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  1. #51
    videodrones; questions Verfremdungseffekt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poppy View Post
    Don't worry, in most cases the most logical thing to do is love and support our families
    Assuming everything is equal, sure. When it becomes an issue is if someone behaves poorly. There's no reason to give them a special pass just because of the coincidence of genetics. If they prove to do more harm than good, it's more logical to just sever ties and let them go their own way.

    I don't have the energy to put up with other people's bullshit; I've got enough of my own to figure out.

  2. #52
    Pose! Salt n' pepper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aderack View Post
    Assuming everything is equal, sure. When it becomes an issue is if someone behaves poorly. There's no reason to give them a special pass just because of the coincidence of genetics. If they prove to do more harm than good, it's more logical to just sever ties and let them go their own way.

  3. #53
    Senior Member epp's Avatar
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    I think like most of the people who have posted here - if I like my family members as persons they are a part of my life. If not, there is no point to talk to them or visit them or whatever simply because we happen to share some genes.

    Then again - it's not that absolute.

    Being 'family' means that I am a little more patient with someone than I would be with a stranger, it also means that I can forgive more easily. But it also means that if I reject him, I probably reject him for real as I have really thought it through and reached a conclusion it's for the best. To make it short - being 'family' means that I pay more attention to given person and I feel a little stronger to him, be the 'feeling' forgiving, patience, hatred or whatever.

    Luckily I either love most of my family or am feeling very positively neutral about them. I love my father's side of the family a lot, as they tend to be NT-s (both healthy or not-so-healthy) or very healthy NF-s. N is very high and valued. Asking questions, trying new things and hobbies is encouraged as is challenging each others' views on logical basis.

    My father has taught me a lot, explained me everything from how the clouds form to different politic systems. My grandfather told me fairy-tales that he made up, took me out painting with water-colours when I was little and explained me how houses are built :P (he was an architect). My grandmother took me to the forest and taught me trees, animals and plants and explained how nature 'works'.

    Any questions why I love them?

    My father is definitely an NT but I can't decide which one. If I'm trying to type him letter-by-letter, I get ENTJ, but the description doesn't work on him. ENTP sounds much better, but in that case he is much healthier than me and also more J - and as much as I know family legends, he always has been a J.

    But my brother fits the ENTJ description extremely well. He is intimidating to most of the people and he also wants to be. He is a director in an international company... and his nickname in that company is Czar (I think that tells a lot about his leading style :P). Too bad I'm probably the only one younger than him and female (GASP!!!) who is not afraid of him but actually tells him to cut the crap, stop being a wannabe alpha male and REALLY be a man for once. I have also told him several times that I am not his employee nor his girlfriend, I am his sister and therefore his equal - if he thinks I should do something he should EXPLAIN WHY not jut TELL ME.

    I guess it all hasn't been a very good strategy to build a loving siblingly relationship. At this point we haven't seen or talked to each other for two years and I don't think it's going to change.

    ------------------

    I forgot to quote you but I wanted to say something to Salt n' pepper. I don't know your story at all and I don't know what you have considered or not. But just in case your story happens to be similar to mine...

    Just try to be a bit easier on your troubled sister. Talk to her and get HER side of the story too. Things are always not so black and white, even if they seem to be.

    I have been in that role of your troubled sister and my brother reached a very similar conclusion as you did - not worth any respect. The thing is - he reached his conclusion only after listening to my parents. Who actually didn't have a very good idea of what and why I was doing.

    Do you know how fairy tales and urban legends come to be? Someone tells another one something, perhaps not mentioning something important (as it is supposed to be something that 'everyone knows' - but the other one doesn't) therefore the other one gets a bit flawed impression... then the second person tells a third person the 'story', perhaps forgetting something in the process, and the third one doesn't quite understand, therefore gets a bit flawed impression... etc etc etc.

    My brother's opinion was based on an urban legend, basically. I know this for a fact because he told me off once, telling me that I was not worth any respect for doing this and that... and these were things I had NEVER done.

    He had his opinion based on an urban legend, basically. He never cared to ask ME.

    But they listen to all parties even in the court before making a decision. Just think about it.

  4. #54
    Pose! Salt n' pepper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by epp View Post
    I forgot to quote you but I wanted to say something to Salt n' pepper. I don't know your story at all and I don't know what you have considered or not. But just in case your story happens to be similar to mine...

    Just try to be a bit easier on your troubled sister. Talk to her and get HER side of the story too. Things are always not so black and white, even if they seem to be.

    I have been in that role of your troubled sister and my brother reached a very similar conclusion as you did - not worth any respect. The thing is - he reached his conclusion only after listening to my parents. Who actually didn't have a very good idea of what and why I was doing.

    Do you know how fairy tales and urban legends come to be? Someone tells another one something, perhaps not mentioning something important (as it is supposed to be something that 'everyone knows' - but the other one doesn't) therefore the other one gets a bit flawed impression... then the second person tells a third person the 'story', perhaps forgetting something in the process, and the third one doesn't quite understand, therefore gets a bit flawed impression... etc etc etc.

    My brother's opinion was based on an urban legend, basically. I know this for a fact because he told me off once, telling me that I was not worth any respect for doing this and that... and these were things I had NEVER done.

    He had his opinion based on an urban legend, basically. He never cared to ask ME.

    But they listen to all parties even in the court before making a decision. Just think about it.
    Thanks for the heads up! Trust me on this, I have first hand information and that's what I'm basing my decision on. Hope you're doing better now!

  5. #55
    Senior Member epp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salt n' pepper View Post
    Thanks for the heads up! Trust me on this, I have first hand information and that's what I'm basing my decision on. Hope you're doing better now!
    Good to hear.
    And my troubled past is... well... past. Rough puberty, you can say :P
    (But I still wasn't as bad as my bro thought I was)

  6. #56
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    Not really needed in my opinion. Having deep interpersonal connections with one's genetic relations is all well and good, but you shouldn't try to force the connection to exist if it doesn't already. I don't really interact with my family in a way I would consider meaningful. I live with them, so I try to be a good house-mate and ensure they don't have to put up with my bullshit and personal life. And I expect the same treatement in return.

    I do have people I would consider family in the emotional sense of the word but its an random event. I never really know who will become of my trusted close companions, but I know it when I feel it.

  7. #57
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    I've never really agreed with them and I don't think that is simply because I have no desire to have children whatsoever.

  8. #58
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    I love certain people in my family and have a great respect for them. Others, not so much.

    Although, it's good to at least try to cultivate a good relationship with your family because they're a lot harder to get rid of then the average joe.

    'Family Values' as the conservative talking point sound like they would work if everyone were a robot/were extremely dedicated to making things work. You know. Kind of like communism, I guess.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

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