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  1. #21
    Listening Oaky's Avatar
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    I shall be boring and quote sources
    This is for understanding the Fi
    As a Tertiary Function, Fi typically leads ITJs to retreat into solitary actions that have no constructive worldly effect but are aimed at providing a justification for calling themselves good people. Another example is obsession with the purity of one's soul. For example, being a vegetarian while working at Taco Bell--not out of any great love for animals (the person might hardly know anything about what cows are like), but to be able to say, "Well, at least I never ate any animals." Or engaging in pointless acts of honor, like maintaining super-self-control or "doing one's duty" or going down with the ship. Nothing is gained by going down with the ship; it's a hyper-introverted act aimed at providing a rationalization for one's goodness without regard to real-world consequences. Nearly all of these tertiary-Fi acts involve refraining from action viewed as unethical rather than taking positive action that would accomplish something. They're a retreat from the world--or rather, a rationalization for disregarding worldly matters.


    As an Inferior Function, Fi typically leads ETJs to acts of self-destructive hedonism, creation of opera-like drama in their lives and the lives of those around them, obsession with "integrity" (like going down with the ship), instant and irresponsible abandonment of anything they don't like (the opposite of going down with the ship), and bizarre solitary acts of atonement for the harms they've done to others. Sometimes inferior-Fi leads ETJs to preach and even practice a sort of hyper-selfishness, e.g. Ayn Rand and the Landmark Forum. "I'm doing fine, so why should I give a damn about you?" (Very different from highly developed Fi, which leads you to see all people as connected and the highest joy of life as the experience of that connection.)

  2. #22
    Senior Member BlahBlahNounBlah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragingkatsuki View Post
    Very different from highly developed Fi, which leads you to see all people as connected and the highest joy of life as the experience of that connection.

    But I also think all people are connected and there's joy in experiencing that connection (in theory). Is the "in theory" part what makes me not an Fi?

  3. #23
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragingkatsuki View Post
    Nearly all of these tertiary-Fi acts involve refraining from action viewed as unethical rather than taking positive action that would accomplish something. They're a retreat from the world--or rather, a rationalization for disregarding worldly matters.
    Funny... I think we came to the opposite conclusion in the other thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Oh! Okay, I get it. For INTJs, moral codes are about performing actions that produce positive results, whereas for me a moral code is about avoiding actions that produce negative results. Basically, I consider inaction to be inherently more moral than action (thus an action is something that can be immoral, while failing to act isn't), whereas INTJs seem to have the opposite prejudice.
    Quote Originally Posted by poppy View Post
    Yes, you got it. Though your view of morality as being about avoiding negative results is absolutely alien to me. Failure to act seems quite immoral to me (in many situations). We are clearly on very different sides of a divide there.
    Weird.

  4. #24
    Senior Member BlahBlahNounBlah's Avatar
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    ^^^ I think morality is relative. Inaction can cause as much harm as action and vice versa, so they're all the same to me. It's important to be aware of when each is necessary.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlahBlahNounBlah View Post
    Would Fi mean you care that Woody Allen married his daughter? Or would Fe care about that? Or would they care for different reasons? (Fe because it's considered destructive to society? Fi because ...?
    It doesn't sit right with you? It feels wrong. Internal moral compass, that sort of thing.

    I think you got Fe right.

  6. #26
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I'm not so sure that's Fi. I have a similar thing, where I get mad if someone starts talking about a person I really hate. I'll go "Don't even mention that name around me! Do you know what they did to me? Well, let me tell you..." There's a chance I might go on a tirade about everything I hate about that person at that point. They usually don't mention the person again after that.

    I usually don't get disgusted by things so much, though it can grate on my nerves if people continually talk about sex, bodily humor, and other gross/crude things. Once or twice isn't a big deal, but if they keep at it, it can get old fast. It's because I'm annoyed by the inappropriate behavior and accompanying attitude rather than actual disgust, though. I don't feel a visceral response in my gut or anything.
    It is Fi all right. A key is a counter lock.

    In a dichotomy there is the agent and the object.
    A dichotomy manifests in the framework of a counter dichotomy only.
    IFP = Fi Ne; Fi Se.
    IFJ = Ni Fe; Si Fe.

    A paradox is not the alternative to reason.
    It is the alternative to dogma.

  7. #27
    Senior Member Ace_'s Avatar
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    I can only describe my Fi.

    I tolerate people until the final drop. When they reach that point of no return they are crossed off and they no longer exist in my life. I know that these people are wrong and that interaction between us will never bring anything good. It's a strong conviction and I give them no second chance.

    I believe feelings are something sacred which should be hidden until there's a perfect moment to express them. And they always have to be 100% true and genuine. I have a fear of expressing them because I'm very sensitive about it appearing sappy and superficial, or even worse, getting rejected or not receiving the appropriate response. ESFJs sometimes make me sick because of their fake and excessive Fe. There's a perfect word in my language for it but I don't know if there's an English word for it.

    To people with Ti, Te seems superficial. It's the same with Fi users, Fe just doesn't seem as deep as Fi.

    I also believe that emotions should be controlled and I'm a master of controlling my emotional responses. But that's because Fi is my 4th function.

  8. #28
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    I liked those two descriptions:

    Extraverted Feeling

    Introverted Feeling

    What I found intresting is how they phrased the description of Fe:

    p. 40: "When we use Feeling in an Extraverted way, it facilitates a complex social vocabulary, by which we express and recognize the values we hold in common with others."

    p. 318: "...organizing data by relatedness to ourselves."

    p. 318: "Extraverted Feeling is conceptual and analytic. It encourages us to make rational choices, to measure our options for relationship against an external standard of behaviors. What distinguishes this function from Extraverted Thinking is the fact that relatedness involves human beings, not impersonal abstractions."
    That gave me the idea that for example having high morales about some things, mustnt be a certain indicator for someone to be a NF or SJ for example. It is tho, after that description, possibly an indicator for Fe.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  9. #29
    Widdles in your cream.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Here's what I've seen.

    INTP, inferior Fe:

    1. A sudden need for emotional support under extreme stress.
    2. Building frustration finally erupting in a virulent personal attack.
    3. A tendency to assume that other people's personal opinions/rules of etiquette are meant to eliminate/devalue independent thought.

    Those are my guesses, anyway...
    1. True. During exam and coursework season, my stress led me to impulsively initiate a meet up with a group of friends I hadn't spoken to in a year. During this time I had a sudden demand for acceptance in an online community I've been a member of for 3 years. I also wanted to spend a lot more time with my parents than usual.

    2. I'm not sure about this one. This may be due to the fact that it's been years since I've felt strong negative emotions against another person. My dad is an INTP however, and he has problems with displacing negative emotions on other people.

    3. My friends want me to join Facebook. This may sound pathetic and irrational, but I strongly refuse because I feel they just want to keep track of my life, so I have no privacy of my own. And then there's the whole, "I don't want to do it because everyone else is doing it" thing.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Ace_'s Avatar
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    Fe users are the people who preach about morals. Fi users realize that morals are relative.

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