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  1. #21
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, but some of y'all need that real talk critical analysis for half-baked ideas. Maybe think em thru a bit before you just let it loose, hmm?

    /dodges flying objects

    on the other front, I'm sick of people insta-typing people who criticize their opinions as NTs and then launching into "OMG they think they're hot shit" screeds. Maybe the ideas weren't very good to begin with and it doesn't take an NT specifically to call em out.


    As someone who was outspoken in High School English class I can tell you that not everybody is out to showboat. Questions and challenges about your thoughts force you to be more coherent and articulate and - dare I say it - more thoughtful. Sometimes I asked questions because of what I found to be a disturbing lack of analysis, not to "look smarter than the teacher." I <3 my teacher, prolly cause she shared my sentiments about not hand-holding when people clearly weren't operating at their best.

    /rant.
    hoarding time and space
    A single event can awaken within us a stranger totally unknown to us. To live is to be slowly born.
    — Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  2. #22
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poppy View Post
    Yeah, you're probably not looking at that high a ratio of NTs. Probably a lot of TJs though. I took AP English and I'd say there were maaaybe a couple of other NTs and quite a lot of overachieving SJs. That was the general atmosphere at my school though anyway.

    I mean, don't get me wrong, immature NTs can be obnoxious know-it-alls, but we don't have a monopoly on it
    I see your point, and there, I believe 2 or 3 SJs, but we're talking about a class of 13 other people. I know them all personally, and have known a lot of them to be NTs in the first place. These are the intellectuals of my grade. Not saying SJs can't be intellectual, but it just so happened that these NTs are in my class.

    Besides, the point of the thread isn't whether or not they are really NTs.

    Guys, the fact is that there ARE NTs in my class. And they ARE criticizing a lot. And it IS annoying.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  3. #23
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    I feel like a fucking idiot in front of them
    Well, you're a teenager. No offense, but being an idiot is part of the package and I'm speaking with experience lol.
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    but I'd rather be discouraged than overzealous. Maybe.
    A wise decision.
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Some of you are missing my point. I'm probably not being specific enough.

    We were talking about To Kill a Mockingbird, for instance, and it happens to be a book I thoroughly enjoyed. But instead of being able to express this, the discussion came with some boos and groans. They said it was poorly written, and shouldn't be a prized piece of literature as it's plot is ridiculous because it happened to be one of the authors only published works.

    I mean...seriously? Are you just saying that because you didn't find it interested? Do they not like to admit something was boring, but find the need to rationalize and use the excuse that it was poorly written to cover up this?
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  5. #25
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    You would honestly think I would type people as NT because they are criticizing? Think again. But thanks for the advice- oh...wait.
    Oh dear. I don't know you. For all I know, you could well be an idiot. I just thought I'd make sure...no harm in asking, right? Maybe 75% of your class is NT. I don't know. You can't blame people for being suspicious of such percentages when, for a lot of us, we were lucky (or not) to have known 2 or 3 in our entire graduating classes.

    As to advice...um, why do you care if they are critical of their teachers and some authors? Is it affecting your learning experience? If it is, I'd suggest talking to your teacher about it so that he/she could put a tighter reign on the types of discussions you guys have. Otherwise, what is the problem? Are they overly critical of what you have to say or something? Do they make you feel insecure? If that is the case, the problem is with you and not them.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  6. #26
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
    Well, you're a teenager. No offense, but being an idiot is part of the package and I'm speaking with experience lol.

    A wise decision.
    You know..that is probably one of the best pieces of advice I've gotten here.

    And thanks.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  7. #27
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Some of you are missing my point. I'm probably not being specific enough.

    We were talking about To Kill a Mockingbird, for instance, and it happens to be a book I thoroughly enjoyed. But instead of being able to express this, the discussion came with some boos and groans. They said it was poorly written, and shouldn't be a prized piece of literature as it's plot is ridiculous because it happened to be one of the authors only published works.

    I mean...seriously? Are you just saying that because you didn't find it interested? Do they not like to admit something was boring, but find the need to rationalize and use the excuse that it was poorly written to cover up this?
    I've never read the book, but NT, NF, SP or SJ, it's very hard to relate to the reading material given in high school because... Well, because you're in high school.

    I'm willing to wager a lot of them will come to appreciate the book later in life.
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  8. #28
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I think it's nice that the kids that are probably frustrated on a lot of levels, have a place where they can talk about these things without reprisal, whatever their types might be.

    We sort of do this fairly frequently at my house mostly because it's . . . fun. But we are INTP, INFj, INTJ, INFP, E?TJ, and I?TP and a bunch of intellectually arrogant snobs plopped down on the edge NASCAR country.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  9. #29
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Oh dear. I don't know you. For all I know, you could well be an idiot. I just thought I'd make sure...no harm in asking, right? Maybe 75% of your class is NT. I don't know. You can't blame people for being suspicious of such percentages when, for a lot of us, we were lucky (or not) to have known 2 or 3 in our entire graduating classes.

    As to advice...um, why do you care if they are critical of their teachers and some authors? Is it affecting your learning experience? If it is, I'd suggest talking to your teacher about it so that he/she could put a tighter reign on the types of discussions you guys have. Otherwise, what is the problem? Are they overly critical of what you have to say or something? Do they make you feel insecure? If that is the case, the problem is with you and not them.
    No, I am not an idiot. but that is my opinion.

    No harm done, thanks.

    You're right, you don't know whose in my class.

    I don't care. I find it annoying.

    It is not effecting my learning experience, but is kind of a little intimidating.

    They intimidate me.

    They don't make me feel insecure, it is annoying. But if feeling insecure goes along with intimidation, then yes.

    You're right.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  10. #30
    Obsession. Lethe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    But for those who offered advice, you are completely right. I mean..it is like me to really care about things like this, but it has gotten pretty annoying. I mean..we're juniors in high school, and these kids think they are at the top of the intellectual books. Like they want to argue and criticize because it makes them feel better about themselves, and gives them courage.

    edit: and a part of it is discouraging. I feel like a fucking idiot in front of them. but I'd rather be discouraged than overzealous. Maybe.
    Yes, who wouldn't dream of knocking someone off their high horse once in awhile? Estimate your opponents and their debating style before you take them on -- it will give a clearer indication of the ammunition you would need for a successful battle. Personally, I believe it's considerably helpful to know what you don't know than to have an unsupported pride in your abilities. And also be vigilant about becoming too passionate in 'winning' the debate. It will distract you from focusing on what needs to be done.
    "I cannot expect even my own art to provide all of the answers -- only to hope it keeps asking the right questions." -- Grace Hartigan

    Enneagram: Tritype - 1w9, 5 (balanced wings), 2w3; Overall Variant: So/Sx
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Looking into the eyes of a [Ni user] is like peeking through a portal into a parallel universe.

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