Ne monster wanted to chat about NPD. Ne, my mental health experience is that I trained as a nurse, I'm RNMH qualified (Mental handicapped), haven't practiced in a long long time. Trainign included a fair bit of psyciatry and LOADs of behavioral modification - mainly skinner based.
I have some quite personal experiences with NPD, I dated a real live one - some ten years ago. I'm putting the lable on it, he didn't. This is very considered oppinion - he was in psycotherapy (his therapist felt he needed 10 years of treatment), so I'm pretty confident my labeling of what his condition was, isn't too far off the mark.
At the same time as I was seeing him, I also worked with another guy - who was odd (and yes he was an ENTP - I believe the bloke I was dating was an ExTx - more J I think). Anyways, I had an inkling back then that there was bigger issues going on with the guy I was working with. I didn't see him again for quite some time and I ran across him about 2 years ago - and he was doing some work.
By this point I was much more switched on about personality dissorders and I suspected he had issue similar to the guy I was seeing. so I read up extnsitvely on the subject (as much as I could do without forking out ú100 for text book - psyc books can be so expensive). Anyway I looked at the condition not just the clinical features but at their victims too. Its a very sad condition.
I'm no expert on personality dissorders or psyciatric conditions but they all fall into the same basket of normal behavour at extreme excess.
Everyone had narcassistic tendancies - soap boxing yourself doens't = NPD make. Everyone has vanity, but NPD is not that. It's artfical vanity with sever self worth issues. It requires a proper clinical diagnosis....
I do think there are two different types (from personal views)..... The first is where the person has absorbed and is the condition, the second wears more masks, and is confused (the ENTP the latter).
Condition cause is unknown, but both of these guys had ikky relationships with their fathers... The first was in denial of paternity, the second I suspect had some form of domestic violence/agression. The second I might add probably was surrounded by family who said he was fabulous, talented and atractive, the first didnt' have that.... perhaps the reason for the masks is that they play different characters for different people.
A couple of key traits...
Naracassistic Rage = both did this the first had less of a handle on getting it out, the second boils when feeling vulnerable.
Non person = NPD sufferers don't see other people as people, they are puppets to be manipulated.
Lies = distort reality so they can function in it. The first guy, the one I was going out with, regularly broke down and admitting to lieing about everything. With NPD sufferers the good times are as much of a lie as the bad times.
It's said to be uncurable....but I don't beleive that. There is a couple in Oz who are living with changing his NDP, she is a natrual behaoral modifier and is clearly an NT, who is setting boundrys and fixing issues.
After my reading and observations of live ones (and it is a very rare condition) I have to say I'm HORRIFIED at how little we are talk by health practitioners to protect your emotional health.
Self esteme is equivelent to the skin ....physical barrier to ill health, SE is the mental barrier.
I came to the conclusion that there was three types of SE....
If you think about SE as being a drinking glass...
A normal healthy person - will have a gladd that is approximately filled with 60-70% self derived estime (possitive things they feel about themselves) and about 30% from the rest of the world.... If they are less healthy - they may only have a glass that is 90% full, but the proportions/balanced between self derived v's externally sourced is maintained.
An egostist, has about 90% of his glass filled with self derived self esteme..... 10% externally sourced. He is not NPD - typically I don't think, but I'm no expert.... Again is glass can be less full but the proportion is't changed.
The final issue with SE is when the glass is filled with mainly other peoples stuff. only about 10% of the SE is self derived and the rest is externally sourced. This makes the individual weak to the opinions of others, their physical and mental health depend on other peoples oppinions TOO much. Again thier glass can be less than full. This type of problem SE - is common esp amoung women - does my bum look big in this... but far from exclusive... I beleive almost all NPD sufferers have this issue, they struggle with a self derived self esteme....
In an NDP upbringing their self esteme was trashed, they were humiliated and they were made to feel unworthy, which they bought into... Hence they crave stability from other people saying theyare great.... they simply can not tollerate any discussion of their weakeness. They lie in order to big themselves up and to make themselve seem more important.
I don't beleive this is a strictly NT issue, but NT kids get theri self esteme in a different way from SJ's so perhaps this increases the frequency within NTs
Ok this is a start - this is my opinions, not nessesarily medical fact, although I have to say I'm horrified/pleased that there isn't much written on this. The horror is lack of information the pleased is that it's really rare.
The genral conclusion with NPD sufferers - LEAVE NO FUTURE CONTACT.... I have to say that is the only way I got out that relationship.....
PS Last Christmas I ran both these guys astrology charts side by side, they both had a similar astrological aspect... a T square with Mars/Saturn and moon..... at some poit I'll explain that, but as astrology goes, it's preatty damn tough....