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  1. #11
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cady View Post
    But does the increasing presence of both extremes mean we'll have more polarization to each extreme in individual personalities or that there will be high expectations for individuals to master both rationality and emotionality?
    Polarization most likely, since that has been the major element of Modernity to begin with. Modern(and especially Hyper-modern) thinking seeks to categorize everything and thus leaves everything fragmented. This leads to the "Barbarism of Specialisation" as José Ortega y Gasset termed it. The result is that one cannot begin to grasp the big picture anymore.

    A more balanced, cosmic, perspective on rationality and emotionality is needed - which was the view of many aspects of Classical-Medieval thought. They gave considerable prominence to intellectual generalists, as opposed to specialists like our era.

    I wish to add a statement made by Major General J.F.C. Fuller which is of relevance to this topic:
    "The more mechanical become the weapons with which we fight, the less mechanical must be the spirit which controls them."

    Although speaking from a military perspective, it still rings true in social matters as a whole.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    A more balanced, cosmic, perspective on rationality and emotionality is needed - which was the view of many aspects of Classical-Medieval thought. They gave considerable prominence to intellectual generalists, as opposed to specialists like our era.
    This issue was addressed in a thread I posted here:
    "It seems foreign to us to take seriously anyone who has an opinion about everything, no matter how well-founded each opinion might be. It used to be, but is no more, that generalists were called philosophers. Aristotle, for instance, wrote about science, politics, logic, ethics, and poetics. Moderns conceive of philosophy in terms of metaphysics, ethics, epistemology — yet forget that the root of the word is philosophia: “love of wisdom.” Philosophy departments usually present the history of thought in a smorgasbord instead of providing a unified backbone for a general outlook on reality.

    Belloc and Chesterton challenge the atomization of study into disciplines which are then divided into substrata. In a world where a person can only speak out on a subject in which he holds a PhD, Chesterton and Belloc had the seeming nerve to speak out on nearly everything. And as other writers in this issue argue, they had a knack for being downright prophetic on nearly every topic they tackled.

    The secret to their successful generalism is not unlike Aristotle’s own. Chesterton and Belloc took the world at face value, rather than trying to codify it into something weird. They were not above common sense. One wonders whether Kant’s sociopolitical commentary would have been quite so arresting and relevant.
    "

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...niversity.html

  3. #13
    Member Cady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    I wish to add a statement made by Major General J.F.C. Fuller which is of relevance to this topic:
    "The more mechanical become the weapons with which we fight, the less mechanical must be the spirit which controls them."

    Although speaking from a military perspective, it still rings true in social matters as a whole.
    I was wondering if the roles wouldn't perhaps be reversed with the rational controlling the emotional? Rational thinkers realizing the importance of emotion when interacting with others and recruiting the necessary people to serve that role? It seems like it could occur both ways. I might be biased though because I generally comprehend reason as being in control of emotion.
    Sleep late for a better tomorrow.

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  4. #14
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cady View Post
    I was wondering if the roles wouldn't perhaps be reversed with the rational controlling the emotional? Rational thinkers realizing the importance of emotion when interacting with others and recruiting the necessary people to serve that role? It seems like it could occur both ways. I might be biased though because I generally comprehend reason as being in control of emotion.
    The experience of the 20th century(and especially 20th century wars) certainly shows how naive such a perspective can be.

    Anyways, I'll have to end it here. It's getting late.

  5. #15
    Member Cady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    The experience of the 20th century(and especially 20th century wars) certainly shows how naive such a perspective can be.

    Anyways, I'll have to end it here. It's getting late.
    I'm not entirely convinced but you seem to have pretty solid evidence and I've yet to explore this concept throughout history.

    Night.

    Edit:

    Wouldn't it be more likely that we see emotional utilizing rational or vice versa depending on the field?
    Sleep late for a better tomorrow.

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  6. #16
    Wannabe genius Splittet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    A more balanced, cosmic, perspective on rationality and emotionality is needed - which was the view of many aspects of Classical-Medieval thought. They gave considerable prominence to intellectual generalists, as opposed to specialists like our era.
    But science has changed considerably since then. Scientists have so much more knowledge now, and you need much more knowledge to be able to contribute to a field. The specialization is necessary because it's nearly impossible to make contribution to a field just based on general knowledge, you must have deep and specialized knowledge. That being said, there is some collaboration between scientists from different disciplines, and that should definitely be encouraged.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Actually it'd be the misuse of math and science. Math and science are indeed tools, which need to be put to proper use. Math and science need to be subordinated to human needs and the dictates of morality, not vice versa.
    There will always be misuse, but I hardly think there can be enough science, if anything I think there has become a widespread skepticism of science, as exemplified by the creationist movement, and it's highly disturbing. These skeptics question the fundamental belief in evidence. How can one choose blind faith over evidence!?

    Quote Originally Posted by Provoker View Post
    As the culture changes and absorbs the inevitable, children will begin to absorb mathematical concepts the way they are currently genetically predisposed to absorb language. Indeed, mathematics will become increasingly vital to our survival as a species in the future.
    That's simply bullshit. Learning spoken language is spontaneous (made possible by genetic predispositions), but children don't learn to read spontaneously and they will never learn math spontaneously either.
    "Neither a lofty degree of intelligence nor imagination nor both together go to the making of genius. Love, love, love, that is the soul of genius." - Wolfgang Amadé Mozart

  7. #17
    Senior Member avolkiteshvara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Excessive rationality and execessive emotionality are the paradoxical aspects of Hyper-Modernity.
    Not sure I'd agree with excessive emotionality. Technology seems to have more isolated society. And if you work from the premise that emotionality is derived from human contact, it would seem to be less of that.

    I remember reading somewhere that Americans are psychologically maturing less quickly than they did even 50 years ago.

    Maybe thats why we there are so many 30 year olds living at home. Well there is probably an econ argument there, but you know.

  8. #18
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Splittet View Post
    But science has changed considerably since then. Scientists have so much more knowledge now, and you need much more knowledge to be able to contribute to a field. The specialization is necessary because it's nearly impossible to make contribution to a field just based on general knowledge, you must have deep and specialized knowledge. That being said, there is some collaboration between scientists from different disciplines, and that should definitely be encouraged.
    No doubt you need specialists; but you also need generalists. We've placed so much emphasis on the former, we've pretty much discarded the latter. That's a huge mistake.

    There will always be misuse, but I hardly think there can be enough science, if anything I think there has become a widespread skepticism of science, as exemplified by the creationist movement, and it's highly disturbing. These skeptics question the fundamental belief in evidence.
    You forget that skepticism towards scientism(not science per se) also comes from Postmodern thinking.

    How can one choose blind faith over evidence!?
    That's building on two false assumptions:
    1)faith and science are necessarily opposites.
    2)empirical evidence is the highest form of truth.

    Both are mistaken.

  9. #19
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Peguy: Who is the bloke in your avatar?

  10. #20
    Sniffles
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    Same guy as always, Ernst Jünger.

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