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  1. #1
    Senior Member Cypocalypse's Avatar
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    Default The Chameleon INTP

    The chameleon INTP is basically a state in which the P function of an INTP "listens" to the merits of another person's statements, in order to seek information from it, basically characterized by the inhibition of the Ti's assertion.

    To INTPs, this can be interpreted as their empathic function.

    _________

    A few days ago, I was reading here an INTP description posted by an INTP member, and he says something like...

    "An INTP can simulate any personality of various archetypes, none of which is legitimately his."

    I was wondering if this somehow has parallels with the chameleon description.

    To be honest, I think if you jack up an INTPs Ti, he'll end up like Bluewing (no sarcasm intended).

    The last time I took an MBTI test, I still showed up an INTP though the dichotomy of my I/E and T/F are really close. All are close to 50% and only the N and P are at a glaring advantage.

    Assuming that the results have validity, I'm probably close to any of these four: ENTP, INTP, INFP, and ENFP at any point.

    Well, that's because out of the four archetypes, I'm less likely to find an INTP, in real life. The xNFPs (or Js) are much easier to find.

    Does any INTP here feel the lack to environmental conduciveness to refine the Ti function? I know that even in solitude, it can be refined, but how does external pressure fare up?

  2. #2
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    I can kind of see where you're coming from. In social situations in which I am comfortable, Ne can definitely seem to lead and Ti take a bit of a backseat, however I don't really think it is being repressed. Also, it depends upon the manner of social interaction. Like you said, if you are constantly surrounded by non-Ti types, your tendency to have that analytical presence may be suppressed somewhat so it does not develop as much in a social context.

    However, in my case, it really depends on the type of social interaction. If we're debating topics, Ti is used to my fullest ability. If we're just chilling out or fucking around, I have nothing to really analyze, and I easily become bored.



  3. #3
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    I can kind of see where you're coming from. In social situations in which I am comfortable, Ne can definitely seem to lead and Ti take a bit of a backseat, however I don't really think it is being repressed. Also, it depends upon the manner of social interaction. Like you said, if you are constantly surrounded by non-Ti types, your tendency to have that analytical presence may be suppressed somewhat so it does not develop as much in a social context.

    However, in my case, it really depends on the type of social interaction. If we're debating topics, Ti is used to my fullest ability. If we're just chilling out or fucking around, I have nothing to really analyze, and I easily become bored.
    I think Ti seems to take the lead when I get very angry which is extremely rare. It's not easy to get me into that state. I need to be exposed to a situation for a sustained period of time, or it has to be something really, really bad--Pink openly reviling me or something like that. Just kidding. I could use some more of Pink's form of revile.

  4. #4
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    I mimic all the time, and empathy is one of my maddest skillz.

    *ignores "Ti" bull*

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    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Mimicking and chameleoning are effects of being high self-monitors. Don't delude yourselves INTPs, you are not high self-monitors and you don't mirror people well. Your cheese and whine wouldn't be as delicious if you were. Watch your ExTP brothers for other TP examples, or ExFJs for FJ examples.

    Cypocalypse, in my observations and interactions with INTPs, I know what you're getting at but I don't think it is what you think it is. I notice that the handful of INTPs at my job give off an easygoing vibe but it's not necessarily because they're "chameleoning" anyone. Like other IPs they insist upon being persistently themselves. It's more or less just being quiet and not creating an image and allowing people to form whatever impressions of them they want, allowing people to project images onto them which can be positive, negative, or neutral. When I think of chameleoning I think of actively creating an image or persona of yourself that you want people to have in their heads or believe you to be. Mimicking another person is even harder because you have to be paying close enough attention to the other person to pick up their habits and mannerisms, even temporarily. I don't see INTPs noticing or that attuned to other people that closely to mimic them.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
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  6. #6
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Mimicking and chameleoning are effects of being high self-monitors. Don't delude yourselves INTPs, you are not high self-monitors and you don't mirror people well. Your cheese and whine wouldn't be as delicious if you were. Watch your ExTP brothers for other TP examples, or ExFJs for FJ examples.

    Cypocalypse, in my observations and interactions with INTPs, I know what you're getting at but I don't think it is what you think it is. I notice that the handful of INTPs at my job give off an easygoing vibe but it's not necessarily because they're "chameleoning" anyone. Like other IPs they insist upon being persistently themselves. It's more or less just being quiet and not creating an image and allowing people to form whatever impressions of them they want, allowing people to project images onto them which can be positive, negative, or neutral. When I think of chameleoning I think of actively creating an image or persona of yourself that you want people to have in their heads or believe you to be. Mimicking another person is even harder because you have to be paying close enough attention to the other person to pick up their habits and mannerisms, even temporarily. I don't see INTPs noticing or that attuned to other people that closely to mimic them.
    So basically, you disagree because you have a different definition of what a social chameleon is. And it is wrong. Chameleons as a species do not "project an image and display it outward to the world," they respond to their surroundings. Which is exactly what you said INTPs do.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTP Profile
    INTPs dislike making the first move and tend to mirror the emotional content of the other person. A jolly person will quickly bring the INTP out of his shell, as much as that is possible, while a serious person will find a serious INTP looking back at him. In this sense, INTPs preference for intuitive perception (rather than action) with respect to people results in them resembling a chameleon. The INTP can fit into many different modes of behaviour, even contradictory ones, in order to get into the mindset of the other person. The goal is to gain enough intuitive data to analyse and assess the person. In doing this, the INTP remains somewhat reserved, never wholly identifying himself with his surroundings. As chameleons, INTPs are therefore approachable and open, unless the Ne tells the INTP that the other person is a type he doesn't like, in which case the reserved attitude may become too obvious. The chameleon behaviour can be particularly strong when discussing something. The INTP may even argue something that he doesn't really believe himself. Sometimes it is for the intellectual stimulation that comes with the challenge of arguing from a variety of standpoints. Otherwise, it may be to avoid early conflict before the situation has been fully assessed. Chameleons hide their true selves. INTPs do not do this cynically, or indeed all the time, but it is a result of the strong desire to remain detached and observe.
    This description gives an alternative viewpoint. I'd be interested in your comment on it. Also, the OP notes a shift in his social behavior when around different types, and he changes his social "colors" so to speak, and since he had read this feature was common among INTPs I don't think him attributing this to a chameleon effect is that preposterous.



  7. #7
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    I mimic all the time, and empathy is one of my maddest skillz. *ignores "Ti" bull*
    You're probably being sarcastic, because you seem to me to be the most resilient "I is who I is" people on this forum -- no mirroring involved.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #8
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    So basically, you disagree because you have a different definition of what a social chameleon is. And it is wrong. Chameleons as a species do not "project an image and display it outward to the world," they respond to their surroundings. Which is exactly what you said INTPs do.
    You should read the post more carefully, or put it in context of the discussion, rather than just dismissing it outright.

    The "selected image that is projected and displayed outwards" is directly based on one's surroundings. With mirroring, the person is scanning the environment, picking up on all the vibes and potential dangers (usually some sort of relational/emotional tension), and then choosing to reflect back the personality traits that will reduce or remove the tension. People who are good at it do it instinctively.

    I've seen very flexy INTPs who do the mirroring quite well; I've seen other INTPs who downright suck at it and show the OTHER end, they don't have the sensitivity to pick up on the signals nor the desire to conform in that manner due to their prioritizing autonomy overtly.

    It's sort of a combination of various function strengths in the INTP, as well as environmental danger and aesthetic sense or sensitivity to others that will determine how much an INTP will choose mirroring as a relational strategy.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Mimicking and chameleoning are effects of being high self-monitors. Don't delude yourselves INTPs, you are not high self-monitors and you don't mirror people well. Your cheese and whine wouldn't be as delicious if you were. Watch your ExTP brothers for other TP examples, or ExFJs for FJ examples.

    Cypocalypse, in my observations and interactions with INTPs, I know what you're getting at but I don't think it is what you think it is. I notice that the handful of INTPs at my job give off an easygoing vibe but it's not necessarily because they're "chameleoning" anyone. Like other IPs they insist upon being persistently themselves. It's more or less just being quiet and not creating an image and allowing people to form whatever impressions of them they want, allowing people to project images onto them which can be positive, negative, or neutral. When I think of chameleoning I think of actively creating an image or persona of yourself that you want people to have in their heads or believe you to be. Mimicking another person is even harder because you have to be paying close enough attention to the other person to pick up their habits and mannerisms, even temporarily. I don't see INTPs noticing or that attuned to other people that closely to mimic them.
    Yeah, I don't care what you think.

    I was at a bar many moons ago, met a guy from England, and he told me I was speaking in an English accent before I'd even noticed.

    I act like my company unless I consciously decide not to.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    You're probably being sarcastic, because you seem to me to be the most resilient "I is who I is" people on this forum -- no mirroring involved.
    No, I'm not. It's not exactly an internet characteristic, is it.

  10. #10
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    You should read the post more carefully, or put it in context of the discussion, rather than just dismissing it outright.

    The "selected image that is projected and displayed outwards" is directly based on one's surroundings. With mirroring, the person is scanning the environment, picking up on all the vibes and potential dangers (usually some sort of relational/emotional tension), and then choosing to reflect back the personality traits that will reduce or remove the tension. People who are good at it do it instinctively.

    I've seen very flexy INTPs who do the mirroring quite well; I've seen other INTPs who downright suck at it and show the OTHER end, they don't have the sensitivity to pick up on the signals nor the desire to conform in that manner due to their prioritizing autonomy overtly.

    It's sort of a combination of various function strengths in the INTP, as well as environmental danger and aesthetic sense or sensitivity to others that will determine how much an INTP will choose mirroring as a relational strategy.
    That's fair, however you identify that an INTP is equipped to do so if inclined. Some don't, usually if they find the effort or the act of fitting in not particularly important. This is often when they have determined they do not like or take to the individuals around them. Protean indicated the OP was mistaken and this behavior was something INTPs do not do, as a blanket statement. I offered a contrasting opinion, as well as what we think a social chameleon is. Forcibly, actively projecting images is something I don't think INTPs do, but Protean thought that's what being a chameleon was, and I disagree.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Yeah, I don't care what you think.

    I was at a bar many moons ago, met a guy from England, and he told me I was speaking in an English accent before I'd even noticed.

    I act like my company unless I consciously decide not to.



    No, I'm not. It's not exactly an internet characteristic, is it.
    Similar to me, after watching BBC Office for a couple hours, the mannerisms, language, and even some accent slip into my language. Maybe it's just me though.



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