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  1. #21
    Senior Member Argus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poppy View Post
    And less likely to involve catching anything nasty.
    That assumes I'm having sex with SP's.

  2. #22
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinkerbell View Post
    Lets be honest here, ENTP's are no angels at giving respect and SJ's want to be respectable people.... It's like we offend their new world older thinking...
    perhaps true to some extent, though I'd refine that a bit by theorizing that it's not so much that we don't give respect, but more that the ways in which we do that perhaps don't produce the outward signs that they're looking for - chiefly, deference.

    For me, respect and deference are two different things, and they don't automatically go together. I have other ways of showing respect, but if you're just expecting deference and obsessed with its absence, you're not likely to notice how I am showing respect to you.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinkerbell View Post
    Lets be honest here, ENTP's are no angels at giving respect and SJ's want to be respectable people.... It's like we offend their new world older thinking...
    that makes sense. one of the ESTJs in question, the meaner one, seems to think the ENTP is being rude somehow. I've never noticed it myself. Could it be possible that my friend's attempt at joking could somehow be perceived as insults? I usually give a disclaimer to people when we first meet that I'll probably unintentionally insult them somehow (like saying that i hope they didn't paint their living room red because it makes your blood pressure rise and hungry and that's why fast food restaraunts use red on their signs only to find out they did in fact paint their living room that color) and to let me know so I can apologize. People usuall find this confusing but don't argue with it. It's not that I am concerned for their feelings. I just find life goes smoother the less people I have pissed at me.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    perhaps true to some extent, though I'd refine that a bit by theorizing that it's not so much that we don't give respect, but more that the ways in which we do that perhaps don't produce the outward signs that they're looking for - chiefly, deference.

    For me, respect and deference are two different things, and they don't automatically go together. I have other ways of showing respect, but if you're just expecting deference and obsessed with its absence, you're not likely to notice how I am showing respect to you.
    Another good point, or at least one I really like.

  5. #25
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corey_vann View Post
    I just find life goes smoother the less people I have pissed at me.
    that's the kind of pragmatic, strategic thinking that my artificially elevated Te has enabled in me since my late 20's
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  6. #26
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    that's the kind of pragmatic, strategic thinking that my artificially elevated Te has enabled in me since my late 20's
    + your not wet all day
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  7. #27
    Alexander the Terrible yenom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corey_vann View Post
    I have a friend who is an ENTP who seems to not get any respect, especially from a couple of ESTJs we know. At first I wasn't sure what to make of him, but over the past year of getting to know eachother I've learned he's a really nice/good guy. What I don't understand is why people get so down on him. As far as I can tell he doesn't do anything wrong, but he seems to be the defacto-whipping boy of this group of people. What's worse is that the previously mentioned ESTJs, one more than the other, are openly and unnecessarily critical, rude, and all around mean to him. I'm not a big fan of ESTJs to begin with, and I get that he's an easy target, but this is ridiculous! Have any ENTPs had similar experiences with ESTJs and other temperments and how did you deal with it? Has anyone seen this kind of behavior before and how was it dealt with?

    (1)Your friend does not know how to stand up for himself
    (2) He's hanging around the wrong group of people who tried to demolish his self-esteem
    (3) He is a maschoist for satsifying the above 2 conditions

    To stand up for yourself is simple, learn martial arts and boxing or other aggressive sport, or any other sport than involved alot of Se.(I think the development of Se in entps is very important)

    He is being bullied because he made himself into a target.
    The fear of poverty turns people into slaves of money.

    "In this Caesar there are many Mariuses"~Sulla

    Conquer your inner demons first before you conquer the world.

  8. #28
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Argus2968 View Post
    That assumes I'm having sex with SP's.
    Or is it that they GIVE no respect?
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

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  9. #29
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corey_vann View Post
    I have a friend who is an ENTP who seems to not get any respect, especially from a couple of ESTJs we know. At first I wasn't sure what to make of him, but over the past year of getting to know eachother I've learned he's a really nice/good guy. What I don't understand is why people get so down on him. As far as I can tell he doesn't do anything wrong, but he seems to be the defacto-whipping boy of this group of people. What's worse is that the previously mentioned ESTJs, one more than the other, are openly and unnecessarily critical, rude, and all around mean to him. I'm not a big fan of ESTJs to begin with, and I get that he's an easy target, but this is ridiculous! Have any ENTPs had similar experiences with ESTJs and other temperments and how did you deal with it? Has anyone seen this kind of behavior before and how was it dealt with?
    I've always commanded a fair bit of respect, although I don't know or care what has gone on behind my back.

    That being said, a lot of times people say things to me that could be seen as incredibly rude to many people, but I don't really see it that way. I see the humor in pretty much everything, so if something is funny - even at my own expense - I am usually the first one cracking up over it. Even if something is intended to be rude, I barely notice. And of course, I also tear new holes into people in return. Your friend may just not care and is hanging around for the comic relief. Whatevs.

  10. #30
    loopy Ulaes's Avatar
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    NPs gets laughed at. i notice they dont get the credit they deserve because they're ungraceful, scatter-brained, easily distracted, etc.
    as if SJs would understand NPs. we're doing it wrong, apparently. to bad for NPs they're out numbered.

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