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  1. #81
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ergophobe View Post
    Quite often, I find ENTPs think they have ripped an argument to shreds when in reality they are just putting their argument across louder than their opponent.
    Often, it's when we're still in the middle of the debate.

    Just like winning a debate does not make you right, it just makes you a good debater, saying you've ripped an argument apart doesn't necessarily mean you did.

    Also, ENTPs don't shy away from using tactics that may be perceived as a personal attack by NFs, hence the misconception on both sides?

    I think I may have digressed too much when the question really was about being able to debate with an SO. Perhaps we would make good SOs. Let's kiss and make up. Maybe just kiss?
    Love you, ergo, but this is a classic example. Even a passive joke demands to be addressed. Friends only - but love you all the same...

  2. #82
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    Love you, ergo, but this is a classic example. Even a passive joke demands to be addressed. Friends only - but love you all the same...
    In my world, EVERYTHING needs to be addressed. I just enjoy it SO much. I had these thoughts that needed to be put down - this happened to be the place.

    As always, the love is mutual.

  3. #83
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ergophobe View Post
    Quite often, I find ENTPs think they have ripped an argument to shreds when in reality they are just putting their argument across louder than their opponent.
    Often, it's when we're still in the middle of the debate.

    Just like winning a debate does not make you right, it just makes you a good debater, saying you've ripped an argument apart doesn't necessarily mean you did.

    Also, ENTPs don't shy away from using tactics that may be perceived as a personal attack by NFs, hence the misconception on both sides?
    Actually for all their Tness I do find it really common for Ts to be the first to introduce ad-hominem remarks.

    I don't get easily offended, but the minute the debate stops being about the topic and becomes about the debaters I lose my interest immediately.

  4. #84
    . Blank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    Actually for all their Tness I do find it really common for Ts to be the first to introduce ad-hominem remarks.

    I don't get easily offended, but the minute the debate stops being about the topic and becomes about the debaters I lose my interest immediately.
    Ad-hominem attacks piss me off to no end. They're completely irrelevant and have nothing to do with the topic at hand.
    Ti = 19 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Te = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ne = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fi = 15 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Si = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ni = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Se = 11[][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fe = 0

    -----------------
    Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
    Man got to sit and wonder why, why, why;
    Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
    Man got to tell himself he understand

  5. #85
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    Actually for all their Tness I do find it really common for Ts to be the first to introduce ad-hominem remarks.

    I don't get easily offended, but the minute the debate stops being about the topic and becomes about the debaters I lose my interest immediately.
    I like Latin words that concisely explain what I wanted to say. Thanks.

  6. #86
    Member Cady's Avatar
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    I adore ENFP's as friends. I'm honestly not sure anything would get done if we were in a relationship together.

    As for debating, I've found ENFP's don't really like conflict but they do value a good discussion. Because we process information differently we tend to compliment each other well in discussions, both pointing out sides that the other may have missed.

    I've never even gotten close to arguing with an ENFP so I'm not sure if they're just really easy-going or on to my wily argument starting tactics.

    An example of a conversation between me and my ENFP friend:

    ENFP: We should do something really crazy today!
    ENTP: Yea, tonight after I finish work?
    ENFP: Do you think eventually robots will just take over jobs for everyone, and everyone will just be unemployed?
    ENTP: People would want to institute some sort of heirchy in it's place then. It wouldn't happen though because those making the decisions to robotize more mechanical labor would likely be wary of creating a technology that would replace their own functions in society. I can't see most politicians voting for the implementation of politician robots for example. People in positions of power don't usually want to hand it over.
    ENFP: Yea I guess that's true. It would be really cool if it happened though.
    ENTP: Ok, I could see it happen if the robot-replacing-jobs technology happened in a giant boom like the microchip -> computers but even more intense.

    We end up both conceding slightly to each other. The end result is usually fun and exploratory if perhaps a little whimsical.
    Sleep late for a better tomorrow.

    Extraverted - 58%
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  7. #87
    . Blank's Avatar
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    I've often wondered how it's all going to turn out, because if you think about it, the factory jobs which actually build wealth in this country hardly need human labor at all! What will we then producing? Where will the displaced workers go?

    In an odd twist of fate, by creating robots to relieve the workload, humans have phased out their usefulness...and with the view that in order to eat what's given on your plate you need to work for it...

    In any case, America won't be the same unless there is some miraculous way to create a shit-ton of jobs (I say infrastructure, a semi-good call by Obama,) not every American will be able to support him or herself without a "welfare state."
    Ti = 19 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Te = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ne = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fi = 15 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Si = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ni = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Se = 11[][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fe = 0

    -----------------
    Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
    Man got to sit and wonder why, why, why;
    Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
    Man got to tell himself he understand

  8. #88
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmandahalf View Post
    Do you guys think it's healthy to seek out a SO with whom one constantly debates? Or is argumentation and one-upmanship better left for friends, with relationships being -fests?
    To seek out someone, who you can constantly debate with is lovely. But someone who constantly needs to debate is a lot of work
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  9. #89
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    I read somewhere that ENTP's relate arguing with intimacy. Strange idea if you ask me. So this question goes to the ENTPs. The more you argue with a person of the opposite sex, the more attracted or interested you are in them? What if the argument turns to anger? Is anger a level of love?

  10. #90
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CindySue View Post
    I read somewhere that ENTP's relate arguing with intimacy. Strange idea if you ask me. So this question goes to the ENTPs. The more you argue with a person of the opposite sex, the more attracted or interested you are in them? What if the argument turns to anger? Is anger a level of love?
    Yes. Oh baby. Yes, angry sex.

    (honestly, I wouldn't engage with a person, if I knew them well enough, and had an iota of respect for them, if I knew they couldn't handle an argument for argument's sake, without getting to that point of personal investment, which leads to anger....and, with a SO it would be a moot point, cuz I would not pick that person as a likely SO for me, if he couldn't handle/understand that key about argument/debating)

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