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  1. #1
    Cat Wench ReadingRainbows's Avatar
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    Default Hypothetical?? INFJ and ENTJ??

    How might this work out? What are most if not all hypothetical situations this could lead too? Good, Bad??
    What if the INFJ bordered on E and the E bordered on I...
    come on tell me
    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    St. Stephen took rocks and St. Sebastian took arrows. You only have to take some jerks on an internet forum. Nut up.

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    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    ...i have experience here...ill comment later...

  3. #3
    Cat Wench ReadingRainbows's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babylon Candle View Post
    ...i have experience here...ill comment later...
    eep.....okay thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    St. Stephen took rocks and St. Sebastian took arrows. You only have to take some jerks on an internet forum. Nut up.

  4. #4
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Hypothetically?

    You're gonna be s o h r r y.

    ENXJ has tertiary Se. For them to feel good and right they have to scan the environment they are in and freely and fully take action according to impulse. And for ENTJ, impulse is provided by Te/Ni together with some Fi background noise.

    Is there anything Fe can meaningfully interject in such a circumstance? Seriously? Fe is eighth in function order for an ENTJ. It's literally the last thing they listen to.

    Which doesn't mean they won't hear you. But it does mean your Fe program will find no particular satisfaction in ENTJ company, even if you do succeed in teaching him something about himself. You won't see it reflected back at you in the way you need most. In fact, you'll tend to see the opposite of what you need most. As will he.

    But he's got the tertiary Se. Your Inferior Se will be overrun and ground into the dirt. It's not what he'll want to do. It's just what will happen.

  5. #5
    Cat Wench ReadingRainbows's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    Hypothetically?

    You're gonna be s o h r r y.

    ENXJ has tertiary Se. For them to feel good and right they have to scan the environment they are in and freely and fully take action according to impulse. And for ENTJ, impulse is provided by Te/Ni together with some Fi background noise.

    Is there anything Fe can meaningfully interject in such a circumstance? Seriously? Fe is eighth in function order for an ENTJ. It's literally the last thing they listen to.

    Which doesn't mean they won't hear you. But it does mean your Fe program will find no particular satisfaction in ENTJ company, even if you do succeed in teaching him something about himself. You won't see it reflected back at you in the way you need most. In fact, you'll tend to see the opposite of what you need most. As will he.

    But he's got the tertiary Se. Your Inferior Se will be overrun and ground into the dirt. It's not what he'll want to do. It's just what will happen.
    I've tested as an INTP too does that make a difference?
    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    St. Stephen took rocks and St. Sebastian took arrows. You only have to take some jerks on an internet forum. Nut up.

  6. #6
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    Hypothetically?

    You're gonna be s o h r r y.

    ENXJ has tertiary Se. For them to feel good and right they have to scan the environment they are in and freely and fully take action according to impulse. And for ENTJ, impulse is provided by Te/Ni together with some Fi background noise.

    Is there anything Fe can meaningfully interject in such a circumstance? Seriously? Fe is eighth in function order for an ENTJ. It's literally the last thing they listen to.

    Which doesn't mean they won't hear you. But it does mean your Fe program will find no particular satisfaction in ENTJ company, even if you do succeed in teaching him something about himself. You won't see it reflected back at you in the way you need most. In fact, you'll tend to see the opposite of what you need most. As will he.

    But he's got the tertiary Se. Your Inferior Se will be overrun and ground into the dirt. It's not what he'll want to do. It's just what will happen.
    as an ENTJ whose had a thing or two with INFJs, i completely disagree on Fe, but agree on Se

    1. we dont listen to Fe in our normal everyday decision making, so if we had say an ESFJ mom, we'd clash our entire childhood and "hate Fe" like you say. If people were to use Fe in argument, we would also hate it. However, later in life, say we meet ENFJ or INFJ, we see this function that we have NO IDEA how to use, and we begin to see how well it works to have a TEAM MEMBER use that Fe FOR US. We become attracted to that Fe warmth, not because we want to use it ourselves, but because its this foreign, missing function that poses no threat to us, because we dont desire to use it ourselves. Completely different than an ESFJ trying to force us to use Fe OURSELVES. Do you see the difference? the NFJs for lack of a better term: cover our ass when we are making Fe fools of ourselves, and provide that warmth that NTJs generally learn to live without.

    2. I do agree with you on the Se factor. Not to say INFJs lack Se use...no no no, INFJs can get bad Se with the best of the ESFPs (partying, sex etc). the real bad thing about INFJ Se, is that they become disconnected with reality. Not in the sense that theres an argument and they wont listen...no more like: they simply wont see the life the same way you do. Any relation, circumstance, symbol, etc will be accurately rooted out and defined by the ENTJ, while the INFJ will basically cast it into some idealized INFJ world view... it allows them to either irrationally blame themselves, or irrationally ignore when the blame IS actaully on them.

    3. I think the main problem with the INFJ ENTJ is that the ENTJ is going to end up "dominating". You'll both like that at first... but then the ENTJ gets tired of not getting any challenge back, and the INFJ just grows accustomed to the ENTJ doing everything.

    4. ENTJs need more of an equal when it comes to "desire to dominate" and the INFJs need more of a fantasy land. This is why ENTP INFJ works so well: the ENTP is never really aware that they are even with the INFJ, so the INFJ can basically cast what ever fantasy land projection they want onto it. Also the INFJ is the ENTP supervisor, so for once in their lives THEY come out of their shells and TRY.

  7. #7
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    ^ this ENTJ is gold
    I N V I C T U S

  8. #8
    Senior Member norepinephrine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbows View Post
    I've tested as an INTP too does that make a difference?
    I get the idea you want to pursue this. So do it.

    But gird your loins and don't try to consciously lean in one direction or another. Two of the things I appreciate about the ENTJ I know are:

    1. His ability to ask an extremely blunt question and, essentially, expect and receive an extremely blunt (and honest) answer, and

    2. His ability, given that honesty, to read my mind to a frightening degree.

    But don't knock it until you try it.

  9. #9
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babylon Candle View Post
    as an ENTJ whose had a thing or two with INFJs, i completely disagree on Fe, but agree on Se

    1. we dont listen to Fe in our normal everyday decision making, so if we had say an ESFJ mom, we'd clash our entire childhood and "hate Fe" like you say. If people were to use Fe in argument, we would also hate it. However, later in life, say we meet ENFJ or INFJ, we see this function that we have NO IDEA how to use, and we begin to see how well it works to have a TEAM MEMBER use that Fe FOR US. We become attracted to that Fe warmth, not because we want to use it ourselves, but because its this foreign, missing function that poses no threat to us, because we dont desire to use it ourselves. Completely different than an ESFJ trying to force us to use Fe OURSELVES. Do you see the difference? the NFJs for lack of a better term: cover our ass when we are making Fe fools of ourselves, and provide that warmth that NTJs generally learn to live without.
    Not sure what's wrong with this argument, but something is. Oh wait, yes, an NFJ is a useful team member... yeah, they are, and they're also a usurping team member, because they have and will make Fe decisions about what to do and how to act and where things should go.

    This would be where it's useful as team leader and ENTJ to simply not hear Fe values. You don't have to do anything the NFJs say, but they're good for rounding up other people. Except that the other people will have been primed in an Fe way.... the NFJ will see her good work get turned into something different when the NTJ takes over.

    2. I do agree with you on the Se factor. Not to say INFJs lack Se use...no no no, INFJs can get bad Se with the best of the ESFPs (partying, sex etc). the real bad thing about INFJ Se, is that they become disconnected with reality.
    Yeah, big time disconnect from Te-reality. But by definition of INFJ, they are the deepest of Fe-reality seekers. Seers, truth-seekers, innovators... of the Fe world. Way totally looks like a fantasy world, this Fe world, but it isn't.

    I have an INFJ buddy, and she's great. Interacting with her I realised suddenly one day that whenever she says something, especially if it's some personal problem thing, I have practical solutions ready for her. If she says she still feels sad about her INFP ex, I tell her get some sleep, eat some nice food, let time pass. All of which probably does next to nothing whatsoever to address the particular Fe move of reaching out to say something to me.



    And to make you feel a little better, it's not just being ENTJ that makes this stuff happen. For example, ENFJs do it to INTJs too. I've had ENFJs tell me I'm useful to them too, and they blithely go on about their world-dominating ways with nary a use of any useful utility using things I launched at them. I supposes all ESJs do it to all ISJs too when one is T and the other F.

  10. #10
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    Is there any ENTJ who is in a relationship with an INFJ (or an INFJ in a relationship with a ENTJ)? I would really like to hear your experiences/opinions with/on this match and to know if it really is such a rare one!

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