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  1. #201
    ThatGirl
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    I must admit I skipped most of the posts on this thread because BW came to offer his view again.. anyhow...



    I see what you mean, basically, but as people have said you tend to focus on the negative side of feeling judgment. Other problem with what you said above is that you assume F-decision to have much to do with immediate situation. Mostly it is not about "what I want now". This would be immature. We actually do think the long term consequences. If I want cookies and I know where my friend keeps them, I will think that if I stole them, he will get mad when he finds out. So I don't steal them.

    The selfish talk is also relevant to immature F, not all F. The "normal" F likes to see people happy. He likes this even more than his personal satisfaction in an immediate situation, that way he can give away most of his cookies just to make people smile.

    On a longer time line the selfishness could be seen in F-plans. At least for me, my own life is the most important thing in the world. I want to be happy and so on. But this isn't the kind of selfishness that takes something away from people, since for me to be happy I also need some folks to like me. I need people, I cant offend them too badly. So the selfishness comes out seeming like unselfishness and caring. But if you stuck me in a situation that I feel unhappy (for example being stuck with a girl that isnt for me) I will consider my personal happiness to be the important thing, not other people's feelings.
    I don't see why happiness is in the equation at all. happiness to me comes from within the self and is not swayed by external circumstances easily. Because you can not control the world it is best not to rely on things or situations for gratification. To me the world is separate from emotion which only exists with in myself. By putting that aside it gives a clearer view of how to handle situations for maximum efficiency. This includes putting aside the will to make people happy or to be self sacrificing which to me is martyr ish. It serves no purpose to anyone if everything is functioning to its capability.

    On a side note I am not seeking factual statements only true perception and am also asking for the chance to challenge those perceptions while I open the floor for mine to be challenged as well. I was saying that if fact was what was called for then it was not mine to give. It would not make sense to seek fact on perception based scenarios. But I am a little tired of defending myself in order to soothe others misconceptions that they don't question but hold people accountable to. I played along for a while but that drives me crazy. So from here on out I will only listen no more comments from the peanut gallery. Just listen and learn.

  2. #202
    heart on fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    I'm sorry I thought that N people could follow concept.
    You didn't lay out any rationale besides pure opinion for your theories.

    I in no way in the OP claimed to be able to present concrete evidence to support t vs f. Everyone that has participated in this thread was aware of my thoughts and given adaquate time to provide some rationality to the situation in order to clear mis conceptions and unite theory. The proof was not mine to give as I am not a feeler. That is rationality.
    If you make assertions, it's up to you to support them.

    But I am a little tired of defending myself in order to soothe others misconceptions that they don't question but hold people accountable to.
    This is a very ironic comment.

  3. #203
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    I don't see why happiness is in the equation at all. happiness to me comes from within the self and is not swayed by external circumstances easily. Because you can not control the world it is best not to rely on things or situations for gratification. To me the world is separate from emotion which only exists with in myself. By putting that aside it gives a clearer view of how to handle situations for maximum efficiency. This includes putting aside the will to make people happy or to be self sacrificing which to me is martyr ish. It serves no purpose to anyone if everything is functioning to its capability.
    Happiness comes from the inside for you. I suppose it is irrational to enjoy an ice cream cone. Do you like ice cream? I suppose it is irrational to enjoy another person's company. I guess that means why bother coming together at all? Oh, maybe to solve a problem, but that still gives an indication of relying on someone else for help in solving it. Is that irrational? (I'm not being an ass about this question)

    On a side note I am not seeking factual statements only true perception and am also asking for the chance to challenge those perceptions while I open the floor for mine to be challenged as well. I was saying that if fact was what was called for then it was not mine to give. It would not make sense to seek fact on perception based scenarios. But I am a little tired of defending myself in order to soothe others misconceptions that they don't question but hold people accountable to. I played along for a while but that drives me crazy. So from here on out I will only listen no more comments from the peanut gallery. Just listen and learn.
    So if I understand this correctly, we are to divulge our experiences and have you critique their validity? I actually want you to answer this question.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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  4. #204
    ThatGirl
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    You didn't lay out any rationale besides pure opinion for your theories.



    If you make assertions, it's up to you to support them.



    This is a very ironic comment.
    Ok I have never been good at just dropping something.

    The tread is entitled why fers give me the creeps. Paving the way for perception based theory and proving that I was willing to challenge my misconceptions if there were any. It was not entitled all feeling people are creeps at which point I would be expected to provide tangible reasons for such a statement. The irony is lost. As well as the ability for growth because I upset you guys so we will just let that be the foundation of the concept.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    It was not entitled all feeling people are creeps
    But by saying "feelers," you are indicating that feelers are more responsible for the actions you mention than thinkers.

    I do not think heart, or any of us, were outraged that you would assert that all feelers were like this, which you never did.

    The issue lies in your baseless pointing of fingers.

  6. #206
    Senior Member Leysing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    Yes feelers will share their cookies then when they have no cookies blame everyone for not taking into consideration that they gave all their cookies to you to make you happy but did so without considering the fact that you may not be in a place to replace the cookies at all. Then there is a bunch of hurt feelings and a situation that could have been easilly avoided if everyone just ate their own cookies and didn't try to make anyone happy without first objectively evaluating the situation beyond desire.
    Yes, a childish and overemotional F can very well do that.

    It's good to balance F with some T, as well as T with some F. Overpowering and suppressing is a different thing, and I doubt it would work. (When my Te takes the lead, bad things happen...)

  7. #207
    Senior Member SillyGoose's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    First of all don't be offended by the title I just thought it was funny.

    F people creep me out. I don't understand them. I see making decisions off of your feelings as selfish and irrisponsible. The worst excuse ever, "I felt like it", like that matters. If people justify their actions according to their feelings where is the line that says what you were feeling is wrong. It seems immature. How is putting your feelings on someone else productive to anything? Where is the self control? You cant argue against what someone is feeling and asking someone to take your feelings into account is like asking them to cater unobjectively to you.

    I am not trying to make people mad here I am trying to understand. What makes you all tick?

    Ok, so I've seen a few posters respond to your original post without a direct reply from you...I will do it from my perspective to try to reach some ground with you.

    To start with, you're assuming that feelers only go with what they feel like at the moment. This is not true. I tend to look at everything in a situation to sum up my feelings. And I do think about how I am feeling and think about the situation to take my course of action.

    Example -- If everyone wants to order lunch right NOW, but Sally won't be in the office for another 10 minutes....I will make sure we wait until Sally gets to the office to order so that one person isn't left out. So, yeah, 7 people had to wait an extra 10 minutes for lunch...but okay, Sally wasn't excluded.

    You are also assuming that feelers all deal and feel the same way about everything.

    Personally, I'm more of the type who considers other people's feelings before my own. Even at times when I should be really upset with someone, I really try hard to keep connecting with them and meeting somewhere with them (usually I end up budging more than halfway.)

    Also, I've never used the excuse that "I felt like it." While I may not leave any feelings that I may have about the situation out of it and only provide a, b, c.....I will probably give MORE information about the why of what I did than a rational.

    To me, it is irrational to not consider everyone's feelings before making a decision that could affect people. Granted you don't need to run every single thing past every person, but if you know a decision is going to affect someone than I think it is logical to think about how it is going to affect them and whether they would like it or not or how they react.

    Now, I know I didn't quite answer your questions in the original post. Honestly though, I don't see how they can be questioned as they don't even really directly pertain to just feelers. It almost seems to me that an immature person that you've had problems with inspired this thread.
    "My mom told me there was a weirdo on every bus, but I never could find him." Emo Phillips

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    First of all don't be offended by the title I just thought it was funny.

    F people creep me out. I don't understand them. I see making decisions off of your feelings as selfish and irrisponsible. The worst excuse ever, "I felt like it", like that matters. If people justify their actions according to their feelings where is the line that says what you were feeling is wrong. It seems immature. How is putting your feelings on someone else productive to anything? Where is the self control? You cant argue against what someone is feeling and asking someone to take your feelings into account is like asking them to cater unobjectively to you.

    I am not trying to make people mad here I am trying to understand. What makes you all tick?
    Do you realize how many value judgments you made against people who make value judgments? If not, I bolded them for you.
    I don't wanna!

  9. #209
    ThatGirl
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    My theories have come from a recognition of patters and association with feeling people as a whole. Through experience, time, and an ability to quickly sum up individual capabilities I have decided that feelers are capable of the most beautiful and most ugly actions ever taken. Being that desires or emotions can be quite unpredictable this ability to disregard rational thought for feeling creeps me out. I have experienced first hand with many feelers that they react off of feeling before getting the whole picture much to the dismay of others at which point they only rely on the justification of their feelings for a sense of validation. This makes feelers ticking time bombs in my opinion.

  10. #210
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    My theories have come from a recognition of patters and association with feeling people as a whole. Through experience, time, and an ability to quickly sum up individual capabilities I have decided that feelers are capable of the most beautiful and most ugly actions ever taken. Being that desires or emotions can be quite unpredictable this ability to disregard rational thought for feeling creeps me out. I have experienced first hand with many feelers that they react off of feeling before getting the whole picture much to the dismay of others at which point they only rely on the justification of their feelings for a sense of validation. This makes feelers ticking time bombs in my opinion.
    And we have indicated that much of this ticking bomb stuff tends to be more from immaturity of feelers which can be quite a large number depending on who you are around. I think both sides of this discussion are having trouble understanding what the other side is saying. Your opinion is not invalid when you do not take into account maturity. What is there further to discuss?
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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