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[NT] ENTP vs ENTJ: who is more powerful

ENTP vs ENTJ, who is more powerful?

  • ENTP

    Votes: 75 36.4%
  • ENTJ

    Votes: 131 63.6%

  • Total voters
    206

Qre:us

New member
Joined
Nov 21, 2008
Messages
4,890
Medium Extreme:
1. the ENTJ, what he lacks in creativity, is made up for in insight and planning
2. the ENTP, what he lacks in planning, is made up for in creativity/luck

edge: draw

let me resolve this for you:

1. the medium types, do infact fall more on their secondary functions, thats why they are more moderate.

This just replaces one contradiction with another. If medium types fall on their secondary function (which I don't really understand the logic of), but, we'll go with it, then........your original comment is contradictory to your subsequent one.

ENTP then would rely on their Ti, not, Ne, being of the 'medium' type...which would lead to.....creativity? Over Ne?

3. One who has no plan, is more at the whim of luck. ENTPs have such an ability to roll with whatever (creative way of 'living'), that it almost doesnt matter what happens, they will make it look "lucky". This is why being creative can often look like luck. Its like how random mutations can be selected for adaptations that appear very 'planned and adaptive'.

4. I would bet that EPs probably would rate themselves as being luckier than other types would, yes.

Did I not tap into what you're said in that earlier post of mine, when I explained how you probably are meaning 'luck'?

You'd inevitably have to dig into what you really mean by 'luck', and, that would probably lead us towards discussion of opportunities (which, are created through insight and manipulation of a situation at hand - bending the environment to one's will versus bending to the environment).


OR, its the ability to move energy per unit of time :D

(or more simple, work/t)

No contest (for once :tongue:)

(and before you get pissy, ENTPs have many other talents).
Yup, like humility and a quiet, harmony-seeking demeanor.
 

Rangler

New member
Joined
Jan 19, 2009
Messages
319
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
3w8
Sorry man, I trust some sources more than other, and rather than direct copy/paste (also known as 'lack of thinking' and if done deliberately, plagiarism), I try to word it in my own way.

Here's one, and it comes with reference/citations....imagine. :shock:

Feminist Perspectives on Power (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

*section 1
[there are plenty of other sources, not just in that blurb of feminism - all within the same portal (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philsophy)]. Check with it.

Forgive me for trusting Standford Encyclopedia of Philosophy over Wikipedia. It's probably the elitist in me (not).:rolli:

But...um, thanks for that commendable effort. :coffee: *two thumbs up!!*

Btw, I'll even elaborate on what I mean by change - and broaden it to mean 'an action'/an act.

Oh yeah, EDIT: FAIL!

In this context, Cloud's definition is what we're talking about.
 

Qre:us

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Messages
4,890
In this context, Cloud's definition is what we're talking about.

I'm gonna call your bluff that you didn't even read my definition, nor the link from which I got 'my' definition, versus, that of cloud's (Wiki)...as I don't really see the contradition. Can you point me to how mine contradicts the Wiki link of cloud's? I'm...um...intrigued. :huh:


Hint: my commentary/criticism on cloud's link was not a challenge to his defintion, but, more to the fact that he missed the critical thought entailed within the definition provided by me, which is glossed over in Wiki/cloud's. Hence, my reply to his comment that I 'should provide a better definition' (i.e., his link pretty much said the same thing mine did, just with a more superficial summary - hence, the skepticism about using Wiki as a source and cloud's understanding [and it seems, yours as well] of what my definition posited).
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
1,755
3. One who has no plan, is more at the whim of luck. ENTPs have such an ability to roll with whatever (creative way of 'living'), that it almost doesnt matter what happens, they will make it look "lucky". This is why being creative can often look like luck. Its like how random mutations can be selected for adaptations that appear very 'planned and adaptive'.


(or more simple, work/t)


It is not we have no plan. we learn from experience and failure, which is far more fesible than following a plan that does not work in reality.
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
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Aug 3, 2008
Messages
1,755
Maybe we aren't as evil as people claim we are. Maybe we are not hell bent on taking over the world. We can be forceful at times, but that doesn't translate into a desire to control everything. We don't claim to have this power and we don't claim to be invincible, so quit making assumptions that are not sound. A healthy ENTJ is a good leader, and I think that is a fairly indisputable characteristic. A well rounded individual (quite possibly an ENTJ) that was capable of using both hard and soft power would have the highest likelihood of world domination, but sure a well rounded individual would have no interest in that kind of power. And Hitler was no ENTJ.

It is not a matter of whether you want to, it is more of an issue whether you have what it takes or power to do so
 

Qre:us

New member
Joined
Nov 21, 2008
Messages
4,890
3. One who has no plan, is more at the whim of luck. ENTPs have such an ability to roll with whatever (creative way of 'living'), that it almost doesnt matter what happens, they will make it look "lucky". This is why being creative can often look like luck. Its like how random mutations can be selected for adaptations that appear very 'planned and adaptive'.

It is not we have no plan. we learn from experience and failure, which is far more fesible than following a plan that does not work in reality.

I think ENTJs also learn from experience and failure (as do most people, regardless of type): it's called conditioning. What BabylonCandle was contrasting with plan for the ENTP is....improvisation. Which I agree.
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
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Well, ENTJs abhor failure from my understanding, they would do anything to avoid randomness and black swarn phenomenon, They are sort of like intjs in this way.

Whereas ENTP would not, thet would learn how to deal with it and learn from the experience, even if there is nothing to gain.
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
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Aug 3, 2008
Messages
1,755
Yea kind of.

for instance this is a difference between the type in a chess game

ENTP: have no plan, move randomly and slowly learn from experience and the changing circumstances

ENTJ: device a perfect plan for checkmate, and ruthlessly follow that plan, but cannot react when certain variables work against them.
 

Apollanaut

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Aug 27, 2008
Messages
550
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Depends what you mean by "power", but I'd say it's a close tie. ENTJs are more likely to conquer the world, while ENTPs are more likely to destroy it:

ENTJ: The Evil Overlord

The ENTJ is best characterized by his charisma, his ability to grasp complex situations and to think flexibly and creatively, his keen and active intelligence, and his overwhelming desire to crush the world beneath his boot. ENTJs are naturally outgoing and love the company of other people, particularly minions, henchmen, slaves, and the others they rule with ruthless efficiency.

ENTJs usually die at the hand of secret government agents in a fiery cataclysm that destroys their entire underground fortress. Often, Evil Overlords will have a secret clone whose implanted memories contain all the knowledge and ambition of the original, stored in cryogenic suspension in a safe location. The clone will appear in a sequel.

RECREATION: ENTJs enjoy spending their leisure time in groups, seeking out the company of others with whom they can exchange strategies and ideas, and test their mind control rays. They also enjoy competitive games which challenge them intellectually, such as chess, go, and "tell me where the missiles are or I'll open the piranha cage and the girl dies."

COMPATIBILITY: Ideal companions include ENTPs, whose inventive natures often most useful; and ESTJs, who make excellent henchmen once the neural realignment is complete. ENTJs often employ the services of ISTJs but don't usually make good romantic partners with them. Under no circumstances should an ENTJ ever date an ENFJ; no good can come of it.

Famous ENTJs include Ming the Merciless, John Bigboote, and Charles Montgomery Burns.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ENTP: The Mad Scientist

The ENTP, like the ENTJ, is charismatic, outgoing, and intelligent. ENTPs are often quick-witted, clever, and genial; they typically display a highly organized, rational cognitive ability which makes them natural scientists and inventors.

ENTPs are creative, complex people who seek to improve their understanding of the natural world, usually by building armoured fifty-story-tall robotic monsters with iron jaws and death-ray eyes, or by creating genetically mutated plagues that spread unstoppably across the land, turning all who are contaminated into mindless zombie drones. They are less likely to want to conquer the world than to destroy it utterly, reducing it to nothing but slag and rubble--though this is often merely a side-effect of their pursuit of knowledge.

RECREATION: ENTPs enjoy recreational activities which challenge them physically and intellectually, such as water skiing and porting Linux to their iPods. They are also fond of collecting gadgets like combination cellphone/PDAs and orbiting arsenals of brain lasers, which they may port Linux to as well.

COMPATIBILITY: ENTPs and ENTJs make natural companions, as the one's unspeakable hunger for power complements the other's unspeakable hunger for knowledge. They do not generally build successful relationships with ESFJs, as ENTPs they are prone to behaving in inconveniently erratic ways, which pisses ESFJs off to no end; and because ENTPs simply do not know how to dress appropriately for formal occasions.

Famous ENTPs include Spencer Silver (the inventor of Post-It Notes), Robert Oppenheimer, and Dr. Jekyll.
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
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Depends what you mean by "power", but I'd say it's a close tie. ENTJs are more likely to conquer the world, while ENTPs are more likely to destroy it.

What function(s) are neccessary to conquer the world, appollonaut?
 

yenom

Alexander the Terrible
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If I can dominate the world by having a mega Te, I guess anyone can conquer the world. Maybe ESTJs could do it too.
 

entropie

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entp
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14 to 21 ? Shame on you ignorant people !
 

Apollanaut

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What function(s) are neccessary to conquer the world, appollonaut?

Te, without a doubt! Fe is a close second, but only by becoming a cult leader!
 

Apollanaut

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If I can dominate the world by having a mega Te, I guess anyone can conquer the world. Maybe ESTJs could do it too.

I thought they already had!
 

Bougal

HUZZAH!
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
708
MBTI Type
ENTP
It is not a matter of whether you want to, it is more of an issue whether you have what it takes or power to do so

Last time I checked there were no ultimate rulers of the world. You are thinking on too grand of a scale, and the scale is irrelevant. I think you need to assess the individual’s power within their actual environment.
 

Kalach

Filthy Apes!
Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
4,310
MBTI Type
INTJ
Last time I checked there were no ultimate rulers of the world. You are thinking on too grand of a scale, and the scale is irrelevant. I think you need to assess the individual’s power within their actual environment.

Werl... if Mao was ENTP, he came pretty damn close. By official stats he was overlord to 1 out of 4 people in the world. (And had a lot of them killed.)

Who've you got on the score card, Bill Gates?


(And for the record, if we knew just how many Bill has had killed, we could declare a default winner in this poll. Guestimates anyone?)
 
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