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  1. #51
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    I seem to be the only one who has the courage to bring issues up to my superiors, and I'm usually pretty successful in resolving those issues with them. My most successful tool is being able to speak to them on their own terms--that is, how these issues might affect them as well. I'm also the youngest member on staff, so I'm not sure exactly how I got so much clout. I do, however, try for "win-win" situations wherever possible, especially when an issue is my own. So, I guess I could see this as either hard manipulation or actually empathizing with their own needs and identifying problems as they come up.

    It just tends to happen that some of these issue resolutions benefit me, too.

    And my customers tend to call me personable, again, because it seems that I'm able to speak to them on terms that they can understand. I also find that, when I meet new people, I'm able to relate to something about them, such as some tangential interest with some common thread of discussion. And in business discussions and elsewhere, I do subconsciously (and sometimes consciously!) practice techniques such as mirroring. Maybe that is manipulative..

    I've also felt a sense of "belonging" in a wide range of social groups, including three different church groups. I'm not a Christian, nor have I ever said that I was. I don't see going to church as "lying" either, since I've gotten a lot out of the Sunday School sessions and the comradery that comes with having these close groups of friends. They might assume that I'm a Christian, but I never lie when I'm explicitly asked. The groups that I associate with are all very, very different in nature, and I don't feel like I'm compromising my own identity with any of them or manipulating them into accepting me.

    This thread caught me at the right time.. I'm in a very "J" mood today

  2. #52
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    ENTJs (sample size: 1) go very weird when they feel someone shaking the old paint can in the garage where they keep their feelings. I mean, when some bad decision of their own is bearing down on them like a freight train of their own making, and they begin to know it will derail their management of their private life.

    In my humble experience as a subjective observer, they go silent and try to keep secrets by projecting a sullen sense of impending doom. It's a fairly awful cry for help, and includes attempts at management.

    Dunno if that counts as manipulative.

  3. #53
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    Hell yeah, we're manipulative! But we'd like to think we do it out of benevolence

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  4. #54
    Senior Member Chemgrl82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    ENTJs (sample size: 1) go very weird when they feel someone shaking the old paint can in the garage where they keep their feelings. I mean, when some bad decision of their own is bearing down on them like a freight train of their own making, and they begin to know it will derail their management of their private life.

    In my humble experience as a subjective observer, they go silent and try to keep secrets by projecting a sullen sense of impending doom. It's a fairly awful cry for help, and includes attempts at management.

    Dunno if that counts as manipulative.


    That could be me.... I'm not sure... Sounds a bit familiar, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Hell yeah, we're manipulative! But we'd like to think we do it out of benevolence
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body.
    E:63% N:84% T:84% J:68%
    8w7 sx

  5. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by theplacesyoullgo View Post
    I always thought of "manipulative" as having a negative connotation, kind of the ability to get someone to do something s/he will probably regret later which s/he wouldn't normally do without your urging. Essentially controlling others for ulterior motives.
    Charles Manson.

    I'm manipulative but not very good at it because I suck at empathy. No, leave it to the Extrovert Perceivers to put one over ya.

    But we do charm the hell out of people though and it's hard to say no to that. We know how to say the right thing with the right body language... we are excellent communicators

    I push buttons. But I don't go guilt trips and such...
    bruised and battered ENTJ sx/sp/so 8w9
    Tri-fix: 8w9 sx/sp - 3w4 sp/sx - 5w6 soc/sx
    http://leonardolestat.mypersonality.info

    (I'm secretly ENxP, but don't tell anyone)

    "Mother, I love you, I never meant to hit you over the head with that shovel."

  6. #56
    Senior Member Rangler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Hell yeah, we're manipulative! But we'd like to think we do it out of benevolence
    Exactly.

    We have goals. Sometimes they're bigger than ourselves, sometimes not. We look at you as resources to achieve the goal. And then we motivate said resources.

    Are you following me?

    If I need to be bold, I will do it. If I need to be charming, I will do it. If I need to listen and affirm you, I will do it. If I need to beat you senseless, I will think about doing it in my head and then be charming. lol.

    I suspect ENTPs more than other ENTJs of manipulation.
    R[a]ngl[e]r

  7. #57
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Hell yeah, we're manipulative! But we'd like to think we do it out of benevolence
    And if people don't follow your benevolent advice you just eat them.

  8. #58
    Senior Member Rangler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    And if people don't follow your benevolent advice you just eat them.
    Like candy.
    R[a]ngl[e]r

  9. #59
    HUZZAH! Bougal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rangler View Post
    Like candy.
    I love candy.


    Ne > Ni > Ti > Fi > Te> Fe > Se > Si

  10. #60
    Senior Member Rangler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bougal View Post
    I love candy.
    Nothing better than a big bowl of candy.
    R[a]ngl[e]r

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