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  1. #1
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Arrow The NT Prejudice Against Feeling

    One of the unfortunate consequences of a classification system like MBTi is that it encourages a reactionary mindset against other types and tendencies rather than encouraging the view of there being a boundary-less, complex spectrum of behavior in which the value of each "type" expression is largely situational. Factionalism is a consequence of defining type.

    One problem I have is with the NT prejudice against Feeling. As if being dispassionate is a virtue, applied generally. There seems to be this idea that being an NT means cutting loose from emotional motivations or values, as if this is even possible. Rational sense must work in concert with emotional sense to achieve wholeness as a person. There is really no division. So, why do we NT's devalue "feeling" or at least leading with a feeling orientation? How do you personally define feeling? Can you be healthy and dispassionate?
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  2. #2
    DoubleplusUngoodNonperson
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    dude, that prejudice is there even w/o the MBTI..... if not, go to your local Uni and find the mathematics department, the raw NTJness can crush anyone with a respectable EQ. Talk about zero sympathies/empathies..... I should tell you about B**** (name edited in case USF reads this or something!), our resident slavik alcoholic math prof (brilliant in math though ) .... he's so sexist and says women don't belong in the mathematics department. I'm sure the NFs LOVE hearing that one! I think he's had sexual harassment issues in the past, too. However, I can almost guarantee you Boris would not have heard nor care about MBTI .... anything other than math is shit, anyway!


    I think, if anything, that MBTI helps raise understanding about differences more than it exacerbates existing ones

  3. #3
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Actually, it's just a general sort of prejudice any human being of any type goes through. NTs often dismiss feelings because:
    1. Feelings are not rational.
    2. Values have no totally "objective" basis, you can't argue "down" to the basics of values, they just exist.
    3. The primary strength/defense of NTs is the rational ability and it was unable to protect them from those who did not share it -- values use a different ruleset, T-style rationality had no power, so F-style values might have actually caused NTs some serious harm during childhood or even later in life.
    4. Religion is usually centered around values, not Thinking with a secure foundation, and the predominate religions in the United States have been aggressive and impacted society in irrational negative ways.


    The list goes on and on...

    but my point is that while it's worth discussion (in order to achieve greater awareness of one's inherent biases), the thing is that the situation cannot be avoided, it can only be navigated through.

    Every human being starts with a particular approach to life. Contrary approaches are at first seen as a threat and are misunderstood. Values and emotions tend to be at the opposite end of the spectrum for NTs, whose strengths do not give them power over these things. So they treat those things as an enemy. Eventually all people learn to integrate and develop lesser-preferred ways of seeing and doing things, in order to become more versatile and successful in life; hopefully, NTs develop a sense of how to exist in their bodies and thus identify WITH their emotions (rather than viewing feelings as "aliens"), as well as how to believe passionately in things they particularly value even if they cannot rationally justify those values to others.

    MBTI is simply a language that puts a face on it, but the stereotypes, fears, prejudices, etc., would exist with or without the language. MBTI is not the enemy, it just is an algebra that can be used to understand how these forces interact.

    ...note: didn't see Noz's post before I posted... interesting.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #4
    Senior Member Jeremy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Can you be healthy and dispassionate?
    I think a better question is "Can you be human and be dispassionate?" Many people who use the MBTI and define themselves as T manage to convince themselves that they never make a decision based solely (or even partially) on their feelings, and that logic is the only thing they ever use. I've seen it quite often. These people are, in reality, some of the most emotional people that there are. Their reaction against what they perceive as the "weakness" of feeling is probably one of the most feeling-based judgements that one can make. "If I make decisions based on feeling, then I will be perceived as weak to others or to myself. I don't want to be perceived as weak, so I will not do so."

    To be truly "rational", people need to realize that feeling is a necessary component of life - rational decisions are reached through both logic and through your values. They aren't mutually exclusive. You can use logic to figure out your values, or you can validate your values through logic, but to be a truly balanced person, both are required. The MBTI arbitrarily splits them into two categories, but even the most feeling oriented person has some sort of logical backing for who they are. The most logically oriented people still have a background of values that define who they are, not based on any rational principle.

    So get it through your heads, Ts. You have just as much capacity for F-based judgements as Fs do for T-based judgements. Throwing that part of yourself into your shadow just makes it come out in immature and childish ways, which people on this forums have labeled "emotional retardedness". The MBTI doesn't only define your persona - it also gives you a path to reach out to the areas in which you don't excel, and learn how to use them effectively.
    "Can you set me free from this dark inner world? Save me now, last beats in the soul.."

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  5. #5
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy View Post
    To be truly "rational", people need to realize that feeling is a necessary component of life - rational decisions are reached through both logic and through your values. They aren't mutually exclusive. You can use logic to figure out your values, or you can validate your values through logic, but to be a truly balanced person, both are required. The MBTI arbitrarily splits them into two categories, but even the most feeling oriented person has some sort of logical backing for who they are. The most logically oriented people still have a background of values that define who they are, not based on any rational principle.
    Well said.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  6. #6
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Rational sense must work in concert with emotional sense to achieve wholeness as a person.
    I get this. The types that thing rational means you're devoid of emotion. Not true. I also dislike other types that say...how can you enjoy anything if you're always looking at things logically/rationally/analytically. How do you look at things like a flake who doesn't care what happens tomorrow? See what I mean?

    I also don't feel I should conform to being a more emotional person because it's the healthy thing to be and definitely the more feminine thing, in my case. I choose who feelings and emotion are show to but I do show them. I do believe they can work together successfully though depending on the individual, maturity level, life experiences and such. Moderation yanno.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  7. #7
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    I'm not a NT, but I am a strong "T" and feelings do take a back seat to thinking in my brain most of the time. But there are exceptions, like mode of operation, or setting.

    Examples:

    (1) Work / School: I am here to accomplish tasks that do not require my use of feelings.

    (2) Home / Personal Life: Many of my experiences here are all about feelings, thinking takes a back seat.

  8. #8
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    How is this prejudice? We can't be prejudice against feelers until we observe them on a feeler-by-feeler basis, it's not like racial prejudice, where you can have an unfavorable opinion of someone beforehand without having met them, based on color.

  9. #9
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Maybe I am completely wrong but I think that NTs don't have a problems with emotions.
    They have a problem with the amount of emotion.

  10. #10
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Maybe I am completely wrong but I think that NTs don't have a problems with emotions.
    They have a problem with the amount of emotion.
    Can you develop this further?
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

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