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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    Ha! Told you we were fluffy and wuvable. It's a ruse. How many have you taken home to "care for"?

    We're even charming when we're not being charming.
    D'oh! foiled again! To answer your question, far too many.

  2. #62
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  3. #63
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    i think thats where growing up comes in.

    im a strongly typed ENTP but i do know that my Fe is fairly well developed. i might not empathize with people due to my strong NT nature but i can sympathize with them....and i do what i know is right and disregard what i think might be right cuz thats usually inconsiderate of others

  4. #64
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    yesterday i was actually confused if i might be going over to ENFP but then i thought about it and coexistence of a Ti and Fe sounds much more like it....or thats what i think

  5. #65
    you are right mippus's Avatar
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    scary thoughts don't last too long
    Vanitas vanitatum omnia vanitas

  6. #66
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    I love that the thread right above this one is "NT Charm."
    Something Witty

  7. #67
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I love that the thread right above this one is "NT Charm."
    Yeah, it's a fine line.

  8. #68
    Senior Member ed111's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aderack View Post
    George Burns, I believe. I seem to have misplaced the certificate.
    I wasn't talking to you in particular. I was making a random offensive comment that might have seemed amusing in the context of this thread.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I think jokes/joking comments are a different thing altogether, though. For me, funny is funny, and if you succeed in making me laugh, then I won't care if it was insensitive or what have you. I'd have laughed pretty hard at the above comment, and I'd have also known that you weren't being oblivious and rude, just trying to lighten the situation by injecting some humor.
    That's the thing tho, isn't it? What's funny to an NT is perhaps offensive to someone else. We are quite hard to offend. Sometimes, even if I do find something hurtful/offensive, I'll reason myself out of it. I'll conclude that I've no right to feel that way. But most people won't. They always believe their feelings are entirely valid.

    It seems to me that "rudeness" is a pretty subjective thing. The things I find rude (e.g. asking too many personal questions, invading my personal space, expecting me to participate in meaningless social rituals, judging my lifestyle, asking stupid questions rather than doing a bit of research) might be considered normal or inoffensive by the prevailing majority so I just have to put up with it.

    The things I do that others might consider rude (stuff like being late, forgetting appointments and anniversaries, zoning out, forgetting to return a phone call, sarcastic humour, honest criticism, not smiling or engaging in mundane pleasantries) either don't bother me, or actually appeal when I encounter them in others. Why should I embrace someone else's values about what is acceptable and what isn't?
    I think truly rude people are either a) totally oblivious to the tone of their comments, b) not caring whether they come across as rude, because they're more concerned with themselves than others' feelings, or c) wanting to disarm/assert a dominant position through shock value or an attempt to lower someone's confidence or self-esteem.

    Probably most NT fall in the a) category, because we have very little interest in being the alpha dog.
    I don't think we're oblivious to the tone so much as oblivious as to the effect. In order to be aware of that effect you have to be able to empathise. But if what you are saying wouldn't cause you offense if someone said it to you, then empathy doesn't really work. Instead you have to learn a whole set of rules about how other people's minds work. It's like being mildly autistic.

    Sometimes frustration and impatience emerge as rudeness/intolerance. We are known for not suffering fools gladly.

    (c) is interesting. I hadn't thought of it as being a strategy for dominance. I like to shock (and be shocked, within reason) because I like novelty and hate cliche. Shock tactics can make you think about something in a new way, and I always welcome that. A lot of people don't though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by juggernaut View Post
    For years my ESFJ mother has been on my case about my lack of consideration for other people's feeling, or put more plainly, my rudeness. I've always known her opinion of me was fairly accurate.

    What I'm wondering is whether rudeness is the true defining feature of the NT personality? For a while I thought it was, perhaps, just an NTJ thing. Then I realized that were just as many, if not more, rude NTPs. After that I considered that the rude/not rude split might be along E/I lines....now I feel fairly confident that the INTs are just as rude as the ENTs. Are NTs, as a group, just rude people?

    Disclaimer: If you think you're a polite NT, please feel free to politely share with us why you think that's the case. I don't want to start another flamewar between the NTs, I just would like to know how other NTs see themselves.

    hmm.. rudeness, one of the most frequent complaints I get from people (who are courageous enough to tell me that)
    I think one reason for this is because we value honesty a lot lot more than being nice. Since we are trying to be efficient and to the point, our honesty (even if they're sincere) comes off as being extremely blunt. Another reason is because we're focused into fixing or solving a problem so we tend to eliminate the social graces and the "beating around the bush" because they're ineffective and a total waste of time.

    In my opinion, the delivery is as important as the truth. People can be defensive when the delivery is wrong so what I just said (even if it's the truth) becomes useless. People are more likely to accept the truth if the delivery is acceptable and non-judgmental.

    On the emotional perspective, putting emphasis on the delivery means caring for the other person's feelings.

    On the thinking perspective, delivery is just part of the equation for producing results.

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