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  1. #21
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thisGuy View Post
    that means people using Fe in everyday life are scarce in that the majority of the population fails to recognize it correctly and presumes it to be fake sincerity
    With most SFJs, who take the "concrete", S approach, it's easier to see their behavior as truly sincere. They live much more in the moment.

    When it comes to NFJs though, there's that abstract N element of reading and writing between the lines, so most actions seem to have a less direct intent. Which is what manipulation is all about I guess. Ni is all about the future and Fe about "harmonizing"...

  2. #22
    Reptilian Snuggletron's Avatar
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    I have an ENTP friend who doesn't manipulate others, because he's not a douchebag. Whether he can and just holds back is anyone's guess.

  3. #23
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    I have been accused of being manipulative by various people by how I did something, but I have always been upfront about what I'm doing and why. One thing I have noticed is that if you do know something about someone/project/subject and you let on that you know...a lot of people make you responsible for that, since you know XX than you're supposed to react and act the way that person would want you to XX, since you know it you should know what else they want. If you react differently, than you did it on purpose and were manipulative since you knew about XX in the first place than you should be able to read minds to know what they would've like you to do about it.

  4. #24
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    I am manipulating myself on a daily basis. Last time I had the fun to write a list on what I did want to do in the morning and then left the list in my house and read it when I came home in the evening.

    It was amazing what I read there, would have never thought about it
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  5. #25
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    ENTP's ARE the most manipulative of the types. They claim they aren't because they don't have a well-developed F, so they have no idea that there's any alternative. It's like a game to them. They read people easily and then they give them exactly what they expect. People love them for this. But ENTP's are not really giving types ultimately. This is what gets them labelled manipulative. They seem to be giving you everything you want on the outside, but on the inside? They're out for themselves. And I write all of this with great respect for ENTP's. There are other, much stronger facets to ENTP's, but way too much of the time this superficiality is all that people see.

  6. #26
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    You think an entp could learn to change that over the course of their lifes ?

    It's a 100% true, I am actually not intrested in the daily life of my INFJ and I never ask about it. I figured that out on my own, without her having complaining about it, I just dont want to loose her and tho I dont understand this whole emotional thing really, I notice my mindly detached nature.

    Do you think, if its not possible to learn, that it is possible to at least compensate for it in other fields of affection. I do love her very much and I tend to express it not with words, I like all that stuff from cuddling to kissing and that I care a great a deal about. Do you think that suffices or are you convinced it will not, she will be unhappy ultimatelly if not attended to holistically.

    You know my greatest problem is, I never have an idea about what I actually can do right. The thing with being a con man with people I know already and the thing with only being infatuated with myself I know too. But facts say, after 4 years of relationship, there must be something she sees in me and I want to see that too. Cause if I do, I am convinced a lot of things will be easier in my train of thoughts in the light of this conversation.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  7. #27
    Senior Member SerengetiBetty's Avatar
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    ENTPs would be awesome manipulators and puppet masters IF we were able to follow through on projects until the end. I don't know if I would consider a quarter completed manipulation as a true manipulation

  8. #28

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    I LOVE MANIPULATING.... but then I get bored....

  9. #29
    Senior Member epp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lily Bart View Post
    They read people easily and then they give them exactly what they expect.
    well, I think it's the first time in history that giving someone what the other one needs on a basic level (e.g. security) and staying true to one's own at the same time is considered BAD or manipulative somehow...

    I mean - so far communication psychology has been exactly about that... but I guess, we're all witnessing a breakthrough in that science here in this forum right now... how cool is that!

  10. #30
    Member ilovetrannies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by epp View Post
    I CAN be manipulative, I'm actually very good at it, but I hate it.

    I don't do emotional manipulation (meaning crying or getting on other person's nerves to get what I want), no. it's more like... for some reason I can really see "through" most people, as people are so easy to read and most of them are very VERY automatic indeed. they behave in certain patterns, they blab about themselves all the time - and they are not even aware of it themselves!!!

    it actually takes only half an hour max to see what makes them tick, what are their weak spots etc. so basically it's possible to manipulate people by "clicking" only so very lightly on those... needs and emotions.

    e.g. when someone's basic and first need is to feel important then my manipulation would be to hint only very lightly and very calmly that i don't really admit their superiority... and stick to it (this is the important part!)

    there is absolutely no need to do anything more as given person will do anything to prove that he IS important and should be respected. and he WILL continue, going to extremes and be ridiculous...

    until he realizes that himself
    and understands that BY making himself so ridiculous he himself has actually PROVEN to me that he really can't be respected...

    after that he will do anything you ask and/or run when he sees so much as your shadow. but he will never ever try to f... with you again...

    it's like a front-row ticket to a circus... watch and learn how a human being is going to make a complete and utter fool of himself.

    beauty!

    I only do something like that when someone has really done me wrong (e.g. my former boss who wasn't going to pay me the money I had earned honestly!!!)
    I really really hate it because I hate to see that people are so EASY to read. I hate that I know exactly how to hurt someone.
    I hate that I don't even have to strain myself to do something like that. it's just SO. FUCKING. EASY. it's not even funny!!!

    I've also realized that's the main reason why I haven't really wanted to live with any guy so far... because I've seen them through and I have known I COULD manipulate them any time... and that's not equity...
    SO. FUCKING. EASY. At hurting people? What the Fuck? How do you ENTP's sleep at night? If someone pissed me off, I'd tell them fuck to off and then I leave. It's not a big deal. I have to put up with stupid, evil, rude people everyday but I pretend not to care and try not to say anything or play dumb, which ever comes first.
    Last edited by Kasper; 10-05-2009 at 04:23 AM. Reason: fix quote

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