[INFJ] Why do INFJs struggle with language and expression so much?

[1487610420]

cuz they r speshul

 

[Norrsken]

This is really bothering me.

I don't mean this post to be insulting of any INFJs out there.

INFJs sometimes seem extremely deep, but it's almost like their depth is just related to emotional connectedness. In other words, INFJs can connect with someone emotionally on a very deep level from the INFJ's point of view. However, they don't seem able to connect with someone on a deep level regarding a shared interest. Is that just because they lack the active vocabulary for expressing a deeply felt connection in relation to a shared interest or activity? Or is it because INFJs just lack the ability to go into a subject or interest with the extreme depth and broadness of which INFPs and INTPs, for example, are capable? Or maybe INFJs are too intellectually lazy to ever go very far into anything?

Is what I am describing making sense?

If I'm wrong on anything, I'd really like to be because I'm dating an INFJ female, and I'm trying to determine why she sometimes seems to be able to connect with me on a mental/intellectual level, but most of the time I feel like I'm somewhat by myself.

Is this just because her Ni feels overwhelmed by my Ne? Or has she avoided complexity on purpose in her life because she doesn't quite know how to manage it?

I'd like to think of it as (I've been sitting here for like 30 seconds trying to come up with words. Wow.) that it's mostly about gauging the other person's reactions to my inner thoughts and feelings rather than intellectual laziness. If I feel like I cannot have a deep bond with that person, I let the conversations be shallow or even not say much at all. I do express myself a little better online than offline, and because I am more comfortable with stretches of silence, maybe some people take that the wrong way and like I'm not interested in them or.. in making our relationship deeper. Of course I would like to make it deeper if there is something special between me and that other person, but again, I need that period of time to ease myself into it and to let my inner guidance make sense of the signs to point as to whether or not this person can be there in the long term, or not.

I also think my depth can be frightening for a lot of people, and I have lost friends because of this. So, I do have a sense of trust issues with this.

 

[Fidelia]

I was thinking more about this. I think that Ni is more cyclical and repetitive and in depth only on a few topics compared to Ne. It tends to stick more to certain areas of specialization, although as a Ni Dom, I like the breadth of knowledge and curiosity that ne users exhibit or bring to me. They seem to better be able to keep track of where they encountered different bits of information or ideas, and also are open to almost anything that comes their way. I'm more likely to dismiss some things because of their source, or because it's of less relevance to me and I also don't venture as far afield or get bored as easily as them. I think Ne and Ni are complementary in that sense, but I can understand how to a ne user it may seem that they are intellectually lighter.

I think especially in the past too, I was protective of things that mattered a lot to me until I could gauge the other person's likely response because disinterest in something I was excited about felt like rejection of me and I didn't want to complicate the relationship between me and others with feeling hurt or resentful. I think too, ne users tend to easily talk about all the things they are exploring or find interesting whereas Ni users (or at least infjs) are more likely to err on the side of waiting to be asked or they maybe feel rebuffed more easily if they volunteer something and there is no response or a negative one.

I am naturally curious about fields which I know little about and I find that many of the ne people I've been close to are really pleased to find an audience to perform for or to share their findings with. So in the end, we often have a bit of an unbalanced flow of information. I think infjs have to guard against doing this and it's not the other person's responsibility, but it also helps if the other person is aware that their responsiveness or encouragement may influence how much they learn about the infjs intellectual life. I think infjs sometimes over rely on how other people respond to them to gauge appropriateness or acceptance or to guard against feeling negatively towards someone whose regard they value.

 

[Non_xsense]

I was thinking more about this. I think that Ni is more cyclical and repetitive and in depth only on a few topics compared to Ne. It tends to stick more to certain areas of specialization, although as a Ni Dom, I like the breadth of knowledge and curiosity that ne users exhibit or bring to me. They seem to better be able to keep track of where they encountered different bits of information or ideas, and also are open to almost anything that comes their way. I'm more likely to dismiss some things because of their source, or because it's of less relevance to me and I also don't venture as far afield or get bored as easily as them. I think Ne and Ni are complementary in that sense, but I can understand how to a ne user it may seem that they are intellectually lighter.

I think especially in the past too, I was protective of things that mattered a lot to me until I could gauge the other person's likely response because disinterest in something I was excited about felt like rejection of me and I didn't want to complicate the relationship between me and others with feeling hurt or resentful. I think too, ne users tend to easily talk about all the things they are exploring or find interesting whereas Ni users (or at least infjs) are more likely to err on the side of waiting to be asked or they maybe feel rebuffed more easily if they volunteer something and there is no response or a negative one.

I am naturally curious about fields which I know little about and I find that many of the ne people I've been close to are really pleased to find an audience to perform for or to share their findings with. So in the end, we often have a bit of an unbalanced flow of information. I think infjs have to guard against doing this and it's not the other person's responsibility, but it also helps if the other person is aware that their responsiveness or encouragement may influence how much they learn about the infjs intellectual life. I think infjs sometimes over rely on how other people respond to them to gauge appropriateness or acceptance or to guard against feeling negatively towards someone whose regard they value.

Do you even know how Ne work actually?
First thing in google : theoretical possibilities and abstract connections in the world around them. Ne focuses on the objective, external world to find relationships and patterns between people, things, and events.
For Nt types change that descriptions for Concept rather than people.

Ne is basically the desire to use/change the concepts that exist in this world to find new ones . "Rules breaker" is almost a perfect description for Ne.

 

[Fidelia]

I think we agree on that. I'm not entirely sure what point you're making. Do you want to expand on that a bit?

 

[Non_xsense]

I think we agree on that. I'm not entirely sure what point you're making. Do you want to expand on that a bit?

Others types can just understand The surface of what you are But the more you can abstract yourself from your "way of thinking" , i think you can get a more deep knowledge of differents types motivations.
For Ni first funtion is very easy to getting stuck in their own way of thinking , I guess for Real Infj that can be alot harder 'cause almost every stack of their cognitive funtions are subjective .

 

[Fidelia]

Yes it's a huge problem, I think. It's very hard to see ourselves objectively except through how others mirror us back, which can be unreliable sometimes. Maybe that's why so much credence is given to someone's credibility before we are willing to really consider there point of view on personal or important matters, because whoever we trust to mirror has the potential to do damage if we are unable to kind of see ourselves a bit more objectively. So yes, that is maybe also why we might need some sense of emotional trust or relating in that way to also share as much intellectually. Interesting thought. I'd never really considered it quite that way before.

Come to think of it, I think that particular function stack is part of what can make infjs very unable to see how subjective they are being, even when they may have other areas where they can be insightful or more objective about. That objectivity is more able to occur outside of things involving them and ideas/people that they are invested in or feel strongly about.

Maybe it also explains the strange sense of vulnerability they may feel when discussing anything that matters particularly to them. Maybe they are personally entwined with it in a way that someone with a different function stack isn't and can't or wouldn't want to be.

However, it's also what makes them really interested in mastering whatever there is for them to know about those things that they have a huge personal stake in, sometimes to the extent that a partner may dislike it, or so someone may wonder why they care so much to know their preferences or find their study of people kind of like a science experiment and sort of strange or unnerving. That same trait can make them very devoted and thoughtful friends or partners in other ways though if they can let go of their need to understand what's going on constraining the other person's sense of autonomy or separateness.

 

[Non_xsense]

Yes it's a huge problem, I think. It's very hard to see ourselves objectively except through how others mirror us back, which can be unreliable sometimes. Maybe that's why so much credence is given to someone's credibility before we are willing to really consider there point of view on personal or important matters, because whoever we trust to mirror has the potential to do damage if we are unable to kind of see ourselves a bit more objectively. So yes, that is maybe also why we might need some sense of emotional trust or relating in that way to also share as much intellectually. Interesting thought. I'd never really considered it quite that way before.

Come to think of it, I think that particular function stack is part of what can make infjs very unable to see how subjective they are being, even when they may have other areas where they can be insightful or more objective about. That objectivity is more able to occur outside of things involving them and ideas/people that they are invested in or feel strongly about.

Maybe it also explains the strange sense of vulnerability they may feel when discussing anything that matters particularly to them. Maybe they are personally entwined with it in a way that someone with a different function stack isn't and can't or wouldn't want to be.

However, it's also what makes them really interested in mastering whatever there is for them to know about those things that they have a huge personal stake in, sometimes to the extent that a partner may dislike it, or so someone may wonder why they care so much to know their preferences or find their study of people kind of like a science experiment and sort of strange or unnerving. That same trait can make them very devoted and thoughtful friends or partners in other ways though if they can let go of their need to understand what's going on constraining the other person's sense of autonomy or separateness.

I can find ur strong Ni and Fe , actually i need to think alot of what you are saying to try to create Route to solve that ( Really i can't) , I'm just a stupid intp ( Not even native eglish speaker) with inferior Fe but i can understand The other primary Ni First Type( Intj, my father is one) quite easily('cause their Te)

I'm just saying.... my words here are probabily wrong , But you are using your subjective emotions goals to "cage" people how they should act( or make you feel).
I'm just talking from one pespective ( Nt or maybe not ) But every one of each type can express themself of what you feels in differents manner .....

Yeah , Nt types can't express themself how you want , We can show it to you in the best way we can ... solving actually objective problems( and make some sarcastic joke here and there.).

Actually i need to think alot about your words to ty to understand it .... which is quite funny( Actually my weakest point).

But really what you expect from ur emotional side is so much .... There is not type which can provide that ...all types can try to understand that tho(in their way of course).

 

[Fidelia]

I think I understand what you're saying. I have less experience with intjs in real life, but I think that at times nfjs can expect that there is a certain way people should relate that matches what they would do to show someone they care or how they would interact with someone. However, each type has their own way of doing things and communicating and just because it is not the same, it doesn't mean that it's wrong. NFJs tend to value relating on an emotional level, but not every type is going to readily do that and perhaps it seems to you that NFJs are unwilling or unable to adapt to other ways than their own preferred one? I think I understand better then what you were asking earlier. What is your first language?

 

[Non_xsense]

I think I understand what you're saying. I have less experience with intjs in real life, but I think that at times nfjs can expect that there is a certain way people should relate that matches what they would do to show someone they care or how they would interact with someone. However, each type has their own way of doing things and communicating and just because it is not the same, it doesn't mean that it's wrong. NFJs tend to value relating on an emotional level, but not every type is going to readily do that and perhaps it seems to you that NFJs are unwilling or unable to adapt to other ways than their own preferred one? I think I understand better then what you were asking earlier. What is your first language?

Actually that is a very Fe somewhat Fi Perspective ... Mine isn't That "Healthty way" . you can probabily create a more sophisticated way of seeing emotionals problems than me.
Basically all what im saying is that : All types ...you can just analize one part of the reality , evolution is alot more smarter than us ....there is not another way to survive than having all types.

 

[rav3n]

INPs focus on breadth/possibilities. INJs on depth/underlying meanings. With this in mind, your opening post problems don't mesh with theory.