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  1. #41
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I really can't answer that for you. The status thing baffles me. But I guess that could be Fe overload, I don't know...



    Yes, but taking pride in something doesn't automatically equate to insecurity and this is where I'm having a hard time understanding what you are getting at. If I offend your Fi sense of value, it doesn't mean that your are insecure about it.

    So they are snarky with each other... it just seems like these 2 people are competitive with each other, which has nothing to do with type or even pride, but it manifests itself in the functions of our type.

    (and please, stop apologizing - we love you, puppy! er, sorry: monster...)
    Maybe we mistake pride/passion for insecurity? Perhaps the wrong label is being used. To offend my Fi you would have to hurt someone else, and then I would feel anger at you, not insecurity. So we see the reaction of offended and then assume they were insecure in the first place..?

    Are entps more prone to being competitive? How do I reorient them to reduce these entanglements?

    (I have Fi , I am gentically programmed to apologize. yap yap!)

  2. #42
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greed View Post
    Yeah, likewise.

    I've found being an open book pretty worthwhile, though. There's not a whole lot that's "hidden" about me anymore. I freely talk about my experiences with anxiety and depression, and I don't tend to attach my ego to things that occur around me. It's taken a while to get there.

    Anymore, my main vice is anger.. pent-up anger, specifically, when my trust is violated. I have some need for security and stability in my life, probably more than I realize, and a breach of trust indicates an erosion of that.

    When someone betrays my trust in a relatively big way, they don't go in the category of "oh well i just can't share that sort of information with them or just avoid them," they go on my shit list. I will brood over the problem. As good at social manipulation as I can be, this is really the only time it comes out. While they have placed me in some "neutral" or even "positive" category themselves and treat me as such, I'll "inadvertently" hit them where it hurts in our conversations, casually dropping hints that strike their insecurities. Onlookers would have no idea what's transpiring, and, really, neither will that other person. All that person knows is that they feel worse than they did.

    Think Harry in Spider-Man 3. Except probably less of a total bastard, but more cunning about it.

    Basically, I have trouble placing my trust in the Powers that Be to ensure that whatever justice is truly warranted is actually carried out.. rather than effectively pursuing vigilantism as I do.

    This has only occurred with two people, and it's something that I want to let go of; I just hope that I have the strength to never do it again.
    Sure you didn't have it right with ENfp?
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  3. #43
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I've often wondered if ENTPs fear being kicked off the top. My eNTP was absolutely the alpha in the group. He wasn't domineering but he *was* the de facto leader or at least second in command at any given time. He was really smart and capable, and not much got at him, but I could see flickers of insecurity or unsureness, like his private nightmare would be to wake up and find out he'd been deluded about his intelligence and worth all along. I could tell when I had him on the ropes. He went from being cocky and chill, to this look that I can only describe as "please don't hurt me". It was a very drastic duality. And the things that made him vulnerable were sometimes surprising. Like me messing with/uprooting his shirt. He'd turn bright red, laugh a bit, and bashfully tell me to stop it.

    Another long-term ENTP friend, he's what I would determine as a tornado with feelings. He tries to stay just two steps ahead of everything, including his own emotions.

    this I have seen. It makes me to hold thier hands and tell them it will be alright. But it happens so quickly, and then the glances pass. But you see it in the microexpressions

  4. #44
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
    I give the impression of having few insecurities if any at all, I really, really, really don't like showing weakness, it feels like failure to me for someone to see them but I can assure you while there are areas where I have excess confidence in my abilities, there are other areas where I have plenty of insecurities, mostly in areas to do with personal relationships and expressing emotions.
    This is what I hear from my ENTP friends as well. That bugger Fe, always ruining Ne-Ti fun.

  5. #45
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I think the difference, for me, is that I can know something and not dwell on it. Like I may just know that I am not so good at x,y and z, but I do those things anyway without giving it another thought. Insecurity (or awareness of limitations) doesn't paralyze me the way it does with other types. So I don't consider myself to be insecure in the traditional sense. But perhaps I am confused about what you mean by insecure??
    For instance, claims such as "ENTPs very rarely get upset about anything" are not really true. Some people, especially non-NTs, have an exaggerated idea of how "immune to taking things personally" we are. We're not, and since NTs tend to pride themselves on behaving logically, we don't like to accept that there are times when we're behaving illogically without realizing it--it's unsettling. So we don't like to acknowledge weaknesses because it runs counter to the image of confidence we usually project.

    By the way, on the question of Fe and manipulation--Fe manipulates people directly by playing off their emotions. There are different kinds of manipulation--Ne can do it by experimenting to see how far it can push the envelope before anyone stops it, and when ESTPs do it it's most likely Se instinctually taking advantage of any physical world opportunity that it sees.

    Ne and Se actually have a lot of common threads in terms of naturally directing things toward their advantage, especially in the company of Ti...they just apply it in totally different areas.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  6. #46
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I've often wondered if ENTPs fear being kicked off the top. My eNTP was absolutely the alpha in the group. He wasn't domineering but he *was* the de facto leader or at least second in command at any given time. He was really smart and capable, and not much got at him, but I could see flickers of insecurity or unsureness, like his private nightmare would be to wake up and find out he'd been deluded about his intelligence and worth all along. I could tell when I had him on the ropes. He went from being cocky and chill, to this look that I can only describe as "please don't hurt me". It was a very drastic duality. And the things that made him vulnerable were sometimes surprising. Like me messing with/uprooting his shirt. He'd turn bright red, laugh a bit, and bashfully tell me to stop it.

    Another long-term ENTP friend, he's what I would determine as a tornado with feelings. He tries to stay just two steps ahead of everything, including his own emotions.
    For me it's not about being kicked off the top, I don't think I'm at the top to begin with, it's all about acceptance for me, not to be mistaken with not about being liked, I could care less about that, it's a fear of not being accepted for who I truly am, therefore I don't show that very often, not to say that I'm not me, just that I'm so used to showing a facade that it's become me. The last part rings true, the staying two steps ahead of everything including my emotions.

    Disclaimer: have a slight case of the drunkness.

  7. #47
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    For instance, claims such as "ENTPs very rarely get upset about anything" are not really true. Some people, especially non-NTs, have an exaggerated idea of how "immune to taking things personally" we are.
    Oh, I know they can take things personally. Like every other human being.

  8. #48
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ne-Monster View Post
    this I have seen. It makes me to hold thier hands and tell them it will be alright. But it happens so quickly, and then the glances pass. But you see it in the microexpressions
    Indeed. And sometimes it happened when he'd done something wrong and I was furious with him, so I would instantly go from wanting to fuss him out to hugging and patting him. Or at least wanting to hug and pat him. That can be a very alien sensation for me. It's the paradoxical nature of ENTPs to be riding high and confident while being amazingly prone at the same time.

    I recall one particular scene... he was having a bad day and was really crabby and agitated. He was grousing about everything (normally he was very chill and laid back), and at one point, out of the blue, I turned to him and say very quietly, "X, it's going to be all right." That brought him up short, and for a minute I thought he might dissolve, he couldn't blink or look away, but a moment after I said it, he actually got very calm. I think the reassurance was important. Like he could be in a bad mood, and it wasn't the end of the world.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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  9. #49
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
    For me it's not about being kicked off the top, I don't think I'm at the top to begin with, it's all about acceptance for me, not to be mistaken with not about being liked, I could care less about that, it's a fear of not being accepted for who I truly am, therefore I don't show that very often, not to say that I'm not me, just that I'm so used to showing a facade that it's become me. The last part rings true, the staying two steps ahead of everything including my emotions.

    Disclaimer: have a slight case of the drunkness.
    Very interesting, Trin. Do you think that gender plays a difference?
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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  10. #50
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Very interesting, Trin. Do you think that gender plays a difference?
    *shrug* iunno. I've always seen a pretty big difference between the large majority of male ENTPs and female ENTPs though. There are only a few males that I can begin to relate to (and some of them think they're INTPs). Still, could just be me.

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