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  1. #41
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    That is pretty interesting to me how your Se is fairly developed, but I had a hunch your Ne score is higher than Se. Personally my Ni far exceeds my Si whenever I take those tests. Those tests tend to test for the first letter more than the E/I aspect of it. I.e. an INTJ is Ni dominant, so they will show up with a decently high Ne. The Ne dominant ENTP will show up with a decently high Ni, higher than Si at any rate.

    By the same reasoning an INFP will usually show with a higher Fe than Te, and an INTP will usually register a higher Te than Fe. What I'm getting at is I think the tests slightly favor INFP for Pheonix_400. However the results are so close it's more accurate to say the tests are inconclusive.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member Phoenix_400's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    I have nothing to say about my Si except it's taking me weeks to memorize a few basic facts about triangles and whether 0 is an even or odd number, etc. I can always work it out when I think it through, but there's no time on the GRE--you just gotta know and I am about ready to bang my head against the Kaplan book.
    I understand how you feel. I can memorize formulas but can't crunch the numbers. Numbers switch places on me when I'm doing math. I fail at basic arithmetic because of this. Also horrible with memorizing names and history dates as well.
    Good Luck with it. You'll get it if you put the effort in.

    You're probably going to have to dig deeper into MBTI/Jungian Theory in order to figure out which type you identify more with.
    Any good books I can start with? I've found a couple I'm thinking about picking up but if you or anyone else can recommend some specific titles, I would appreciate it greatly.

    What I'm getting at is I think the tests slightly favor INFP for Pheonix_400. However the results are so close it's more accurate to say the tests are inconclusive.
    So....INxP until I got the spare dime to drop on the STEP II test and a few books on the subject? Yeah, I'll go with that

  3. #43
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I meant to post earlier.

    I am in no way a J; but in many of my tests I score high in Ni and Fe, I really like and can identify with INFJs (despite the self-protective measures many undertake), and when I take tests about "what type you are versus what you want to be" I come up with INFJ as the type I end up trying to portray. It's sort of funny. I was always attracted to INFJs as friends as well and felt a lot of empathy with them.

    I think it's more the function use emulation than anything. It's just that I can write INFJ away, off the bat, because I am just so NOT J, it's rather pathetic.

    I also class as 5w4 (only a few points less for 4 than for 5) and INFJs can score as Fours.


    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix_400 View Post
    I'm a slob at home. Everything is an organized mess. Completely chaotic to the outsider, but I know (at least generally) where everything is. There's piles of crap everywhere around here though. At work, I can get obsessed with organization. A place for everything and everything in its place. There has to be a better way to arrange this to make things easier to get to.
    Sounds more like P organization in practice, but I know INFJs who are slobs at home and orderly elsewhere.

    What would you prefer, if you could?

    I forget things. I have auto-pay set up on most of my bills. If I don't, I'll forget to pay them. The bill gets set off to the side, stuff gets piled on top, and it ceases to exist until I come home and power is turned off (that happened twice last year 'til I came up with a way to remember).
    Could be an N thing (versus S). J gets closure in things that are important to it. More likely for P to forget things like this than J, but when you compare ITP to IFJ for N types, well both include some "fuzzy functions" that could lead to ignore physical reality for the internal world.

    Overly emotional people piss me off. If you come to me for advice, listen to what I have to say. I've had several friends in the past who would take the first emotion they felt in a situation and run with it, no rhyme or REASON in it. We can't help how feel about something or somebody, but we can choose how we react to those feelings. THINK before you ACT!
    I see this reaction as common for INFJ and INTP. Ni+Ti and Ti+Ne both have this as a trademark. Even Fe isn't really excited about people just doing stupid emotional things, it's the Se/Ne + Fi people that really react outwardly on an emotional level as a trademark move. Both INTP and INFJ control their emotions; INTP does it because it's trying to intellectualize the emotions and feels completely out of sorts with experiencing them (i.e., being incompetent), INFJ does it more directly as a means of avoiding getting hurt.

    I don't like people. A person can be smart, but people are stupid. If I see somebody suffering, my heart goes out to them, but unless they're close to me I don't really want to get involved. I don't care what others think of me. Their opinion doesn't matter. On the flip side, If you're in my inner circle, I'm constantly worried about how you view me.
    Again, both INTP and INFJ have self-protective mechanisms. They can dismiss people who 'don't matter,' but for people who do matter? INTP is probably more apt to worry about losing resources and freedom if they displease those around them, INFJ is more worried about losing love and self-respect... but just guessing there.

    I'm usually considered a ghost or a hermit to my friends. Even though I think the world of them and enjoy spending time with them, I'll still drop off the planet sometimes. In the old days, my friends didn't consider it odd to go 2 weeks without hearing from me. Nowadays, the friends I have get a little worried about me if I do that. I'm not really used to that.
    Again, INTPs do this naturally... more apt to be lost in their little world. INFJs do it more as a means of keeping a safe buffer there, to not get over-attached and thus vulnerable unless a strong commitment has been made and the person is trustworthy in practice.

    I think my biggest hurdle is a physical affection barrier I have. I "talk" my emotions, I don't really "express" them in the normal sense. I'm not comfortable with people touching me. Growing up I got a lot more "hard" touch than "soft" touch. I can take a punch, slap, poke, kick and not think anything of it. A hug is just kinda weird to me. When somebody does touch me, I'm kinda...I dunno, hyper-aware or hyper-sensitive, I can kinda feel them when they're still a couple of inches away from actual contact. Touch=Trust to me. The more comfortable I am with someone touching me, the more it means I trust them.
    Again, both can be issues... usually for the INTP, it's fearing a loss of freedom and mobility (emotionally and physically), INFJ might feel invaded on a personal level. If you let someone into your space, you suddenly have to accommodate them as well as a heightened sense of vulnerability. I don't really sense the same issues with INFP (which seems to often handle the warmth okay, although sometimes not) or INTJ (which just either avoids it altogether and is fine with not having it, or else putting bounds on it so it's never in danger of getting out of control).

    When I do express, its not usually obvious. If I actually initiate physical contact with someone it means they're in my inner circle. Even with those closest to me its hard to initiate though even when I really want to. I'm more subdued about things when I do. I've got this weird head pat/hair-ruffle that's my equivalent to a hug.
    I like to run my hand through someone's hair tenderly, or along a shoulder, or almost do the "FaceOff" trademark move... it depends on the depth of the relationship.

    I do do hugs nowadays though, and like them.

    The thing is that these are not my raw responses. Physical affection for me was years in the making, and just because I can do it now with ease and without fear is no indication of how hard it was for me twenty years ago. That's the problem sometimes when people get more well-rounded, in regards to determining type. We change, and part of positive growth is getting better at things that are not naturally us.

    I've been told I don't give a lot of visual cues when something is bothering me. I find this to be true. I feel I've got a level of self-control that's oftentimes bordering on unhealthy.
    Totally the same here. My pulse never goes up, my breathing never changes, I talk in the same casual voice... but inside I might be ready to scream, flee, or black out from anxiety. I told someone I was mad at them the other night because I felt like they dumped a bunch of crap on me, and yet I just did what was best in the situation, and they said they couldn't even tell I was mad; that was because people do not get to see my emotions unless I decide to allow my body to show them. It's mostly a self-protective measure; emotions can be dangerous (because they might trigger uncontrollable responses in other people), and because they reveal one's feelings and then you can be vulnerable.

    INTP and INFJ are both pretty renown for their ability to not reveal emotion when they want to cloak it.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #44
    Senior Member Phoenix_400's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Sounds more like P organization in practice, but I know INFJs who are slobs at home and orderly elsewhere.

    What would you prefer, if you could?
    I think I would prefer to be more organized in my home life. I've been coming into a "settling down" phase in my life that's completely thrown me off the "pick up and go whenever I want" mentality I've always had. Being organized would be better for having a real home and a family around.

    I see this reaction as common for INFJ and INTP. Ni+Ti and Ti+Ne both have this as a trademark. Even Fe isn't really excited about people just doing stupid emotional things, it's the Se/Ne + Fi people that really react outwardly on an emotional level as a trademark move. Both INTP and INFJ control their emotions; INTP does it because it's trying to intellectualize the emotions and feels completely out of sorts with experiencing them (i.e., being incompetent), INFJ does it more directly as a means of avoiding getting hurt.
    I kind of go both ways on this. I think the big thing for me is trying not to get hurt. It does take me some time to sort out exactly how I'm feeling and I'm a mess until then, but once I know how I feel I'll put those feelings on lock-down if I know it will cause me a lot of grief that I can otherwise avoid. If I come to the conclusion that I'm gonna get hurt either way, all bets are off.


    Again, both INTP and INFJ have self-protective mechanisms. They can dismiss people who 'don't matter,' but for people who do matter? INTP is probably more apt to worry about losing resources and freedom if they displease those around them, INFJ is more worried about losing love and self-respect... but just guessing there.
    I'm more worried about losing the respect of someone I care about. I hate feeling like I've let someone close to me down. If its someone I don't really care about or a friend who's crossed the line and ruined the friendship (but hasn't set me off to the point of total disgust), I'll stay friendly just because they may prove useful to me later. Horrible, I know. I guess sometimes I'm just an opportunist.

    Again, both can be issues... usually for the INTP, it's fearing a loss of freedom and mobility (emotionally and physically), INFJ might feel invaded on a personal level. If you let someone into your space, you suddenly have to accommodate them as well as a heightened sense of vulnerability. I don't really sense the same issues with INFP (which seems to often handle the warmth okay, although sometimes not) or INTJ (which just either avoids it altogether and is fine with not having it, or else putting bounds on it so it's never in danger of getting out of control).
    I suppose in the past its been a matter of me losing my freedom to an extent. I've always been kinda the loner, go-my-own-way type and didn't want to be tied down. Its why I've tried to maintain a level of detachment with people.
    The vulnerability thing is definitely an underlying issue though. I keep expecting a nice hug or kind gesture to turn into something painful. Its almost like being set-up for a prank. It makes me jumpy. Its part of why I move towards the outskirts of a crowd. I don't like people standing behind me if they're not someone I trust.

    The thing is that these are not my raw responses. Physical affection for me was years in the making, and just because I can do it now with ease and without fear is no indication of how hard it was for me twenty years ago. That's the problem sometimes when people get more well-rounded, in regards to determining type. We change, and part of positive growth is getting better at things that are not naturally us.
    I kind of went the opposite way. Reaching out, making physical contact with someone, is my first instinct. Especially if the person is in pain. Most of my family has a problem with touch though. I have a couple of family members (bi-polar, never knew how they would react) that I would reach out to hug when they were in a bad way and I'd get swung at for my efforts. I learned that just because it feels like the right thing to do, it can actually cause more harm than good to the person you're trying to help. Its gotten me to the point that I automatically resist the instinct and approach very cautiously...if at all.



    It's mostly a self-protective measure; emotions can be dangerous (because they might trigger uncontrollable responses in other people)
    See above. It took me ducking a couple of unexpected swings and a couple of bites before I learned my lesson.

    and because they reveal one's feelings and then you can be vulnerable.
    I actually had this conversation with a friend a while back. I'll share my opinion with anybody. You can't hurt me with that. If I give my opinion, there's only a few things that can happen:
    1. I'm gonna bring you around to my way of thinking
    2. You're gonna bring me around to your way of thinking.
    3. We're going to agree to disagree on the subject
    4. You're gonna get PO'ed at me and storm off.
    5. I'm gonna get fed up, call you an idiot and a waste of my time, and storm off.

    I won't go in-depth about my true feelings on something though. Emotions are dangerous. If somebody knows how you feel about something, they can hurt you with it. It takes a long time or a lot of effort to get that kind of trust out of me.

    Being behind the keyboard offers me a level of protection I don't have in real life. I can be more open here. If somebody sets me off, all I have to do is ignore them or I can delete my account and move onto another place here in the great digital range.

  5. #45
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    jennifer's response is definitely getting at some of the differences in infj and intp. i'm a 5w4 infj and i thought i was an intp at first (which is why i brought it up in the other thread). infj 5w4s often use Ti at an earlier age than Fe, which throws them outta whack. i identified as NiTi at first when i joined this forum last february.

    infjs use way more Fe, and we use Ni to get at things in a different way than intps use Ti to get at things. they see farther down a specific line, they see a thought and take it to its inevitable conclusion. we grasp the way it is related to other possibilities in a more holistic way, we use Ti more to get back on track when healthy (otherwise it easily becomes self-justifying). Ni sees into things, Ti judges what will work. we both look pretty fucking disorganized bc we are both in love with learning (the curse of the 5).

    my intp friends tell me stories, create histories, etc. i get at the essence of things (which means nothing but that perception is everything to me, sensing relationality and potential/possibility is more important than constructing a single truth). our web diagramming software is drastically different.

    infjs re-frame, re-frame, and re-frame some more. we say the same thing in slightly different ways to activate and emphasize different articulations, melodies, patterns, harmonics-resonances. intps want find the one they like, keep raising objections, keep critiquing, etc until they have something that can go the distance. infj is always a little more zen than that (when it is flowing smoothly). N doms are different than T/F doms, ixxp and exxj are j doms and ixxj and exxp are p doms, even tho ixxj judgment is usually more expressed/articulated/visible/externalized in the world of e.

    all introverts do get tired of external stimulation bc they spend so much time following the current of their own thoughts. but introverted perceivers like Ni or Si are more likely to shut down when they can't process what is going on especially when they are Fe and the atmosphere starts getting poisonous.

    infp could certainly be possible too. there are a few infps on this forum that i absolutely thought were infjs, who were in fact infps. the enneagram similarities/samenesses can make these things confusing, people can be of different types and still have very very similar projects in life.

    my read so far just screamed Fe when i read your posts. intps are usually quite brash when they know they are right (which they know often even when they are wrong). whereas infjs are more stubborn when they know ... yada yada etc.

  6. #46
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    I always have to think of me and how I quantified human relations before I got to know a completly different world from my infj.

    It's hard to tell, if the OP is possible, really hard to tell
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  7. #47
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    My brother is also a weird INTP/INFJ hybrid. His cognitive functions tests all over the place too.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Phoenix_400's Avatar
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    Default Hindsight's 20/20

    Looking back through this whole thread, I think the only thing definitive I can see is that my formative years may have screwed me up a lot worse than I thought.

    I've been trying to be honest and answer off the first things that pop into my head, rather than over-analyzing the crap out of my responses before I post. My true thoughts and feelings unfiltered. Its amazing how much comes to light when seeing it all written down. I've always made cynical little jokes about all this as a coping mechanism. My self-depreciating sense of humor. I think I've been hiding a lot more hurt than I was willing to let even myself see.

    LMAO! I'd consider going to see a therapist at this point, but the last thing I need is OFFICIAL word that I'm crazy.

    I'm going with INxP for now. Keep the responses coming folks. I'm still looking for my epiphany.

  9. #49
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    Unhappy im sort of in the same boat

    hi i came upon this site looking for something on INFJ with INTP tendencies and ended up finding this forum. Usually when i see someone with a problem that i can help with on these forums i get the strong urge to register just to help them out, but i think up reasons opposing that are usually just enough to deter me from doing so, but this time i just couldn't resist, mostly because the other side of the argument (with myself, don't ask)had the argument that i could also figure out something about my personality here.

    The way i see it even if the personality type of two people are the same they will not come out the same way, many different factors also affect the personality of an individual, they may have started the emotional type but were hardened by abuse a now go towards what they consider a more realistic point of view and like you I've also had more hard buns than soft buns in my life and even if two people were abused the same amount i think they would still come out at least a little different depending on how they handled the abuse, which is why to an extent i feel the human personality cannot be categorized for what it is because it cannot be fully understood
    (i myself cannot fully understand how a man can win the lottery and give it away and cannot even begin to comprehend how someone can kidnap a child, abuse them, and kill them when they're finished as if they nothing more but a play toy.)

    well maybe i am simply wasting your time, after all im only 16 what would i know about this that you didn't already figure out? but any who writing this alone has helped me a bit and if i wasted your time in writing this then I'm sorry

    p.s (in a way the reason your trying to figure this out maybe a hint as to which you are more of- INFJ would most likely look for the answer in order to understand themselves better as a INTP might look for this answer because they may feel frustrated at the lack of an actual answer or they see it as a sort of puzzle need solving [in my case it is both.])

    hope you find an answer to your question, ill continue to lurk this forum to see if ill get any ideas about my personality.

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