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  1. #1
    Member Petite Etoile's Avatar
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    Default HELP ME CONSTRUCT AN ARGUMENT.

    .
    Last edited by Petite Etoile; 04-04-2009 at 08:51 PM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Best argument is that he's not mature enough and doesn't have the experience to determine what truly makes him happy. He says: but that's true of any relationship where the participants are immature. You respond: True, but the age disparity creates a relationship that is vulnerable to exploitation, which is an element that's absent in relationships where both parties have similar maturity and experience.

  3. #3
    The Destroyer Colors's Avatar
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    Who cares what your boyfriend thinks? Is *he* the woman dating a minor in another state?

    What are you going to do about it?

  4. #4
    Member Petite Etoile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colors View Post
    Who cares what your boyfriend thinks? Is *he* the woman dating a minor in another state?

    What are you going to do about it?
    No no no, he's not dating anyone else lol.. i just care because i feel really strongly about this and i know if i could come up with a better argument he'd also agree with me.

  5. #5
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I think that people should always be free to do whatever they want, provided they are aware of all the potential consequences. If and when I have children, I will prepare them with all the knowledge I can, that way if they choose to use heroin, it will be a well thought out choice knowing that the use of such a drug can, and most likely will, lead to abuse and destruction. You can't stop someone from doing what they want, but you must prepare them for the outcomes or else you have failed as a parent. Would you ever let a child skydive without a parachute?

    That being said, how can a child at 14 possibly walk into a situation like that and fully know the potential outcome of stunted growth and emotional damage? Can a child of 14 (now 16) be truly aware of what it means to enter into an adult relationship? Having children, paying bills, being an emotional support system? When you think about life stages, this woman is entering a time where she will soon have dependents - children or aging parents. Meanwhile her "boyfriend" has not had experience or practice time to get up to speed - especially on the fluid concept of love. Does he truly love her, or is he fascinated by the attention? He will feel quickly overwhelmed, while she will be unfulfilled. She is robbing him of his youth in a desperate attempt to hold on to her own.

    At the end of the day, "they" are not hurting anyone but she is definitely hurting him. Straddling him with unfair burdens at such a young age, to make up for her own emotional insecurities, is a tragedy. There must be a reason why she cannot identify with people in her own age group or maturity level. Abuse is a constant cycle, and whatever abuse she has suffered must not be passed on to the next generation. And this is abuse. A person of her age has mental capacities to convince a child of anything. She can persuade and coerce his fragile mind to accept her realities. His brain is not yet fully formed. It's like the emotional manifestation of Chinese foot binding. Everyone has the right to freedom, as your boyfriend says, but where is this young boy's freedom? This is pure exploitation.

    I am not a stickler for rules, but I am die hard advocate against crimes toward children and the defenseless. My personal feeling is that you should do everything in your power to make that child's parents aware of the situation. I truly believe that it does take a village to raise a child. If you saw a car approaching a child, would you not pull the kid to safety?? I'm not getting on a moral high horse and I hope you don't feel like I am, I just urge you to think about this child being your child. How would you feel as a parent? We are not separate from the world outside, we live symbiotically.

    Question: would your boyfriend see a problem if it was a 26 (now 28) year old man with a 14 (now 16) year old girl? Just because the genders are reversed, does not make it ok. The strongest point, however, is that it is against the law. For a damn good reason. Seriously, call his parents - who cares what your boyfriend says?

  6. #6
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petite Etoile View Post
    i know someone who is a 28 year old woman dating a 16 year old boy in a different state. She claims they are in love and are soulmates and they've been dating almost 2 years but they waited to meet until he was of legal age of consent (thats what she says anyway).
    YOU: hey, these guys are our friends, let's have them over for dinner; you and the kid can play X-Box.

    ENTP: Great! [blah blah blah, and so on]

    and after a while he works out for himself that it's stupid.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
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    Doesn't sound like it'll be possible to win the arguement against your boyfriend. I'm more curious as to why you feel the need to do so.

    With regards to the relationship.
    It's not as if being in the situation will suddenly remove his capability to develop emotional/intellectual maturity. At what age would he suddenly understand so it'll be fine? Would it have changed if he was 17/18 and the women in her 30s?

  8. #8
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    You feel its wrong, and he feels its up to the subject.

    Fi vs Fe

    Fe has a hard time understanding a personal value system in the first place, so it is pretty hard to get through to an ENTP about anything seriously ethical. I'm sure he doesn't care that much, so why is your goal to make him both care and agree with you? I'm sure there are better things you two can talk about, no offense.

    Sorry I'm not helping that much.

    I'm just saying, even if he did agree with you, he probably wouldn't care much. If he's showing any thought about it now, it's likely quite temporary. He's bound to agree with you if you become more emotional about it. But can't you see that it's really beside the point?

    ENTPs are lawyers. That means any reality you throw at him will be twisted to aid his argument.

  9. #9
    Rats off to ya! Mort Belfry's Avatar
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    I agree with your boyfriend.

    i think this will have a major impact on the child as he is not emotionally and psychology developed.
    Have you asked the kid if he's happy? If you do and get anything short of a no then you have no business to intervene further.

    And how do you think people get emotionally and psychologically developed in this way? It's through these relationships; so the girl he's "with" is ten years older than what would be normal; what difference does that really make? What if he's just plain not interested in girls of his age? Who is anyone to tell him he's wrong?

    Just because the woman is stubborn, doesn't make it okay for people to just sit with their arms crossed because the couple is happy.
    The couple's happy? What's the problem then? Apart from the fact it offends your sensibilities. As lemons said, this is Fi vs Fe. Benevolent Fe is helping people get what they want while Fi is wanting people to want what you want. Why should their relationship be affected by your values? In another time and place somebody could be trying to construct the same arguments against gay or interracial couples. These sentiments never last throughout the ages.

    SO--- People who AGREE with me: what flaws can i find in his argument to make him see that there SHOULD be intervention
    I realise that you made the words "agree" and "should" capital because you didn't want to hear opposing arguments so you can convince your boyfriend to believe what you believe, but he NEVER will. You cannot fault his logic unless the boy is totally non-consensual in the matter which it does not sound like he is.

    And I really think maybe it should be your boyfriend who convinces you otherwise, just a thought.
    Why do we always come here?

    I guess we'll never know.

    It's like a kind of torture,
    To have to watch this show.

  10. #10
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemons View Post
    Fe has a hard time understanding a personal value system in the first place, so it is pretty hard to get through to an ENTP about anything seriously ethical. I'm sure he doesn't care that much, so why is your goal to make him both care and agree with you? I'm sure there are better things you two can talk about, no offense.
    Sorry, enough with the stereotypes. I'm an ENTP and you saw what I wrote above. We are not devoid of understanding personal value systems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Belfry View Post
    I agree with your boyfriend.
    Have you asked the kid if he's happy? If you do and get anything short of a no then you have no business to intervene further.
    I hope that you never see a grown man sniffing around your daughter when you have a child of your own. I'm pretty sure you'd be singing a different tune. But hey, as long as the kid is happy, right?

    Parents should make sure kids are happy, but not at the expense of their safety. Period. That's the point of being a legal guardian.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kai View Post
    With regards to the relationship.
    It's not as if being in the situation will suddenly remove his capability to develop emotional/intellectual maturity. At what age would he suddenly understand so it'll be fine? Would it have changed if he was 17/18 and the women in her 30s?
    The fact that it started almost 2 years prior, when the child was about 14, is what raises serious red flags. That's a high school freshman.

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