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  1. #41
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by untypable View Post
    Man, you don't have to write an essay to prove to everyone you are an entp.
    if people mistyped you, let them believe it. And if it really comes to that, I would rather be typeless thatn justifyinhg myself.

    I once got typed as an INFP by an someone who thinks they know better than me about the MBTI I was pissed, but so what. These things happen, some people like to shove BS into other people;s throats. Just let them believe what they say. and give a HO HO LOL.
    I like writing essays, and I'm learning from this exchange with him. If he can show me good reason that I'm really not ENTP then I want to know about it.

    The attempt to find fault with what he's saying is part of my learning process. I'm not doing it just to convince him personally; I just enjoy aggressive argumentation as a method of exchanging ideas.

    His last post gave me a lot more faith in his level of understanding of these concepts. Before, I thought he was just trolling, so I wasn't taking him too seriously because he hadn't shown me any reason I should. I was trying to be entertaining/appear to be winning.

    Now that I'm convinced I can learn something from him, and that he actually has a motive beyond trolling, my tone will soften a lot.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #42
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Iím guessing heís not a eunuch and that heís really a she

    Quote Originally Posted by Nocap View Post
    She doesn't have a dick.

  3. #43
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    That was some intense reading, and I don't care enough about this topic to contribute anything relevant.

    But, the sparks between zarc and simulated were/are, fierce, fast, flying, and intoxicatingly stimulating.

    A really smart N dominant guy and a really smart N dominant girl arguing/bantering is not only great to engage in, but to also observe. (who knew?)

    I swear, I want to see/read you, (zarc and sim), go at it all day, everyday!!!

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  4. #44
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    And, dude & dudette, Qre:us. Curious. Q(uestions) re: (regarding) us. Qre:us.
    Lightbulb goes on. Hey, I get it!
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

    "please give concise answers in plain English" - request from Provoker

  5. #45
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    ^ was that zarc's workings?

    She is a veritable geniusette!!

    I her!!!
    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  6. #46
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Wait, IIIIIIIII, get it now.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  7. #47
    Senior Member
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    lol You're too cute.

    Does that mean I'm no longer a geniusette? I had workings, they're just way above. Maybe too above..


    + For people not in the know, which should be all of you unless you voyeur profile convos, sw and I are working it out. PRIVATELY HAHAHA. No more game-show.

    It's Half-time.

  8. #48
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    I really think that if you and he mated it would do a great service to our species, so, if not for yourselves, please, copulate and procreate for Us!!!

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  9. #49
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zarc View Post
    And like I said in your wall post, I think most profiles need correction, so tell me are those profile excerpts written by experts that I posted correct to you or not? And if it is correct, should I stop trying to change it, then?

    Quote Originally Posted by zarc View Post
    What was contradictory? Hmm, could be, so here's another try with less fun effort. I think I see where we mismatched or where I mixed up the types, yea.. And I said lol No copping out!

    K. I defer to type experts now from the book 16 Personality Types: Descriptions for Self-Discovery. Obviously not EVERYone fits perfectly to type but do you agree with these excerpts taken from profile:

    Do you relate to most of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Some of it is pretty accurate. Parts of it sound more like ESFP than ENTP, though, and are a bit too generalized.
    Quote Originally Posted by zarc View Post
    Err, bit confused. So you're only disagreeing with those three bits you explained that don't fit? Everything else is correct? I'm just trying to be sure of it all.
    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Yes, the rest of the quotes you posted seem fairly reasonable to categorize as ENTP behavior/thought process.
    Quote Originally Posted by zarc View Post
    Thank you, I knew you'd relate.

    Incidentally, those excerpts were taken from the ESFP profile. Whoops. I didn't say that they were ENTP. I just asked you if you related. You relate.

    Now look at ENTP. Even afterwards, with the succeeding posts, you couldn't even see the set up. SusPected nothing but good-feel-me-vibes to your Fi because you thought I was finally on your side. ENTP, you are not.
    Zarc, it could very well mean that Mr. Whiney Simu isn't ENTP.

    Or, he's unhealthy/young ENTP enough to get baited with one-upmanship in an argument, which.....you played very well into causing subjective validation. It was literally set up as a case for subjective validation.

    Subjective validation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    It's a real bias to objectivity, and truth-seeking, and, interestingly enough is one that is used to 'validate' cold reading.

    Cold reading - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    I don't know, therefore, if you can guage his ENTP-ness or not, conclusively, from that mind-experiement.

    Simu - details sometimes help you save your ass , esp. if you can use details to validate the big picture. As long as there's a logical justification. Marking out the path from detail A --->big-pic B.

    Ne - exercise it, know there are no limits to connecting even the most obscure far-fetched dots. Ne will find the most relevant dots, allow Ti to connect them in a logical manner.

    Whether you're ENTP or not, it takes time (I still struggle) to understand exactly the many 'talents' one is afforded with being a 'type' and how best to use [and fully understand] each strength, rather than letting *it* use/abuse you.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    Zarc, it could very well mean that Mr. Whiney Simu isn't ENTP.
    I don't know, therefore, if you can guage his ENTP-ness or not, conclusively, from that mind-experiement.
    It was never meant to be conclusive, just to demonstrate he doesn't know function from type or type from profile. Everything I'd been saying to him prior was the proof in the pudding that his understanding of functions and type was being incorrectly applied. And that he isn't ENTP due to that.

    Ne - exercise it, know there are no limits to connecting even the most obscure far-fetched dots. Ne will find the most relevant dots, allow Ti to connect them in a logical manner.
    Look at his posts- Where do you see Ne? No where. He doesn't make connective relations with his ideas. He goes from the obvious point of the matter to the next one, concretely. Se. Because his Fi is underdeveloped, he lashes out through Se-Te. You see Inferior Ni due to his huge assumptions (from other threads, mind)

    He keeps taking everything literally and at face value. Take for instance him saying that I said ENTPs have no Te in their system.

    Quote Originally Posted by zarc
    Um. ENTPs wouldn't be dogmatic, eh poor choice of word, but they'd hold Ti-ght to their theories/ideas. Cuz itís the right one. AndÖ ďproperĒ way? Sorry, boyo, but they donít gots Te in their system. Leave it to the TJs. Or maybe an EFP when you catch them on a bad day... Btw, JIC youíre not receptive at this point, I hope itís not a bad day for you because Iím being thoughtful in trying to show you.
    He thought my little function inputs were just "puns", he didn't see the symbolism of them. "Ti-ght to their theories/ideas" = Ti stops Ne in its tracks from continuing to expand so that the logical framework is being built while still being able to connect elsewhere. --- As for "They don't have Te in their system." -- I was referring to both the 4 top functions for ENTP(Ne Ti Fe Si) and Te itself-- Te creates systems. Ti creates frameworks.

    I made the hint I thought him ESFP in that first post (even in that post above), which an NT wouldíve likely suspected I was calling them that. Now look at the bolded part in the quote. What am I hinting? I hope I didn't catch him on a bad day. I hoped it wasn't a bad day for him because I was being thoughtful in trying to reach him-- He couldn't see any thoughtfulness, only attacks- Did I ever attack him? Nopez. Just his points. Never him. And when he found out he'd been tricked, whoa, he was rant-acular. Sorry, NTs might've been irritated they'd been tricked, probably amused too, but they'd unlikely have loaded on me their indignation. They'd have dismissed me curtly or further tackled where I erred if they found any. Moved on.

    And then making fun of other people (I found the post he put you in btw). NTs don't do that if they're arguing or debating w/e. It's irrelevant information to the point being made. It loses one's creditbility of using intelligence alone to beat the opponent.

    Quote Originally Posted by zarc
    If you want intelligent yet still mischievous fun, Iíd say go to an awesome ESFP.
    Yea, that's me being nice again with the hint.

    I kept telling him. Refute (Ti), don't dispute (Te) or rather don't rebut (Te). Debating is likely favourable past times for ETJs, ITJs, EFPs (will do well if they can avoid taking it personally but if not they may attack when feeling (Fi) violated OR they do it but say it's NOT serious b/c they don't care). Te is geared for that. They can thrive off it. He agreed with the SP parts. One part he esp. bolded "rules and regulations infuriate me". Yes, for SPs! Not for NTs (or any other temperament). NTs take things seriously, especially rules (Ti = NTP) and regulations (Te = NTJ). Sometimes too seriously. ENTPs are not excluded. They wouldn't be Rationals then.

    Ti cuts to the chase. Te gives chase.

    No ETP would care enough to have written such long posts. They just wouldnítóI donít care how evolved as a person. They don't (their Ti doesn't) have the patience for it (EFPs, if they care (Fi) they'll push past their reluctance, putting effort into making themselves understood! Through Pe-Te! /Pe = Se/Ne) . But if they do care, theyíd make it short and sweet because of Ti.óAnd ETPs dismiss a person whom they think refuses to make logical sense. They leave it up to others to get what they're saying or don't. EFPs dismiss a person whom they think refuses to make sense to their understanding of what they feel is right. They don't leave it up to others to get what they're saying or not . But when care they make you hear about it because it's important to their identity.

    He felt the need to 'correct' me based off his understanding because he thought what I was saying had contradictions--- OFC they'd be contradictions because it CONTRADICTS what HE is saying.---That's the point! of disagreement! To be contrary to the other. What are we doing here then? He said there wasn't a lot of information besides asserting that he was wrong. No--- The information, itself, was explaining to him what was wrong with what he'd written and why.-- Instead of dissecting them to prove what they were, he just said what they were and not WHY they were incorrect-- Te. He said in his last post that we were BOTH doing that. NoóI ask anyone to read our posts. I always countered, explaining my reasoning by presenting it through functional relations to what I wrote-- doesn't matter how playful I was either, they all stand. While he kept explaining his reasoning by using validation (Te) of the sites or profiles heís read and by his own subjective experience. Do you think thatís ENTP? At any age? >_>

    And most important of all. He defers when an understanding has been reached. NTs wouldn't defer but they may concede. This is good of him. He cares enough to. And it's also Fi. Because he recognises that I am serious in helping him, that I'm not just jerking him around. Itís safe in interacting with me.

    Here's something I wrote in another thread inspired by something Evan wrote:

    Quote Originally Posted by zarc
    I think both types of perceptions work here. I think opinion is better to explain it than judging. Judging implies that it's been objectively selected. And perceptions are made aware subjectively to the individual, so they form opinions about the world that can't be disputed because it's subconsciously chosen. That being said, Si/Se are unconscious opinions based at face value. Ne/Ni are unconscious opinions based on speculation.

    It's why you don't know and can't explain why you dislike a person 'instinctively' when you first meet them.
    Se would form "they look the same"
    and Si would form "they look the same as"- S is linked to what's unconsciously and negatively familiar in this sense. Ne would form "they could really look like this" and Ni would form "they really look like this". - N is linked to what's unconsciously and negatively unfamiliar in this sense. So we all can unconsciously assess people negatively based on the particular manner our perceptions work.
    He wrote to me in my wall that he thought I was 'actually Nocap' and that what I'd written was rehashed versions of his--- We looked similar to him in a negative manner. Quacks like that duck, drown the chicklet it in the pond.... Nocaps has offended him before whereas I'd never done so (other than disagree on ENTP) Our writing styles and presentation aren't even remotely close. Who would mistaken me for Nocap? >_> What relates is that we understand MBTI's system and explain functions in the same manner-- we can't be dissimilar there otherwise the information wouldn't be right.

    And look at this:
    Quote Originally Posted by zarc
    Now to apply it to S, the N being an unconscious perception. Si tries to consciously filter through relevant information that it has collected but it canít represent how that information was viewed now that itís become unconscious (shadow Ni). Unlike Ni, Si can keep track of the information but the problem lies in which representation was the right one (Ni). Conversely, when stuck, Pi only wants to see what it has seen -- because when the loop begins, Si is unable to remove itself from its familiar reality, entirely focused. Se tries to consciously adapt as situations occur but itís not filtering all of the unconscious possibilities that could be created (shadow Ne). Unlike Ne, Se can notice the change of information but it has a problem integrating the interpretation of patterns that are possible (Ne). When stuck, Pe only keeps experiencing what it's seeing. -- Se keeps adjusting to changes aimlessly, becoming unfocused. When no longer stuck, both take from their unconscious (N) environments, whether internal or external, and alter what is conceivable (S).
    He never saw the possibilities existing in what I'd written (it was so mutli-layered too--zz). All the deflection because it didn't make Se-nse to him, he took it all at face value. And btw, reading type descriptions alone and agreeing that they fit is also taking it at face value. btw, sw, that typelogic site. glaringly wrong about Sensors in parts. ESFPs love to party nonsense. Frick. They make them sound like fickle simpeltons. Just wrong.-- And look how much page they devoted to this type? Gah.-

    And lastly:

    Quote Originally Posted by zarc

    Iím guessing thatís why Si/Ni and Se/Ne are so opposed to each other for IJs and EPs. I think similar perceiving functions, though possibly unconscious, are easier to access than the opposite perceiving function... which seem unavailable when we need them, never mind inaccessible.

    .....

    Ex. when opposite S/N Pi fuck with the EPs:
    - ESP follows what it is experiencing (Se) but may have trouble understanding the likely effects (Ni) or a new way of conceptualizing their experiences (Ni).-
    ENP follows what it is interpreting (Ne) but may have trouble stabilizing the information into something recognisable (Si) or applying it to past accumulated data (Si).
    He's mentioned it to me before and in other threads that he doesn't take things seriously (most or most people seriously). He said to me that he argues online to take out aggression and frustrations (=/) b/c this is a "relatively consequence free environment". That he's less bombastic in RL. I can believe that, like in the totally fantastic sense. I told him, more or less, we may be text but we are still real with real feelings. It needs to be respected. (My Ni thinks) He isn't aware that he's potentially ruining people's perception of him (take the Flak thread, I read it or the Sensor bias thread where all the "Ns", he mentions, seem to disagree with him (on the board?) yet one S understood his point....-) and that people will not want to create relationships because he seems hostile. I don't think it's always the case but when he forgets to be civil. And he can be civil, I've seen it. He has the potential to change. This is always good. You'd find an NT to be more stubborn, which can be good in some situations but not always. SPs go with the flow, they adapt better, they can let go of things easily -- SFPs let go of bad feelings faster than NFPs and move on. STPs aren't bogged down by trying to understand the whole system as NTPs can be and they move faster. Both SFP and STP ways aren't always the best to use in every situation but it more than often works for their way of existing. Freedom to experience life to the fullest!

    -
    So yea, sw, did this make sense or anything you've realised in retrospect?

    And don't mistaken all my long posts being Te (like yours)-- It isn't. It's straight up Fe bleeding my body dry while trying to give you a blood transfusion in the process.

    Someone please tell me they get this (all the type talk).

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