.

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    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    I went to college as well. I eeked by my first two years, making mediocre grades and failing to accomplish much. Then in my last two years I stepped it up because I had some really good classes. The best, as brilliantwomble mentioned, were small discussion classes in the subjects that I enjoyed. The chance to compete verbally and actually talk about interesting things was a big change from the lecture style, which I completely felt it necessary to skip most of the time.

    Anyway, those few good classes inspired me to go to graduate school. Now that I'm here, I find that it's just a lot more work and even fewer interesting discussions. There is at least one good seminar per semester, don't get me wrong, but I still was hoping for more independent learning opportunities. Instead we have to read a whole slew of articles each week and write stupid little papers. I get through it by reminding myself that, if I were doing this activity on my own, I'd like it. Then I just pretend like that's the case and get on with it.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brilliantwomble View Post
    I mean, I have a great short-term memory so studying right before tests usually worked out great for me.
    Are you sure your talking about short-term memory? Short-term memory can hold about 4 to 9 items at the time and not for long time(i think something like 5 to 10 minutes).
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  6. #6
    Senior Member Nighthawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forgetful Functor View Post
    I'm curious about how some of you older INTPs did in school and what you did immediately afterward. What did you study? Did you find studying to be soul-crushing, as I do? More importantly, do you have any advice on how to deal with this? Did any of you pursue postgraduate study, and how does it compare to being an undergrad?
    I went to a military school for undergrad studies. Would not recommend that for an INTP. I studied weapons systems engineering there, with a some side studies in German and military history. My career after that was as an Army officer. I didn't use much of my degree (aside from military history), as officers are mostly managers and not doers ... unless you get into specialized fields. Over time, I found that I did not like management in general, or the Army in particular, so I eventually decided to get out and change careers.

    I then went to grad school for a degree in computer science, and began working as a software engineer thereafter. Unlike my undergrad degree, I make a lot of use of what I learned in grad school for this profession.

    As for studying, I did find it to be a bit soul-crushing during the undergrad years. The high schoool I attended in West Texas did not prepare me at all for college at an East Coast institution ... so I had to play a lot of catch-up. I did not do well freshman year and almost failed out. Also, I was forced to study a wide array of subjects that were not necessarily in my field of interest. It basically took a lot of drive and will power, along with some degree of rote memorization. I performed much better academically during upper level studies my junior and senior years. I cannot stress enough how critical a good secondary education foundation is to progressing into college.

    Grad school was a horse of a different shade. I enjoyed it immensely and did very well. The major contributing factor was that all courses were in my field of interest. Also, I decided to go to school full time rather than work and attend school part time ... although I did work as a teaching/research assistant soon after starting. I'm not saying the subject matter was a breeze, but I enjoyed studying it so much that it was never really a chore. I was 30 when I started grad school, so perhaps I'd gained some maturity since my undergrad years ... along with a new perspective on life after being in the military. I was also paying for it myself, so I had increased interest in doing well.

    Hope you find what you're looking for with respect to education. I've found it to be of great help to me.

  7. #7
    Member brilliantwomble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Are you sure your talking about short-term memory? Short-term memory can hold about 4 to 9 items at the time and not for long time(i think something like 5 to 10 minutes).
    Relative short-term memory. For nonsense material, yes, short-term memory is relatively short (less than an hour for sure.) But for learned material that makes sense, retention time is definitely longer than a few minutes. We did a test recently here at my medical school on retention times for learned material after seeing it once (so basically you study it and then put the material away and don't look at it again.) There was pre-test to set up baseline learning (basically just making sure you actually did learn the material) and then quizzes over the material given at 8 hour intervals after that. Normally people begin to forget the material in a matter of hours, but each person has a different retention rate for learned material. Of course reviewing this material helps to store it in long term memory versus relative short term.

    So having a good relative short term memory process would allow someone to do better on a test within 24 hours (why cramming can work for a test, but not necessarily for long term understanding.) Those with shorter retention rates are encouraged to review the material several times in order to learn it better and remember more of it. So, yes, actual short term memory for random information is quite short. But for test material and the like that has some order or sense to it, retention time can be much longer.

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    Senior Member Works's Avatar
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    I did well in school. I made studying a game. I tried to study the least amount of time to achieve the grade I wanted. I graduated with a 3.79 so it worked pretty well for me. Some of my non-intp friends studied all the damn time and it never seemed as though they had any fun.

    Now, I teach middle school English. It's fairly enjoyable even if it seems like an odd choice for an introvert.

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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brilliantwomble View Post
    Relative short-term memory. For nonsense material, yes, short-term memory is relatively short (less than an hour for sure.) But for learned material that makes sense, retention time is definitely longer than a few minutes. We did a test recently here at my medical school on retention times for learned material after seeing it once (so basically you study it and then put the material away and don't look at it again.) There was pre-test to set up baseline learning (basically just making sure you actually did learn the material) and then quizzes over the material given at 8 hour intervals after that. Normally people begin to forget the material in a matter of hours, but each person has a different retention rate for learned material. Of course reviewing this material helps to store it in long term memory versus relative short term.

    So having a good relative short term memory process would allow someone to do better on a test within 24 hours (why cramming can work for a test, but not necessarily for long term understanding.) Those with shorter retention rates are encouraged to review the material several times in order to learn it better and remember more of it. So, yes, actual short term memory for random information is quite short. But for test material and the like that has some order or sense to it, retention time can be much longer.
    Ehh, you dont know what short-term memory is..

    A popular example of short-term memory is the ability to remember a seven-digit telephone number just long enough to dial a call. In most cases, unless the number is consciously repeated several times, it will be forgotten.
    Addition to this is that when you repeat the number enough times(so that you remember it after putting other numbers, words or basicly enything that you think or see to short-term memory) it goes to long-term memory. Short-term memory is like computer ram, it gets overwritten all the time and when it gets overwritten those memories go to long-term memory. And how long they stay in long-term memory depends on your memory skills and importance of the learned things.

    I dont know what relative short-term memory is and neither does google. I think its something that you made up to explain short memories in the long-term memory.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  10. #10
    Member brilliantwomble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Addition to this is that when you repeat the number enough times(so that you remember it after putting other numbers, words or basicly enything that you think or see to short-term memory) it goes to long-term memory. Short-term memory is like computer ram, it gets overwritten all the time and when it gets overwritten those memories go to long-term memory. And how long they stay in long-term memory depends on your memory skills and importance of the learned things.

    I dont know what relative short-term memory is and neither does google. I think its something that you made up to explain short memories in the long-term memory.
    Thank you for being my source of enlightenment.

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