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Thread: Rant on INTPs

  1. #31
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Boring.
    Even more boring. *yawns* ... goes to bed.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    Even more boring. *yawns* ... goes to bed.
    NF

  3. #33
    Senior Member Recluse's Avatar
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    Cape still bunched . . . .
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    I didn't say that I didn't say it. I said that I didn't say that I said it. I want to make that very clear.

  4. #34

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    The list is long...

    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    But in the interest of improvement, say we add implementable suggestions for improvement as well.
    If this is truely meant for self-improvement.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  5. #35
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I only know two INTPs IRL, one is my brother and the other is the friend that introduced me to MBTI. The statement I'm about to make is hypothetical, I haven't done this to anybody nor do I plan on doing it.

    From my observations of the INTPs and INTPc, INTPs are sickeningly passive. So much quivering self-doubt makes me want to be the EFJ of their worst nightmare just because I can and possibly to goad some type of reaction out of INTPs. I don't know why I react this way and why this particular behavior elicits almost a gut level response to INTPs from me, but it does. I don't even feel this way about ISTPs. It's the most unattractive thing and it makes me really want to be evil, full blast FE-MONSTER. INTPs seem to radiate it from the fibers of their being.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  6. #36
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I only know two INTPs IRL, one is my brother and the other is the friend that introduced me to MBTI. The statement I'm about to make is hypothetical, I haven't done this to anybody nor do I plan on doing it.

    From my observations of the INTPs and INTPc, INTPs are sickeningly passive. So much quivering self-doubt makes me want to be the EFJ of their worst nightmare just because I can and possibly to goad some type of reaction out of INTPs. I don't know why I react this way and why this particular behavior elicits almost a gut level response to INTPs from me, but it does. I don't even feel this way about ISTPs. It's the most unattractive thing and it makes me really want to be evil, full blast FE-MONSTER. INTPs seem to radiate it from the fibers of their being.

    INTPs dont act too much in the external world not because of the self-doubt, but because they are content being where they are--in their inner world.

    As a radical Thinking type they tend to be more confident than other types (strongest Thinking preferrence of all). They dont act out because they dont your reassurance and dont need external achievements in order to feel good about themselves.

    Those who are most active in the external world tend to be the least confident and the most superficial. They take from the world because their inner being is empty, and they want to achieve by external standards because they dont trust themselves to craft their own standards. So, the EJs cant validate themselves and need for others to validate them because of this.

    EFJs are the ones who tend to lack confidence, that is why they always want to act in a way that would win the approbation of others. When I asked one ENFJ how she deals with criticism--she answered that she doesnt get criticism, go figure.

    EFJs would melt should they ever be at a point where others dont think that they are praiseworthy, so they always have to be on the go making sure that the whole world knows that they are good.

    As Mr.Myiagi once answered to Julianne when she said something like..Let me have a belt so everyone can know that I am good.."You know that you're good and thats all that matters' he answered..--What belt do you have Mr.Myiagi..'Jc-Penny'....

    So, in other words, ITPs, especially INTPs (Stronger Ti) dont need to act at all because they could care less for your approval or for external rewards because they just dont need those things to feel good about themselves. So, why bother waste energy, if you could just collect your energy from within. Its more conducive to your higher purpose (meeting the standard that really matters, not the one of other people) and it feels more natural, you dont burn your energy by being externally involved.

    So, if there is one type that doesnt go lacking for self-confidence, it would definitely be the INTP because the INTP needs virtually no external support. The INTP relies on external support less than the ISTP (as you say, you dont feel that ISTPs are as passive as INTPs) because Intuition helps the INTP solidify their inner judgment in a way that ISTPs can not. ISTPs are passive as well for the same reason as INTPs, because they could care less about meeting some external standard, though less passive because their internal standard is not as firmly founded in their inner being as that of INTPs because sensation is less internally focused than intuition.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

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  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I only know two INTPs IRL, one is my brother and the other is the friend that introduced me to MBTI. The statement I'm about to make is hypothetical, I haven't done this to anybody nor do I plan on doing it.

    From my observations of the INTPs and INTPc, INTPs are sickeningly passive. So much quivering self-doubt makes me want to be the EFJ of their worst nightmare just because I can and possibly to goad some type of reaction out of INTPs. I don't know why I react this way and why this particular behavior elicits almost a gut level response to INTPs from me, but it does. I don't even feel this way about ISTPs. It's the most unattractive thing and it makes me really want to be evil, full blast FE-MONSTER. INTPs seem to radiate it from the fibers of their being.
    What's your version of an FE-Monster? Read "The Fountainhead", would you feel the same way about Howard Roark? or just the people on forums?

    My confidence depends on the context. Someone I know said this, "He seems like such nice quite guy, but every once in a while he says somthing and you wonder". Usually its when I make a comment like, "That's trivial." or "Your experience just forms habbits, it doesn't make you better at what you do necesarily."

    Also, FYI, I don't quiver, but I do doubt. Doubt is what keeps me from fooling myself.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  8. #38
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    Also, FYI, I don't quiver, but I do doubt. Doubt is what keeps me from fooling myself.
    This is well put. INTPs' confidence stems from their ability to be a clear thinker, to know exactly what is going on based only on their own reasoning. Coming to terms with one's limitations is actually going to add to the INTPs' confidence rather than take away because this will be complementary to their Ti nature.

    Paradoxically enough, doubt is conducive to the INTPs high level of confidence, because doubt encourages critical thinking through which they will get in touch with the awareness of their inner being that they need in order to be confident.

    As a renowned INTP-Socrates once said, all of ethics is no more than the 'know thyself' maxim. And that is what he thought meaning in life consisted in, understanding your inner being and becoming in tune with it. That is the cornerstone of introverted judgment, especially in a sense that it pertains to the INPs.

    INFPs have a similar mechanism, though, unlike the INTPs they have to meet a person-centered standard in order to be confident. (Usually, being as sincere and compassionate as possible, as opposed being as honest and competent as possible for the INTP). INFPs tend to lack the robust confidence that INTPs tend to have because they need support from others in order to be sound, (usually be deeply appreciated by the few that they chose to bond with) their inner standard is much less clearly defined than that of INTPs and thirdly, they tend to have less of a firm control over their inner world as emotion tends to be more difficult to handle than dispassionate thought.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  9. #39
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    What's your version of an FE-Monster? Read "The Fountainhead", would you feel the same way about Howard Roark? or just the people on forums?

    My confidence depends on the context. Someone I know said this, "He seems like such nice quite guy, but every once in a while he says somthing and you wonder". Usually its when I make a comment like, "That's trivial." or "Your experience just forms habbits, it doesn't make you better at what you do necesarily."

    Also, FYI, I don't quiver, but I do doubt. Doubt is what keeps me from fooling myself.
    Like I said, that opinion is completely based on general impressions from forum INTPs, not any real life examples and not anything that I can see myself doing.

    I've started a couple of Ayn Rand books, but I never seem to finish them (much like most books I start), so I can't answer your question. From what I know of her and what little I've read she tends to write INTJ characters. I don't feel this about INTJs cause I don't feel like they're passive.

    My version of a Fe-monster would be basically doing everything that is feared and dreaded about Fe purposefully, incessantly, and exponentially. I'd gather all of my Fe powers into the perfect storm and throw it at an INTP that I felt was exhibiting this. My main goal, I think, would be to get a reaction and break them, get them to stop being passive and do something. Just make their life the hell they thought they existed in but knew nothing about.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Like I said, that opinion is completely based on general impressions from forum INTPs, not any real life examples and not anything that I can see myself doing.
    Are your brother and friends like what you expect?

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I've started a couple of Ayn Rand books, but I never seem to finish them (much like most books I start), so I can't answer your question. From what I know of her and what little I've read she tends to write INTJ characters. I don't feel this about INTJs cause I don't feel like they're passive.
    Ayn Rand is an INTJ I'm pretty sure, but I believe Howard Roark is an INTP. I wouldn't exactly call him passive. I am wondering is you would interpret him that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    My version of a Fe-monster would be basically doing everything that is feared and dreaded about Fe purposefully, incessantly, and exponentially. I'd gather all of my Fe powers into the perfect storm and throw it at an INTP that I felt was exhibiting this.
    You're confusing me here. I am not sure what the dreaded about Fe thing is.

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    My main goal, I think, would be to get a reaction and break them, get them to stop being passive and do something. Just make their life the hell they thought they existed in but knew nothing about.
    This is not something that could cause dread in me, but is rather likely to insite anger (That is till I found out you were doing it just to get a reaction out of me, at which point, I would simply not react).

    Also, I really dislike the stereotype of a "do-nothing INTP." I have never met one IRL (again due to the HS I went to, and due to the fact they tested us I know a dispraportianate number of INTPs--You may actually be able to guess which one since it is in your area). They usually have a great number of hobbies and interests, and are usually actively pursuing a lot of them.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

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