[ENTP] Help comprehending angry ENTP

[jenocyde]

Do you mean they don't see the real you? Or, what do you mean? Why would they see you as a strange novelty?

Of course they don't see the real me. I hate to talk about the S/N divide because it sounds so cheesy, but I think there's some truth to it. Also, maybe because I am female and most women don't speak as openly as I do.

 

[Synarch]

Of course they don't see the real me. I hate to talk about the S/N divide because it sounds so cheesy, but I think there's some truth to it. Also, maybe because I am female and most women don't speak as openly as I do.

So, it is safe to say you often feel alienated?

 

[jenocyde]

So, it is safe to say you often feel alienated?

Well, I don't feel like they are alienating me, more like I am alienating myself. I don't get enough out of most social situations, so I tend to withdraw after a bit.

 

[Synarch]

Well, I don't feel like they are alienating me, more like I am alienating myself. I don't get enough out of most social situations, so I tend to withdraw after a bit.

What are you trying to get out of social situations?

 

[jenocyde]

What are you trying to get out of social situations?

I don't know. At first it seems like it will be fun, so I go with a super excited attitude, ready to do or talk about anything. Then it feels like I'm just doing a stand-up routine, so I stop talking to see who else will chip in. Then I realize that no one will, so I stop trying and just withdraw. This never happens with you??

 

[Synarch]

I don't know. At first it seems like it will be fun, so I go with a super excited attitude, ready to do or talk about anything. Then it feels like I'm just doing a stand-up routine, so I stop talking to see who else will chip in. Then I realize that no one will, so I stop trying and just withdraw. This never happens with you??

For me it's just how I respond to social discomfort. Also, it seems easier to perform sometimes than to connect. Know what I mean? Now I try harder to connect, which is why you find me talking more about my weaker areas and my complicated and often painful personal experiences. Everyone can relate to that shit AND it happens to be actually true, unlike the fabulous tales I used to impress people with if I felt uncomfortable or felt like I needed their approval.

 

[BlahBlahNounBlah]

For me it's just how I respond to social discomfort. Also, it seems easier to perform sometimes than to connect. Know what I mean? Now I try harder to connect, which is why you find me talking more about my weaker areas and my complicated and often painful personal experiences. Everyone can relate to that shit AND it happens to be actually true, unlike the fabulous tales I used to impress people with if I felt uncomfortable or felt like I needed their approval.

I always feel like I'm being self-involved when I talk about those things. I know other people can get that feeling of connection from the shared pain or whatever, but that doesn't change the weird feeling I get from it. It's like bathing in dirty water everyone is washing in.

 

[jenocyde]

For me it's just how I respond to social discomfort. Also, it seems easier to perform sometimes than to connect. Know what I mean? Now I try harder to connect, which is why you find me talking more about my weaker areas and my complicated and often painful personal experiences. Everyone can relate to that shit AND it happens to be actually true, unlike the fabulous tales I used to impress people with if I felt uncomfortable or felt like I needed their approval.

Hmmm, our motivations are completely different. I actually connect by banter. I like to see that quick mental connection - someone who operates at the same speed that I do. This is what feels natural to me. To start in with darker topics... I don't know, I think it's a mood killer if people are just trying to have a good time. And those things just work their way out organically, there's a time and place for everything.

I never think about impressing people. My problem stems from wanting others to impress me.

 

[Synarch]

I always feel like I'm being self-involved when I talk about those things. I know other people can get that feeling of connection from the shared pain or whatever, but that doesn't change the weird feeling I get from it. It's like bathing in dirty water everyone is washing in.

Well, I approach it more from the point of view of what have I learned rather than as an excuse to bitch and moan and wallow in shit. I care very much about learning from negative experiences. To learn from them it often helps to acknowledge and discuss them. But, I definitely get your meaning. I don't want to rehash things to feel bad or to indulge in self-pity.

 

[Synarch]

Hmmm, our motivations are completely different. I actually connect by banter. I like to see that quick mental connection - someone who operates at the same speed that I do. This is what feels natural to me. To start in with darker topics... I don't know, I think it's a mood killer if people are just trying to have a good time. And those things just work their way out organically, there's a time and place for everything.

I never think about impressing people. My problem stems from wanting others to impress me.

Welllllll, is it possible you just think people want to impress you? Maybe people just want to relate and be liked and share. Maybe you're projecting. *shrug*

 

[jenocyde]

Welllllll, is it possible you just think people want to impress you? Maybe people just want to relate and be liked and share. Maybe you're projecting. *shrug*

I mean that I want others to impress me, not that I feel they want to. I'm waiting for someone to meet me in my arena, instead of me always playing on the away field.

 

[Synarch]

I mean that I want others to impress me, not that I feel they want to. I'm waiting for someone to meet me in my arena, instead of me always playing on the away field.

What does that mean? You're waiting for some to meet you in your arena. You want to FEEL something, yes? The problem is lack of feeling... in this case excitement. You're chasing a high, perhaps.

 

[BlahBlahNounBlah]

I mean that I want others to impress me, not that I feel they want to. I'm waiting for someone to meet me in my arena, instead of me always playing on the away field.

Maybe date an ENTP?



(not me, of course. I'm missing a penis)

 

[Synarch]

Maybe date an ENTP?



(not me, of course. I'm missing a penis)

I can't really see two ENTP's together. What a nightmare. Both convinced of their own genius. Both easily bored. Both troublesome.

 

[jenocyde]

What does that mean? You're waiting for some to meet you in your arena. You want to FEEL something, yes? The problem is lack of feeling... in this case excitement. You're chasing a high, perhaps.

Maybe... But so what? When you met your gf, didn't you feel that high? That sense of *finally*? Why shouldn't I want that? Not just romantically, but in any area. I'm bored, is basically what it is.

But where does your low self-esteem come from?

Maybe date an ENTP?

tried it and it was thrilling. But you know how it is with us, there was no longevity.


(what Synarch said...)

 

[Synarch]

Maybe... But so what? When you met your gf, didn't you feel that high? That sense of *finally*? Why shouldn't I want that? Not just romantically, but in any area. I'm bored, is basically what it is.

But where does your low self-esteem come from?

I think there is this tendency in ENXP's to draw what they need internally from the world around them. This makes them prone to chasing highs, getting bored, and generally getting into trouble because that which makes you not bored, I think, has to come from within.

I don't know where my low self-esteem comes from. Maybe from a feeling of perfectionism and being too idealistic (aka unrealistic) about myself and the world. Ironically, it's also what drives me to do neat things and be creative. I create my best stuff when I at war with myself and the world. So, go figure.

 

[Intricate Mystic]

I think there is this tendency in ENXP's to draw what they need internally from the world around them. This makes them prone to chasing highs, getting bored, and generally getting into trouble because that which makes you not bored, I think, has to come from within.

I don't know where my low self-esteem comes from. Maybe from a feeling of perfectionism and being too idealistic (aka unrealistic) about myself and the world. Ironically, it's also what drives me to do neat things and be creative. I create my best stuff when I at war with myself and the world. So, go figure.

Thank you for saying this. It's what the ENTP who hurt me did. They liked the initial intoxication of falling for someone new, but when that wore off, they were on to the next person. That is a terrible way to go through life, doing that to one person after another.

 

[jenocyde]

I think there is this tendency in ENXP's to draw what they need internally from the world around them. This makes them prone to chasing highs, getting bored, and generally getting into trouble because that which makes you not bored, I think, has to come from within.

I don't know where my low self-esteem comes from. Maybe from a feeling of perfectionism and being too idealistic (aka unrealistic) about myself and the world. Ironically, it's also what drives me to do neat things and be creative. I create my best stuff when I at war with myself and the world. So, go figure.

You know, the thing is that being extroverted means just that - that I look for external stimuli. But introverts do the opposite. You can make a case either way for which one causes more trouble... There is plenty of truth to what you are saying, but I've never felt this way around an INTx, for instance. So maybe I am just hanging out with all the wrong people. INTxs are so hard to find irl.

About being idealistic. I can sympathize. I look at the world through rose colored lenses, too. And you are right about having that catalyst to creativity. I just don't get how that relates to your low self esteem. On a general level, I can understand it, but only in certain contexts. Like if I really like a guy and he doesn't call me or whatever - I can go through a (brief) period of self doubt. But other than that, I look at myself through rose colored glasses too, I guess.

 

[jenocyde]

Thank you for saying this. It's what the ENTP who hurt me did. They liked the initial intoxication of falling for someone new, but when that wore off, they were on to the next person. That is a terrible way to go through life, doing that to one person after another.

It doesn't always work that way. We are not all just hopping from one adventure to the next. We are capable of deeply loving and committed relationships. We can also be pricks, like any person when they are immature. Sorry that you got hurt by an immature prick.

 

[Synarch]

Thank you for saying this. It's what the ENTP who hurt me did. They liked the initial intoxication of falling for someone new, but when that wore off, they were on to the next person. That is a terrible way to go through life, doing that to one person after another.

This was hard for me to admit. Essentially it is using people to get something you haven't built inside. And since it comes only from other people it is never enough. In SolitaryWalker's book he talks about the self-effacing tendencies of ENTP's and this really hit home. This notion that orientation to the external is, in a sense, self-denying.

When ENXP's become unhappy they usually kneejerk and try to change their circumstances. I see this all the time. Externally focused people start with the outside world when they're miserable. They figure a new life will make them happy. New boyfriend, new job, new friends, new experiences. The growth comes from recognizing what the constant factor is in your unhappiness: YOU.

The thing that hurts more for the people who get used is realizing that they never really knew you. They never really stopped to consider the impact on you. In a way, you were never real. But, I wouldn't be angry at ENXP's because in the end you do not build anything by floating from flower to flower. In the end, you die alone and jaded. Untouched. Unknown.