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View Poll Results: Why do some thinkers demonize feelers

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  • They are emotionally immature.

    58 31.18%
  • They just don't understand how feelers make decisions.

    90 48.39%
  • They confuse emotion with the MBTI definition of feeler.

    96 51.61%
  • They have an irrational fear of empathy.

    27 14.52%
  • They lack social skills.

    28 15.05%
  • They're big meanies!

    38 20.43%
  • Feelers are simply better at resolving conflict and dealing with their emotions

    10 5.38%
  • Feelers demonize thinkers in private instead of openly.

    25 13.44%
  • I'm a feeler and I think feelers suck too.

    10 5.38%
  • Other.

    39 20.97%
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  1. #41
    / booyalab's Avatar
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    where's the "because feelers deserve it" option?

    jk. But seriously, this isn't that complicated. There are stupid people. There are mean people. There are people who are both stupid and mean. When the people in category #3 meet anyone in either of the other categories it usually leads to gross stereotyping. (though sometimes they can set aside their similarities and form a stalwart bond)
    I don't wanna!

  2. #42
    Senor Membrane
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    Damn, my answer is not an option on the poll...

    The "thinkers" who demonize feelers are actually mistyped feelers themselves.

    I'm not sure how probable this is, but it is certainly a possibility. Mistyping yourself is so easy if you suppress your emotions. Or, if you have no social life, and still are a feeler, you would on many tests come out as a T.

    I also like these views:

    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    SO basically add that all up, and you'll get kids who are pissed off at bossy 'Fs' and people IRL who they feel set upon them with irrational emotionally expressive ways. They want a soothing place where they don't have to deal with this kind of person or really kind of interaction, where the quiet and order of online communication strips everything to the logic and predictability and safety of words and methodical ideas.

    Yes?
    Quote Originally Posted by SquirrelTao View Post
    Ironically, a true thinker would really be looking at feelers dispassionately and acceptingly rather than feeling negative emotions about feelers - apparently emotions such as disdain, fear, dislike, aversion, annoyance, etc.

    Interesting you picked the word demonize. I don't know how deeply you thought about your word choice, but it is suggestive to me of projecting their disowned and distorted shadow onto feelers.

  3. #43
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    It's because very emotional people sometimes don't respond to reason, which leaves us helpless when dealing with them. It's that simple I think. E's, S's, and J's have tendencies that I don't like so much either, but it doesn't mean I don't like people with different mbti functions than mine.
    I'd like to offer my viewpoint on the comment, aj, about being "helpless" in dealing with people. The way you've worded your puzzlement edges close to justification for brow-beating others. And I'm guessing you would never want to do that. To my perception that is a false belief that can lead to confusing and adversarial relationships.

    I'd like to offer encouragement to reformulate this idea for yourself. With good communication skills and the knowledge you are building by participating on this board you are on your way to communicating with various styles of personality in a way which can build confidence and a sense of connection, if not understanding, with others.

    Who wants to feel helpless in their relationships with others? No one. So make a few changes and empower yourself. Healthy folks are all about ready to support your transformation from "helpless" to confident.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  4. #44
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by booyalab View Post
    where's the "because feelers deserve it" option?


    jk. But seriously, this isn't that complicated. There are stupid people. There are mean people. There are people who are both stupid and mean. When the people in category #3 meet anyone in either of the other categories it usually leads to gross stereotyping. (though sometimes they can set aside their similarities and form a stalwart bond)
    And this seems to represent a large portion of the percieved population...
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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  5. #45
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Well. And "stupid" and "mean" are social disabilities in others that strike us at a gut level. Fear? Possibly. Either quality in another human sends out red flags. Sometimes for me it strikes too close to home to be comfortable.

    What would a good response to either be?

    Some think punuishment of some sort. Ostracization. Verbal or physical battering. A personally smug, self-superior attitude. These are common defenses against something which disturbs us.

    What do do those subjective reponses do to improve our general social condition? So far, I haven't seen that group of reactions produce an improved society. . .
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  6. #46
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    I've been on these forums for a while and it seems like every month or so I see some thread asking why feelers suck or why we need feelings or something like that. (And that is not even counting the ones started by BlueWing.) On top of that even outside the forum I see people complain about feeling type behavior more than vice versa. As a thinker I have to admit that I don't really understand my own kind on this issue, so I thought I'd come to the NF forum, i.e. those who understand people the best.

    So feelers, please give me the straight dope. Why do there seem to be a lot of thinkers that demonize people with a feeling preference? Is it lack of socializing, confusion about MBTI, irrational fear of empathy, or something else entirely? Also why do fewer feelers seem to return in kind?
    Well, there are at least a few reasons. The classical one in MBTI is given in "Gifts Differing":

    Quote Originally Posted by Gifts Differing, Ch. 10
    Thinkers, for instance, notice the lack of logic in a feeling type, and they tend to underrate the others judgment because it is not logical. They have reason to distrust feeling. Knowing their own feeling is erratic and not very serviceable, thinkers try to keep it out of their decisions and assume that other people's feeling is no more trustworthy than their own. Actually, the feeling of the feeling types is a more skilled judge even than the thinker's thinking, for example, in judging which things people value most.
    This is probably the most common reason. The other reason is probably due to a desire to boost their own ego as Thinking types, or because they've been hurt by a Feeling type and unconsciously want sympathy or something.

    Yet another reason could be mistaking Feeling function for emotion, and assuming that Feeling types make their decisions based on emotion, not recognizing Feeling as a form of value judgment based on more than simple emotion.

    Actually, feelers do complain about thinking types when hurt by them... we just tend not to do it so publicly, because we don't want to hurt them, and don't want to worry about defending our feelings against various other perspectives. If I have to defend my feelings against arguments, that's missing the point of sharing them, because they are by nature subjective.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Sunshine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by disregard View Post
    When individuals are unwilling to acknowledge their responsibility in their state discontentment and their power to secure their own happiness, then they will be a source of radiant negative energy.
    Wow.

    Do you write at all?

  8. #48
    Senior Member Sunshine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I gripe about people being illogical as much or more than I gripe about them being heartless.
    Oh I don't. But I'm an Enneagram 4 and an HSP.
    People not knowing how to treat each other is my biggest pet peeve. (Not that I always treat people the way I should )
    But people being illogical does get irritating once in a while. Especially when I'm the one being illogical. =P

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunshine View Post
    Wow.

    Do you write at all?
    Only every day.

  10. #50
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    I've been on these forums for a while and it seems like every month or so I see some thread asking why feelers suck or why we need feelings or something like that. (And that is not even counting the ones started by BlueWing.) On top of that even outside the forum I see people complain about feeling type behavior more than vice versa. As a thinker I have to admit that I don't really understand my own kind on this issue, so I thought I'd come to the NF forum, i.e. those who understand people the best.

    So feelers, please give me the straight dope. Why do there seem to be a lot of thinkers that demonize people with a feeling preference? Is it lack of socializing, confusion about MBTI, irrational fear of empathy, or something else entirely? Also why do fewer feelers seem to return in kind?
    I think it is actually a byproduct of our social values. Western society sets a priority on scientific investigation, which has moved us forward in many ways. It is possible that the layman's interpretation of reason tends towards this rejection of emotion and other aspects of their humanity. The arts are continually at risk in society. Arguments can be made that our society lacks balance and integration of our humanity in favor of compartmentalism.

    MBTI and the Thinker vs. Feeler dichotomy is a theory, not a proven fact. What is proven is that the limbic system in human brains regulates and processes emotional responses. We all also have a frontal lobe which regulates both reason and emotion.

    Creating lower resolution of people through systems like MBTI helps us to more easily process reality. What often happens in these threads that attack some MBTI function is that we have a person who has had a negative social experience they wish to avoid in the future and need a place to rant about it. Those disappointments are then categorized as resulting from a specific category of people and this category is rejected in an attempt to avoid future disappointments.

    The irony with the "T" rejection of "F" is that it, like all other examples of this sort of thing, is prejudicial and results from personal feeling and disappointment at social interactions. It is one of the most telling proofs that the differences between T and F are much less distinct than we construct in this theory.
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