User Tag List

First 1234 Last

Results 11 to 20 of 35

Thread: Chameleoning

  1. #11
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I'm not oblivious, I customize, which means I'm mostly aware of my audience, hence my chameleoning isn't merely copying behaviors (that's the best explanation I can come up with right now).
    Yup, I think this is the big difference between an INTP (or other novice) using Fe on a very basic level to just mimic what is coming towards them, versus someone who uses Fe naturally and well to elicit a particular response.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #12
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    Have you ever been in the situation where you absolutely know what you want to say, have it on the tip of your tongue, and are so committed to it that you can't think of any other response, but you also know that what you want to say is absolutely the wrong thing to say for social reasons?
    Slight tangent based on this comment (I might move it later if conversation continues):

    btw, do you think Kathy Griffin might be an ENTP?

    Oh, the girl makes me laugh insanely -- she says all the things that I wish I could say in public to get a reaction but that I only would write stories about, due to the inevitable public outcry. And I know she knows what sort of response she's going to receive... but she's a comedienne, so she plunges right ahead.

    I was watching her last night for a bit on bravo, doing stand-up where she talked about her show running for an award against Extreme Home Makeover which had featured a home being built for handicapped kids, who had their own handicapped kid's choir, and how she knew there was no chance she would ever win.

    So inevitably, when EHM's name was announced, she waited until the spotlight crossed in front of her and then she leaped out of her seat and gave them all the bird, said the show was rigged, and told them all to F-off. It was so over-the-top, it was funny... (well, she said it was funny to the fifteen people sitting nearby, but not to the 5000 other people in the room).

    She didn't do it because she necessarily felt that way, except perhaps in the ironic sense; she did it because it was playing against expectations.

    I don't know why I like her, but Andy Dick (who is a similar type personality) tends to annoy me more.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #13

    Default

    If I act as a chameleon, I don't do it on purpose.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  4. #14
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Posts
    3,377

    Default

    While growing up I was a master chameleon. Over the past few years I've been doing it less and less. I think people like you better when you are a chameleon though.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
    http://www.revoltingvegetables.com

  5. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    35

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    While growing up I was a master chameleon. Over the past few years I've been doing it less and less. I think people like you better when you are a chameleon though.

    I think a tiny percentage of people like you more when you are not a chameleon .. but good luck getting F or S (or J in my case) based people to like you when you are not being a chameleon ..

    I follow the personal / work rule .. If I am in a personal environment I don't follow chameleon rules of engagement because I will eventually realize that the relationship I am fostering is superficial .. However in a work environment, chameleon rules of engagement are a necessity in order to survive professionally among a vast number of F/S/J (F - Get too personal, S - No sense of vision, J - Have to have it their way).

  6. #16
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Enneagram
    1w2
    Posts
    5,514

    Default

    Are you defining chameleon behavior as deceptive or attempts to misrepresent yourself or is this just acting differently around different people? I think being a chameleon is a neutral activity, there's nothing wrong with it. You don't act the same way at home as you do at work or even with your friends.

    Changing you behavior depending on your environment isn't being superficial it's multitasking.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  7. #17
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    35

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Are you defining chameleon behavior as deceptive or attempts to misrepresent yourself or is this just acting differently around different people? I think being a chameleon is a neutral activity, there's nothing wrong with it. You don't act the same way at home as you do at work or even with your friends.

    Changing you behavior depending on your environment isn't being superficial it's multitasking.

    Well, I don't think its deceptive in any way.

    To me chameleoning is more the tactic of initially presenting little if anything other than a neutral state while you gauge your environment (Ne) to see what is "appropriate" .. Once the proper behavior required for that given environment has been gauged (Ti), you present only that aspect of yourself, if it exists within you, effectively blending into a very (F/S/J) social construct .. Its a method of "fitting in" to a very practical and rigid society ..

    The reason I call it superficial is because you limit the behavior of yourself according to your environment .. In other words you can not let yourself "go" in a natural and free manner (that would be socially unacceptable) and therefore become a product of your environment .. That to me is superficial ..

    That is why I make the distinction between business and personal .. While I'm willing to go to these lengths in the work force, I refuse to handicap my expression in my personal relationships ..

  8. #18
    Senior Member Recluse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INXP
    Posts
    213

    Default

    Jennifer wrote:

    Yup, I think this is the big difference between an INTP (or other novice) using Fe on a very basic level to just mimic what is coming towards them, versus someone who uses Fe naturally and well to elicit a particular response.
    I would agree with this. Unfortunately, if an unsocialized INTP mimics in an attempt to blend in, they lack the experience to carry it off convincingly and can end up sticking out instead.

    Ygolo wrote:

    If I act as a chameleon, I don't do it on purpose.
    Don't chameleons eat termites?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I didn't say that I didn't say it. I said that I didn't say that I said it. I want to make that very clear.

  9. #19
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w6 so/sx
    Posts
    3,467

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    No, I don't think it is. It just seems more prominent in INTPs because they have no real connection skills (except an adaptation of Ne) to fall back upon in their informal relationships with others, so they rely on a very weak form of Fe to begin with.

    Since there's no real innate sense of how to connect on the emotional levels -- just the intellectual -- the easiest way to not flub up is to mirror what the other person is emoting.

    But this has been examined outside of the MBTI. One book I've read deals with the "monitoring" capability in people, categorizing people for convenience into high monitors and low monitors.

    High monitors implement the chameleon-like ability; they are constantly watching themselves and their actions from the outside and mirroring what is around them (or being who others expect them to be) in order to feel accepted. Low monitors don't seem to have the same ability or desire to look at themselves from the outside and monitor their behavior that way, tending instead to being simply "who they are" and forcing everyone else to deal with the conflicts/disparity.

    Both types are highly visible in INTPs on various INTPs here and on MBTIc. So it's not just an INTP thing. It seems that those with more focus on Ti and less Ne seem to fit the "low monitor" category, while those more focused on Ne and less Ti seem to be higher brands of monitors.

    Yes, low monitor is more common among individuals with high propensities towards introversion. Common among INs, especially INTs. More common among INTPs than INTJs because INTPs tend to have a more solid internal focus and identity. (Dominant Introverted Thinking)

    Most INTPs better identify with the low monitor role, likely those with a low self-esteem (very few as well, as low self-esteem is rather rare among NTs, especially INTPs) would better identify with the high-monitor. This is because those with a high-monitor depend on external circumstances to build their identity (germane to the conventional sense Jung defined extroversion in--deriving identity from the outside), and likely depend on the ostensible approbation of others in order to feel good of themselves--this is germane to FJ, especially EFJ.

    So, we can relate the low monitor persona to INTP and high to ESFJ. N is more adept for low because INs tend to do better with building identity from within than ISs.

    I think that the definition of chameleon, as employed in this thread is sound. However, another way of thinking of it is the ability to adapt to external situations without incurring stress. (Js, especially SFJs have difficulty with this because change by virtue of itself brings about stress, and the more impersonal it is, the more difficult it will be). Yet, NTPs on the other hand cope much better, perhaps better than all types. This is because of their ability to see the big picture (N)--that by virtue of itself allows for them to be more comfortable adapting (they dont get hung up on experiences as guide for exploration of environment as sensors do), improvise better (P), and finally (T)--there will be more on the way of impersonal decisions to make than personal.

    I dont mind improvising so long as I dont have to compromise my inner principles, in that case I just quit. The INTP descriptions that claimed how INTPs are easy going and adaptable most of the time, and yet this changes when their principles are violated were right on...


    To answer the OP question. The chameleon aspect is most highly correlated with a Perceiving preference. NPs do it better than SPs because it is easier for them to juggle many ideas simultaneously because of their more powerful imaginations. So, to narrow it down, it is more of an NP factor than a general P. NTPs improvise better than NFPs because T is more adaptable. And ENTPs better than INTPs because they are less fanatical about guarding the integrity of their principles than INTPs.

    And of course, on the low-high monitoring spectrum, I am on the radical end of the low monitoring type as my Ti is preponderous over my Ne, as this in part is the reason why my inner identity is sound and why my self-esteem is very high.

    Though, as one correction to Jennifer, INTPs who identify better with the high-monitoring type are not influenced by Ne more than Ti in a way that ENTPs are. The case is that they lack self-esteem because they were unable to build a solid inner identity. They just use their Ne to float around, they cant feel at home in the external world by adapting the way that ENTPs can and certainly cant base their self-esteem in accordance to their external situation. They still use Ti more than Ne, yet much less efficiently than their low-monitoring counterparts. (Inefficiently because they tend to have less confidence in their Ti as they havent built a sound inner identity.)
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  10. #20
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w6 so/sx
    Posts
    3,467

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shimpei View Post
    I know an ENFJ who's a big chameleon as well.

    I'd call this conformity. Not being adaptable in way NPs. Being a chameleon means to be able to adapt to the external environment without being tied up to a rigid external identity. If you get tied to one external identity, you wont be a chameleon in the future because you wont be able to adapt to the next situation, as your previous role will preclude you from this. The stronger your J preferrence is, the less of a chameleon you'll be. SJs are the radical Js, NPs are the radical Ps--especially ENPs.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

Similar Threads

  1. [INTP] The Chameleon INTP
    By Cypocalypse in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 04-17-2012, 03:01 PM
  2. [INTP] Chameleons YEA
    By rfossr in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 04-02-2010, 02:03 PM
  3. [Fe] Chameleon facade
    By Dwigie in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 52
    Last Post: 09-29-2009, 09:38 PM
  4. [INTP] Chameleon INTP, and forced extroversion.
    By Cypocalypse in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 08-17-2009, 07:00 PM
  5. Which type is the "chameleon" type?
    By Kiddo in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 45
    Last Post: 03-30-2008, 09:44 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO