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  1. #41
    Senior Member Misty_Mountain_Rose's Avatar
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    This thread needs a poll.
    Embrace the possibilities.

  2. #42
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afkan View Post
    I believe that your response has been the most cool, collected, and unbiased. But alas, that doesn't mean a thing bc you stand on middle ground (ENTX).
    A fact is a fact is a fact, my friend. If an argument is correct, supported and logically sound it's irrelevant who penned it.

    That said, the function preference business is something I've been puzzling over. I'd love to have someone to talk it over with if you're interested.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    A fact is a fact is a fact, my friend. If an argument is correct, supported and logically sound it's irrelevant who penned it.
    Agreed. However, I was referring to emotional reactivity. A person's emotional reactivity often indicates their ability to make rational decisions under stress. Yes, some personalities are more rational in general than others.

    Labile mood, for example, is a symptom of poor mental health, but an ENFP's healthy personality is much more labile than most personalities. Anyone might get slightly defensive by a statement like "Better critic:" which is pointed at a group they perceive themselves to be a part of, depending on if they value "critic" positively or negatively.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    That said, the function preference business is something I've been puzzling over. I'd love to have someone to talk it over with if you're interested.
    I will message you. That would be fun.

  4. #44
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    INTP. An INTJ just says "you're wrong," and that's it. An INTP can accurately and precisely point out the aspects. Never get into a rational arguement with an INTP. If you haven't already immoveably decided on your beleif, then you can be swept away.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afkan View Post
    Hmmm...you sound so Idealistic
    It sounds more painful.

  6. #46
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afkan View Post
    Agreed. However, I was referring to emotional reactivity. A person's emotional reactivity often indicates their ability to make rational decisions under stress. Yes, some personalities are more rational in general than others.

    Labile mood, for example, is a symptom of poor mental health, but an ENFP's healthy personality is much more labile than most personalities. Anyone might get slightly defensive by a statement like "Better critic:" which is pointed at a group they perceive themselves to be a part of, depending on if they value "critic" positively or negatively.
    You lost me. So is what you're saying that my arguments invalid because I deliberately defined criticism in an emotionally neutral way? This is only an issue if the point wasn't the question itself. Say for example, if the purpose of the thread was a kind of Rorschach's test for "emotional reactivity" or associations in your respondents based on their self-identification, then what I did would be wrong.

    Or it's that because I have no invested interest in the answer, I can't have an emotional stake in my response, so there's something less "authentic" in what I said than if I actually was defending something I believed in.

    Or it's that NFs get indignant when others get too clinical about people.

    Whatever the case may I defined "critique" as I did for clarity's sake. If I happened to be subversive in the meanwhile, then all in a day's work I guess.


    I will message you. That would be fun.
    Yay! Looking forward to it.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    You lost me. So is what you're saying that my arguments invalid because I deliberately defined criticism in an emotionally neutral way?
    Ahhh! No! Your argument isn't invalid! I was saying that my assumption was invalid. I didn't explain what I meant, I just assumed you could read my mind I guess. I was assuming that XNTX would be an even better critic.

    To take this point further, I think some of the other answers were healthily defensive. With a title like this thread's, its understandable that some people might react a little emotionally- like thinking, Hey, I am the better critic! Or she didn't even mention my type! Why not? Although I don't expect anyone here (NT) to value "critic" as a bad thing. Its not bad, its a very admirable trait, especially if you aren't good at it (me) but understand when it comes from certain people, especially NTs, it means they love you or trust you or just are making a joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    This is only an issue if the point wasn't the question itself. Say for example, if the purpose of the thread was a kind of Rorschach's test for "emotional reactivity" or associations in your respondents based on their self-identification, then what I did would be wrong.
    You didn't do ANYTHING wrong. I thought that your comment:
    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    If an argument is correct, supported and logically sound it's irrelevant who penned it.
    meant that I must have miscommunicated my prior point. I thought I must have offended you a wee bit by complimenting you- I meant to compliment you in saying that your comment was cool an unbiased. I tried my best to not be overly mushy or gooey sweet purposefully in my flattery - instead I meant to be subtle- bc you may feel disrespected if I had.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    Or it's that because I have no invested interest in the answer, I can't have an emotional stake in my response, so there's something less "authentic" in what I said than if I actually was defending something I believed in.
    I don't have less of an opinion of you, I promise. I like you.
    I am used to communicating very effectively, but much less competent in this type of a setting. I forget that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    Or it's that NFs get indignant when others get too clinical about people.
    Quite the contrary. I treasure what few people are willing to engage in clinical discussions about people with me-
    No offense, but which statement did you make that I might find too clinical? I ask only bc I work in the mental health field and I my affinity for "classifying" people (which can be seen throughout this post) drives the entire ESFJ and ISFJ staff I work with bonkers. They find it offensive, and feel extremely uncomfortable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-up Rex View Post
    Yay! Looking forward to it.
    Me too.

  8. #48
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Good lord. I think that their either needs to be a field manual or summit or something for NFs and NTs. I dunno if the S's have it this bad, but I feel as though our two types are just prone to miscommunication.

    As far as I was concerned we're just discussing a point. Nothing that you say as far as my comment will be taken personally. There's definitely no need to apologize about anything. I think that by and large NTs are intense if theyre interested. Debate is where you can have an idea, allow it to be taken apart, and hopefully at the end you get something better than what you started out with. It's fun, and unless they're (the NT) insecure (or their opponent's point is actually offensive) the person and the idea are independent.

    Quite the contrary. I treasure what few people are willing to engage in clinical discussions about people with me-
    No offense, but which statement did you make that I might find too clinical?
    That you mentioned that my unbiased attitude doesnt mean anything because I don't identify as P or J. I read into the comment too much. Bottom line. Alls good.

  9. #49
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    Exactly; NT's have no issue with professional combat. Personal combat, however, is a diferent issue.

  10. #50
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afkan View Post
    What type [in a vacuum] makes the most logical, unbiased, painfully true critique? I am looking for a type that is most naturally capable (and does so actively on the most regular basis) of making a summation not crafted to drive the nail in deeper, sway to their personal point of view, or even flatter/attempt to avoid offending.

    Assumptions:
    Most likely this type is a rational.
    Most likely the type is Introverted for pure internal analysis, also most naturally suited for writing as opposed to speaking/interacting/debating in groups.

    I am hung up on the J/P:

    Cons-
    J would be the most decisive, more likely to have formed opinions on issues already
    P's as in INTP's have extraverted feeling, thus more likely to be biased in attempting at times to not hurt feelings

    Pros-
    J more likely comfortable with drawing an end conclusion
    P more likely to weigh both sides of an argument

    I found from this thread []INTP - The Critic? [Archive] - Typology Central that INTP is often named the critic. I would love to see a more in depth discussion here. If the INTP is the most natural at being a critic, does that really mean they are naturally unbiased? Or are they most critical? If you are an INTP or an INTJ, what is your position?

    Of course feel free to argue the first assumptions.
    However, please address INTP/INTJ.
    Believe me, ENTP. I speak from years of experience dealing with writers and critics.

    ENTPs are highly adaptable and can switch writing styles at the drop of a hat. The dominant Ne makes sure no stone is left unturned when researching and fact checking. The Ti is precise and razor sharp. The NeFe combo is very welcoming and inviting. An encyclopedia is designed for ENTPs - a smorgasbord of a million interesting topics, but in short segments. Also, ENTPs and ENFJs work very well together, and communicate well together.

    I love INTPs and think they can analyze the death out of something, but it has to be a very specific something and they often miss some variables. The INTJs are also very capable, but I find them to be a bit dismissive and also too clinical in their writing style. Both of them, though, have such a boring, dense writing style which is better suited for tech spec manuals that no one will ever take out of the plastic.

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