[NT] NTs . . . Why are You Messy?

[Tallulah]

I think a lot of it has to do with how one prioritizes things. If you don't care too much about the asthetic appearance of your home or yourself your less likely to put effort into maintaining it. Or care more about doing other things that take up your time, this could include activities like playing video games all day. One thing I notice about messy people is that in their rooms they will have 'a path' carved out so it meets their basic mobility needs. An organised and cleanly house is often an effort to maximise astheitcs and practical application of serving duties.

Also if you tend to live more in your head (versus your environment) then you're less likely to take note of how bad your environment has gotten. An example of which is when I noticed how much cat fur there was on my carpet only after I packed all by things up and moved into a new house. While I was living there I thought the carpets looked fine so I didn't think I needed to vacuume. When you add clutter into the equation then what I have found what my mind does it that it concentrates solely on what I need at the time while all other things are sort of blocked out. I once lived in an extremely cluttered house that seriously needed a professional cleaning crew to keep it up. There were even mushrooms growing at the base of the toilet! A LOT of daily work was put into that house just to keep it functional. When a person was assigned to do the dishes (which was done every night) it also meant they had to clean the entire kitchen too which usually took on average two hours. Then the next morning all that hard work had usually been undone and the next person in line had to do exactly what the last had did. It was once suggested that in order to keep the kitchen clean we would need to do it three times a day. Things were also constantly breaking. I can't remember how many times the kitchen faucet needed to be replaced or how many vacuume cleaners we had purchased. That house was under an organisational system from hell and had came into existence from an accumulation of problems. When I moved into a cleaner, well organised house the sight of it blinded me, it looked so... sterile.

Yeah, this is basically it--a lot of NTs are so inside our heads that we develop blind spots as far as our physical environment is concerned. I can walk right over something for weeks and weeks and then need it and not be able to find it when I need it, because I just don't "see" it anymore.

I will confess that sometimes cleaning my physical environment can have the effect of clearing my head, but it's probably due more to the act of doing it rather than having the clear space.

I lived with a roommate that taught me how to keep the common areas in the house clear, and to have a place for everything, and I mostly do that. When I get ready in the bathroom in the mornings, I don't leave my stuff out for others to have to deal with--it goes back into whatever place I got it from. What I do tend to do, however, is nest--if I'm going to be sitting in the same place in the living room or my bedroom every day and need the same stuff, I'll just sort of keep a little nest of that stuff around me. If I'm going to need it, I figure, keep it convenient. When I'm done with it for good, I'll put it up.

I would say I'm somewhat messy, but I'm not gross. I'm not going to leave nasty dishes piled up for weeks, or never clean the bathroom. I have been to people's houses that seem like they should be condemned for health reasons. I couldn't live like that. But stuff like making the bed? Yeah, I might do it once in a great while. It just seems like a waste of energy.

 

[Orangey]

My ENTP brother is not really "messy," he just doesn't take care to make the placement or location of his items look nice and orderly. He has his stuff in the right place (he keeps it all on his desk, where he has categories for different types of stuff), no piles or anything, but he doesn't put effort into making sure that things are symmetrical or arranged in a visually orderly way. My ISTJ mother calls him a slob for this reason. I, OTOH, am a bit anal when it comes to keeping my place clean and orderly.

 

[kyuuei]

The words "rational" and "systematic" are not synonymous.

Your argument is weak.

Tidying up is for those left-brainers with nothing more creative to do.

Systematic things can be quite rational. It's rational to say "I need to be able to locate this again. I will create a spot just for it, and put similar items next to it so I can locate all of this in one central location."

last time someone commented on my mess, i said, "does it bother you?" to which they replied, "actually, yeah, it does a little bit." which got for them from me, "the cleaning stuff is in the laundry room. knock yourself out."

I don't think it really bothers me when other people's rooms or houses are messy.. only that I feel people truly just underestimate how awesome coming home to something clean feels. The place smells better, feels better, and there's a calming to it all.

My ENTP brother is not really "messy," he just doesn't take care to make the placement or location of his items look nice and orderly. He has his stuff in the right place (he keeps it all on his desk, where he has categories for different types of stuff), no piles or anything, but he doesn't put effort into making sure that things are symmetrical or arranged in a visually orderly way. My ISTJ mother calls him a slob for this reason. I, OTOH, am a bit anal when it comes to keeping my place clean and orderly.

That doesn't sound so bad to me, the way you described it.. Visually displeasing maybe at the worst, and a bit harder to dust..

 

[jenocyde]

What I do tend to do, however, is nest--if I'm going to be sitting in the same place in the living room or my bedroom every day and need the same stuff, I'll just sort of keep a little nest of that stuff around me. If I'm going to need it, I figure, keep it convenient. When I'm done with it for good, I'll put it up.

Hahaha, I have a few nests also. My mattress is actually a nest. It is covered in books in various stages of being read, bottles of water, pens, notebooks, magazines, cell phone and bottles of tylenol. There is also a cozy little corner for me to sleep on. It's perfect.

 

[MacGuffin]

Systematic things can be quite rational. It's rational to say "I need to be able to locate this again. I will create a spot just for it, and put similar items next to it so I can locate all of this in one central location."

It's also rational to say "I can locate this without a organizing system" too.

 

[kyuuei]

^ until the first time you're in a rush, not thinking right, accidently fling one shirt on top of it, or it falls behind the dresser or something and you're raging trying to find it?? Messy, as in, there's not just like small 'nests' of things, or pockets of disorganization like a desk with papers all over the place.. messy is, the entire area of operation is in disorder and chaotic.

 

[Tallulah]

Hahaha, I have a few nests also. My mattress is actually a nest. It is covered in books in various stages of being read, bottles of water, pens, notebooks, magazines, cell phone and bottles of tylenol. There is also a cozy little corner for me to sleep on. It's perfect.

:highfive: Me, too! And I don't know anyone else who does this. So glad I'm not the only one!

 

[kyuuei]

^ I have a small lap-desk that sits beside my bed that contains the current book I'm reading, bottle of water, pen and note paper, lamp, charger plug in for my phone.. which makes it awesome when I toss in my sleep and knock everything off.

 

[jenocyde]

^ until the first time you're in a rush, not thinking right, accidently fling one shirt on top of it, or it falls behind the dresser or something and you're raging trying to find it?? Messy, as in, there's not just like small 'nests' of things, or pockets of disorganization like a desk with papers all over the place.. messy is, the entire area of operation is in disorder and chaotic.

Anyone can lose stuff. I find my friends that are highly organized seem most vulnerable to this, if something is misplaced, they become crippled. I always know where to look - it can only be in one of 4 piles. If I made countless files and cabinets, it would take me the whole day to look for a lost item.

:highfive: Me, too! And I don't know anyone else who does this. So glad I'm not the only one!

I thought I was the only one too. This is strangely comforting!

 

[Fluffywolf]

Ever since I bought a laptop that is better than my normal PC in every aspect, apart from lack of a few monitors. I've made my bed into a nest as well.

I've even made some sketches on making a laptop stand that hands from the side of my bed. With a few plateau's for some more stuff that doesn't fit on the night stand.

 

[jenocyde]

I've even made some sketches on making a laptop stand that hands from the side of my bed. With a few plateau's for some more stuff that doesn't fit on the night stand.

Me too!! But I actually built a prototype, which seems to work just fine, out of gutter wire, knitting needles, duct tape and those little metal rings that hang shower curtains. But of course, it makes no difference since I haven't gotten around to buying a bed yet (2+ yrs and counting...) and just sleep on a mattress on the floor. Which means, I can just put whatever doesn't fit directly on to the floor around me.

 

[digesthisickness]

I don't think it really bothers me when other people's rooms or houses are messy.. only that I feel people truly just underestimate how awesome coming home to something clean feels. The place smells better, feels better, and there's a calming to it all.

when did i say i didn't like that? i love that. what, you think i tell them where the cleaning stuff is just to be mean?

 

[ceecee]

Ever since I bought a laptop that is better than my normal PC in every aspect, apart from lack of a few monitors. I've made my bed into a nest as well.

I've even made some sketches on making a laptop stand that hands from the side of my bed. With a few plateau's for some more stuff that doesn't fit on the night stand.

I'd love to see your idea. I also went from a two monitor PC to a laptop and it's gravitated to the bedroom as well. I have a small bookshelf with baskets that serves as my "nightstand". That way I have a place for all my necessary stuff. Books, laptop, moisturizers for every part of my body, tissue, Motrin, notebooks and pens, colored pencils and coloring books. The works. I truly love my bed and when the man is traveling for work I tend to nest on his side too.

 

[Fluffywolf]

Sure.

I can scan it in at work sometime this week. Or maybe I'll build a proper computer model of it. And actually start making it too. I really should. Will definatly organize my nested stuff a little better.

 

[Tallulah]

Ever since I bought a laptop that is better than my normal PC in every aspect, apart from lack of a few monitors. I've made my bed into a nest as well.

I've even made some sketches on making a laptop stand that hands from the side of my bed. With a few plateau's for some more stuff that doesn't fit on the night stand.

Me too!! But I actually built a prototype, which seems to work just fine, out of gutter wire, knitting needles, duct tape and those little metal rings that hang shower curtains. But of course, it makes no difference since I haven't gotten around to buying a bed yet (2+ yrs and counting...) and just sleep on a mattress on the floor. Which means, I can just put whatever doesn't fit directly on to the floor around me.

LOL! My roommate and I were brainstorming on a similar contraption not too long ago! Clearly there is an NT market for this.

 

[jenocyde]

LOL! My roommate and I were brainstorming on a similar contraption not too long ago! Clearly there is an NT market for this.

Totally. And now I clearly see the difference in the NTPs - I don't think I've ever sketched out any of my ideas before. I just do trial and error, unless it's complicated or involves electricity. Interesting.

 

[Fluffywolf]

Oh that's not the difference.

The difference is that INTP's just have the idea and generally leave it at that unless they find someone to do it for them. Or buy something that works. If those two options are not available, we need to give ourself an incentive. So we start by making a concept, usually sketch or put the idea on paper. And that may give us enough incentive to go through with the idea.

ENTP's just go through with the idea.

I think.

 

[jenocyde]

Oh that's not the difference.

The difference is that INTP's just have the idea and generally leave it at that unless they find someone to do it for them. Or buy something that works. If those two options are not available, we need to give ourself an incentive. So we start by making a concept, usually sketch or put the idea on paper. And that may give us enough incentive to go through with the idea.

ENTP's just go through with the idea.

I think.

Hahaa, you should see how many half completed projects I have laying around. I don't even remember what some of them were supposed to be, so sketches would have helped. But yeah, I tend to get an idea and roll with it, and it's always need based. When my ladder broke (don't ask), I created a complex pulley system instead of walking 3 blocks to the hardware store. But when my light went out in the living room, I couldn't use the pulley so I built an extension claw that would enable me to change the bulb. But of course, I have yet to buy a replacement bulb, even though it's been about a month already. I'm tragic.

 

[Fluffywolf]

Maybe my sketch behaviour is just what I personally developped into helping me finish projects. I suppose my programming background has helped. Creating programs for business' you kinda need to start with creating a visual layout of everything you need, you want to put in and want to get out of the program. Because just starting to write the program without doing that will get you in all sorts of programming confusion.

In other words, it may not be type related. And we're not that different after all. XD

 

[jenocyde]

Maybe not, but I was a programmer too, and I would just map it out in my head and code, step by step. I would write down a few things so I wouldn't forget, but for the most part I think that's counterproductive and takes too much time. So maybe it is a type difference?