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  1. #21
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    T personalities are more into the mechanics of word usage than its meaning that F's like. N means were about word ideas instead of how it's used for S's. NT's are about intelligence as their strength. For NF's who want to know, we are about wisdom. We are actually very smart, but the IQ tests are orientated toward purely intelligence. Think of other areas where you have skills that others don't and you will see you are quite smart, just a different emphasis on how you apply it.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtanSis1 View Post
    T personalities are more into the mechanics of word usage than its meaning that F's like. N means were about word ideas instead of how it's used for S's. NT's are about intelligence as their strength. For NF's who want to know, we are about wisdom. We are actually very smart, but the IQ tests are orientated toward purely intelligence. Think of other areas where you have skills that others don't and you will see you are quite smart, just a different emphasis on how you apply it.
    You're misusing the word wisdom a slight bit, but I think I know what you're trying to say.

    I have come to appreciate wisdom more than intelligence in myself, because I had one but not the other many years ago, and it was nothing but trouble.

  3. #23
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    Wisdom is a concept of personal gaining of knowledge, understanding, experience, discretion, and intuitive understanding, along with a capacity to apply these qualities well towards finding solutions to problems. It is the judicious and purposeful application of knowledge that is valued in society. Got this from wikipedia, but is kind of what I meant about wisdom. I had a similar deal where I tried to find an answer about my life, and went through many self-help, religion, spirituality, metaphysics, psychology, and relationships etc., but until I could apply it, it was only knowledge.

  4. #24
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    You are right of course, but NFs have more than NTs? I demand satisfaction. *throws down the gauntlet*

  5. #25
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    yea i guess i pride myself in being smart when i know there are a lot more smarter people than me..even in my own social circle

    then again it could only be just my pride

    but i dont find myself as "smart" i think im more intellectual and wise
    im not about the facts and the figures and the books
    its about the big picture for me

    most people dont see that
    which is why i say theyre all dumb

  6. #26
    Resident Snot-Nose GZA's Avatar
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    I used to be kind of a smartass. Maybe I stll am, but not as much, I don't know. It's no longer important to me to be smart. Winning a debate, knowin more facts, having more abstract ideas... I used to try to do all of that, but then I realized I was just being a dick. Being intelligent doesn't matter to me now because intelligence does not earn you anything. You have to do work and make things happen, which I'm finding is different from my idea of intelligence I was chasing before. So I guess I used to romanticize it and my own intelligence a lot but now I'm finding it's all irelevant anyway.

  7. #27
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    NF's don't have more wisdom, they just are more inclined to that way of thinking. We look for knowledge with the intent to find meaning in an answer.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtanSis1 View Post
    NF's don't have more wisdom, they just are more inclined to that way of thinking. We look for knowledge with the intent to find meaning in an answer.
    Perhaps the type of meaning is different, but that statement itself is still just as true for NTs....

  9. #29
    Senior Member Into It's Avatar
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    NF's romanticize everything. Their intelligence shouldn't be any different. I think the answer to your question is a resounding "yes!" we do, even though the more careful of us try to look at this topic as realistically as possible. But what I don't like about this thread is that we are having a conversation about intelligence, but our meanings of "intelligence" are not well defined. There are people in here separating the word "intelligent" from "creative" and so on. Lucky for me and my argument which I haven't presented yet, people on an MBTI forum are familiar with how differently people think.
    We are all given this dominant function which governs our thought processes, or isour thought process, and some are very different than others. Comparing Extraverted Judgement with introverted intuition- it's just apples and oranges. These IQ numbers as a basis for intelligence make me very uncomfortable. They are an accurate measure of one facet of intelligence- but others are more difficult to measure with paper. Maybe intelligence and creativity should be thought of as one in the same, as a mathematically proficient man who cannot think outside of the box- cannot come up with new ideas himself- is obviously lacking intellectually. Perhaps intelligence should mean the proficiency with which one can use the function he is most comfortable with. That way we cannot dismiss the intelligence needed to create some of the works of art that most of us would never be capable of. It may be that the advancement of societies or other practical applications of knowledge have become so important to us in measuring intelligence that more abstract manifestations of intelligence have been forgotten or viewed as 'lower' or 'lesser'. Math and English skills are just so easy to measure! Take into consideration both the minds who have constructed these tests ad the minds who uphold the institutions that administer them. There should not be this separation between abstract and concrete intelligence; they are both equally valid. In my opinion, any of the greatest artists or performers should be considered alongside any of our greatest physicists.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    It is ironical that when you get to do actual work, it goes back to Si/Te
    all that shit about showing your work comes back!? AHHHH!!!! :steam:

    common theme in this thread I am noticing: maybe the reason high IQ does not equal success, is because the real world is more Te than Ni/Ne (i realize comparing judging to perceiving is like apples to oranges)

    Quote Originally Posted by GZA View Post
    It's no longer important to me to be smart. Winning a debate, knowin more facts, having more abstract ideas... I used to try to do all of that, but then I realized I was just being a dick. Being intelligent doesn't matter to me now because intelligence does not earn you anything. You have to do work and make things happen, which I'm finding is different from my idea of intelligence I was chasing before. So I guess I used to romanticize it and my own intelligence a lot but now I'm finding it's all irelevant anyway.
    common theme:
    1. real world work can often be more Te than any form of Ne/Ni (high intelligence)

    2. I actually think you are proving my point: "Winning a debate, knowin more facts, having more abstract ideas... I used to try to do all of that, but then I realized I was just being a dick. " what does that sound like? It sounds like an NF who thinks they are smarter than they really are and goes around trying to prove it! (i am NOT attacking you , I admit that I do this too and I think its an NF thing. hence this thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by Into It View Post
    NF's romanticize everything. Their intelligence shouldn't be any different. I think the answer to your question is a resounding "yes!" we do, even though the more careful of us try to look at this topic as realistically as possible. But what I don't like about this thread is that we are having a conversation about intelligence, but our meanings of "intelligence" are not well defined. There are people in here separating the word "intelligent" from "creative" and so on. Lucky for me and my argument which I haven't presented yet, people on an MBTI forum are familiar with how differently people think.
    We are all given this dominant function which governs our thought processes, or isour thought process, and some are very different than others. Comparing Extraverted Judgement with introverted intuition- it's just apples and oranges. These IQ numbers as a basis for intelligence make me very uncomfortable. They are an accurate measure of one facet of intelligence- but others are more difficult to measure with paper. Maybe intelligence and creativity should be thought of as one in the same, as a mathematically proficient man who cannot think outside of the box- cannot come up with new ideas himself- is obviously lacking intellectually. Perhaps intelligence should mean the proficiency with which one can use the function he is most comfortable with. That way we cannot dismiss the intelligence needed to create some of the works of art that most of us would never be capable of. It may be that the advancement of societies or other practical applications of knowledge have become so important to us in measuring intelligence that more abstract manifestations of intelligence have been forgotten or viewed as 'lower' or 'lesser'. Math and English skills are just so easy to measure! Take into consideration both the minds who have constructed these tests ad the minds who uphold the institutions that administer them. There should not be this separation between abstract and concrete intelligence; they are both equally valid. In my opinion, any of the greatest artists or performers should be considered alongside any of our greatest physicists.
    I agree with a lot of it...except:
    You are supporting the view that is exactly what Im trying to show is maybe wrong. NFs always like to go on and on about how their intelligence is just, different. You list many areas where this differentness is claimed as a crutch for NFs.

    being intellectual, reflective, and liking abstract ideas does not inherently make you intelligent or smart. There is nothing wrong with being those things. those interests are what often separate NFs from being the more superficial SF (not saying EVERY SF is superficial). there is a huge difference between liking those things and actually being very intelligent. All I am asserting, is that many NFs make the extrapolation from "being intellectual, reflective, and liking abstract ideas" to their view of their actual inherent intelligence. This is reflective of the NF ability to romanticize everything, to the point that their world view really does not reflect the true realty.

    I am not attacking NFs. I AM an NF.

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