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View Poll Results: Do you cut off the rope? NTs only please

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  • Cut off the rope

    35 77.78%
  • Stay on the rope

    10 22.22%
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  1. #101
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Actually there is no problem if you think outside of the box.


    If you are stranded on a mountain with four other guys during the storm of the century the logical answer is obvious.

    Instead of cuting that rope with that knife you use that knife to kill other 4 guys.
    But you must plan this so that you catch them by suprise with that knife.

    Once they are dead you will have enough warm clothing to complety cover yourself beneath a very thick layer of cloths. So that you have a chance to survive the storm.

    When the storm passes you can take your time and dig a deep hole in snow or better soil if there is any. So that you can bury your comrades and their cloths.

    Once you are done you can get off the mountain and claim that you got seperated from the group and that you don't know what happened to them and you have survived by pure luck since you have managed to hide between the rocks. What in a way is true it just that you have wrap yourself in half a meter of very warm cloths.


    Most people who are climbing on this kinds of mountains are not doing it in their country so no one will be suprised if you move far away from the crime scene indefinitively.
    Also many of those mountains are in third world countries so they will probably not even start a search to find the missing corpses. If you are in a developed country then you must make everything faster with more calculation. But you will know in which part of the world are you so this should not be a problem.


    Even if you get caught someway what is not too likey your chances of survival are stil much better then in the helicopter case where you surely die.


    So judging from the thread I dare to say that NTs failed at logic COMPLETELY!

  2. #102
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    So the rescue chopper lowers a rope ladder. Ladder can only support 4 people.

    Ladders are meant to be climbable. If they weren't then the rescue attempt is pointless.

    What is wrong with the top person climbing all the way into the chopper? 5 rescued, 4 on the ladder and no one dies.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sollas View Post
    So the rescue chopper lowers a rope ladder. Ladder can only support 4 people.

    Ladders are meant to be climbable. If they weren't then the rescue attempt is pointless.

    What is wrong with the top person climbing all the way into the chopper? 5 rescued, 4 on the ladder and no one dies.
    weather worsening, people climbing faster...ladders long that the first person is only halfway up there while you are already on it...

  4. #104
    Senior Member matmos's Avatar
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    I saw a similar scenario in the film Stalingrad.

    The last plane out of Potomnik has, if I can remember correctly, an SS sergeant kicking hangers-on in the face as the plane tries to taxi to leave.

    The scenario actually makes a great deal of sense. The question is: who fancies doing the kicking?

  5. #105
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thisGuy View Post
    weather worsening, people climbing faster...ladders long that the first person is only halfway up there while you are already on it...
    Hey, you can't keep altering the situation! You had your chance in the OP to present the scenario...

  6. #106
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    How about simply not wanting to stupidly sacrifice any precious life until we know for absolute sure that this is the only way??? There has to be more than just 2 choices...
    This, this, THIS is the point for most NTs. We are not going to accept that there are just two solutions, both disastrous, and sacrifice ourselves or others without exploring other options. You HAVE to think in terms of alternate scenarios, you HAVE to poke holes in the seeming evitability of the situation. You have to exhaust every single question, no matter how trivial or implausible or ridiculous, if it's a matter of life and death. I am not going to accept "die or let everyone die" in a split second, and then realize after the helicopter leaves, that I could have simply done [x].

    Quote Originally Posted by laughingebony View Post
    Of course I look for alternatives. However, I do understand the purpose of thought experiments, and, as such, am able to temporarily disregard loopholes. The question here asks for a binary moral decision; it's not a puzzle. If the experiment were meant to be a puzzle, I would have solved it like one.
    I think most NTs reject the idea of the plain moral hypothetical. It's boring. Make it a little more complex, where you could actually imagine being IN the situation, and what variables you could manipulate, and it becomes more interesting. We'll answer your moral dilemma in the process, but you have to give us something meaty to work with for our trouble. Simply, "Would you sacrifice your life to save your child?" is kinda boring. Everyone knows what you're supposed to answer.

    This kind of thing always bugs me in movies. I'm a smart person, of course I KNOW that the point is that the hero sacrificed himself to save the rest of the party or his girlfriend or whatever, and that the point is that we're supposed to feel a big emotional payoff from the self-sacrifice, but I can't help but go, "But....he should have tried x! He could have done y!" If the sacrifice hasn't proved to be absolutely, positively inevitable, with no ways to work around it, it ceases to be "brave and noble" for me, and just seems stupid.
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  7. #107
    Senior Member Shimmy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    This kind of thing always bugs me in movies. I'm a smart person, of course I KNOW that the point is that the hero sacrificed himself to save the rest of the party or his girlfriend or whatever, and that the point is that we're supposed to feel a big emotional payoff from the self-sacrifice, but I can't help but go, "But....he should have tried x! He could have done y!" If the sacrifice hasn't proved to be absolutely, positively inevitable, with no ways to work around it, it ceases to be "brave and noble" for me, and just seems stupid.
    Gran Torino... I loathe my friends for liking that movie just for this exact reason.

  8. #108
    Member INTPatricia's Avatar
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    i'm ready to die, the others may not be. it would be terrible to be afraid to die and be in their position. i'd cut it and take the fall.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shimmy View Post
    Gran Torino... I loathe my friends for liking that movie just for this exact reason.
    Thank God, finally someone agrees with me! The ending was absolutely pointless.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirilis View Post
    Why can't it lift the first 4 people, then lower again to pick me up?
    Lol, this was exactly my first thought too. The question is absurd.

    And if the weather was good enough to send out one helicopter at the moment, why couldn't they send out two? Same as making a round trip. Or They could have thought of that and sent a better ladder.

    At any rate didn't read the rest of the thread.

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