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  1. #31
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by professor goodstain View Post
    Who does one learn from the most? A tactful person that masks truths in order to keep an audience or an honest person that presents reality no matter how bad it hurts.
    Honesty gives birth to its own audience.
    Does Simon Cowell ring a bell?
    Massive audience for his brutal honesty.
    It's like a car crash.
    Everyone slows down on the highway to take a look.

    People have said to me they might not always like how I say things,
    but they always know where they stand with me.
    That is why they trust me.
    I don't blow sunshine up the ass of anyone.
    And I don't want anyone doing it to me.

    Could you trust someone who always said,
    "Daaaaaaaaahling you look maaaaaahvalussssssss."

    Rubbish.

    Years ago in my sales meetings I would go over the results of the prior week.
    You can be humorous in your honesty and yes,
    everyone laughed when I would tell people:
    "God damn you sucked last week!"
    But you see, I was laughing while I said it.
    That's not cruel, people just knew that was my style.

  2. #32
    Senior Member professor goodstain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    But you see, I was laughing while I said it.
    That's not cruel, people just knew that was my style.
    Yes. i am familiar with this courtesy laugh lol
    Last edited by professor goodstain; 05-06-2009 at 04:00 PM. Reason: oops. wrong one
    everyone uses every function about evenly. take NE for example. if there are those who don't use it much, then why are there such massive amounts of people constantly flowing through Wallmart with 20 items or less?

  3. #33
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Hey there. Udog. I wish to mask my tactful intentions in a very deceitful unbecoming manner in order to manipulate your mind parts. You will comply.
    I already sent the $1,000 in Canadian bills to the P.O. Box previously specified. How much more do you need?

  4. #34
    ✿ڿڰۣஇღ♥ wut ♥ღஇڿڰۣ✿ digesthisickness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    You can be humorous in your honesty and yes,
    everyone laughed when I would tell people:
    "God damn you sucked last week!"
    But you see, I was laughing while I said it.
    That's not cruel, people just knew that was my style.
    i use this approach a LOT. but, i'm careful to pay attention to whether the person is just faking being okay with it. sometimes, others pretend to not take it personally when they really do.

    ...

    'course, like i said, it depends on the person. with some, i want them to take it as personally as possible.

    right up the ass.
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    `*.¸.*'ღϠ₡ღஇڿڰۣ
    •.¸¸. Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒჱܓ. இڿڰۣ.¸¸.இڿڰۣ´¯`·.─♥


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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    I got Dennis Leary's "I'm an ASSHOLE, oeoeoeoeholleee" on loop in my head now.
    Ah, there it is. I was mentally singing that as I read this thread but couldn't remember where it was from.

  6. #36
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    I already sent the $1,000 in Canadian bills to the P.O. Box previously specified. How much more do you need?
    I can't pay for our matching uniforms with just $1000 Canadian dollars! Pony up! These have rocket skates and stuff!
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
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    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  7. #37
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post

    I disagree that there is some kind of external mechanism of getting to the core of a human being. If there was, along the same line of thinking, your argument about MBTI being useless would be nullified.
    I never said there was an "external mechanism," Spock.

    You thought only the person would know what was true of their inner self.
    I contend they are usually the last to realize it.

    It reminds me of Dahmer on the witness stand in court,
    being asked why he killed all those people.
    He said, "I'd like to know the answer to that myself."


    MBTI tries to categorize personality traits
    You cannot categorize traits when the method of collection is flawed to begin with.
    I'm referring to forced-choice questions.

    Example:

    Who do you love more:
    A) Mom
    B) Dad

    Only a complete fool would draw conclusions based upon the forced-choice of A or B,
    then claim X, Y, or Z is true about a person, as a personality type.

    Here's another question:

    At a party I:
    A) Listen
    B) Talk.

    I am not deaf , I do both.

    These are the types of assininical questions that are used to "categorize" traits.

    I'd say MBTI ranks as high in value to me as the spotted owl society.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    I never said there was an "external mechanism," Spock.

    You thought only the person would know what was true of their inner self.
    I contend they are usually the last to realize it.
    So, who's the first? And, how do they realize?

    Btw, let's clear your inference of my thoughts first. I said that as close to knowing the 'true core of oneself' goes, (1) it is subjective (meaning there's no ONE TRUTH, to sum up each human...I'm inferring this since humans are kinda prone to change over life course), (2) closest a person will get is themselves, not an outsider (aka, external medium/mechanism/another person giving them evaluations, etc). So, you gotta be careful with inferring that bolded 'only' in my statements. I didn't say that.

    Now, you didn't say there was an external mechanism, but, it is again logically inferred. Your underlined (in specific the bold). If they're the last, that means, there's "others" that are the first, second, third.... That is what I'm referring to, the external. Unless all the first, second, third, and last lie all within one person. I call it mechanism, because the other (person) is only relevant in terms of the mechanics of how they sum up a person/their inner core...to our discussion at hand. I argue, it's only through actions/behaviours that any 'other' (external mechanism) can ever know a person.

    You're saying nope, the deepest core of consciousness of a person is actually gleaned LAST by that specific individual but by others FIRST. So, I ask, giving it the name, external to mean the others (i.e., not spurred from self)....who are these others? And, how do they glean such information?

    It reminds me of Dahmer on the witness stand in court,
    being asked why he killed all those people.
    He said, "I'd like to know the answer to that myself."
    Healthy individuals, my friend, healthy. Not those needing clinical psychologists (like I mentioned already). It's kind of a 'duh' that if you are not generally mentally healthy and sane, in accord with the free society, having understanding of your deepest inner core is only one of YOUR MANY worries in terms of reaching a healthy self.

    You cannot categorize traits when the method of collection is flawed to begin with.
    I'm referring to forced-choice questions.
    That could be very well be your criticism of MBTI, I didn't know (couldn't have)...I wasn't disputing it. I just gave you my criticism of MBTI to make a point. It uses behaviour to predict unconscious motivations, without filling in the gap of how motivations leads to outwardly manifested behaviours. Thus, how could we truly know that whatever X behaviours we see are caused by X motivation, rather than, maybe, to avoid Y motivation which can still manifest as X behaviour?
    Using that jump-off, I argued that this gap inbetween mental processing to behaviour could make a case for why the external/other/outsiders can't always truly know the internal state of a person. Because it hinges on the assumption that they're filling in that aforementioned gaps correctly. Which, I'm challenging.

    EDIT: To add ** for those that are not fully healthy, seek help - the above does not apply, as I've already started off giving props to the clinical psychologists, let's just add to that, to be comprehensive - therapist, life coach, soul guru, whatever. These are professionals (some on the list) who have learned how to predict from a set of behaviours/behavioural patterns/patterns of thought what could reliably and validly be the internal motivation of said individual when they come to them (get forced to come to them) because they may feel angsty that they're veerying from the mentally healthy path. This, I see as confounding/noise to obviously finding some ephiphany about one's true core.

  9. #39
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Can someone summarize what is going on in this thread so I can join in?
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  10. #40
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Summary:

    First we were asked how we tone it down, a few said that we try to think before we speak and we illustrated our methods of doing so. Then arguing starting happening about labeling people assholes instead of saying that they are occasionally acting like assholes. There is also a sub argument going about whether being tactful is in fact being deceitful. You are up to speed.

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