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  1. #11
    Senior Member Littlelostnf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IEE623 View Post
    i know what you mean.... i a lot of times don't pay attention to my words.... i like being spontaneous and out of the confined.... but it seems like people can't catch up with my thoughts..... especially my ENFJ friends, she keeps castigating my being not selective with words because it's inconsiderate *_*
    sometimes i tell jokes, but people just take 'em the wrong way, serious way... i mean just "sometimes", not that often though

    Let your utterances be gracious...seasoned with salt. (old proverb)

    (salt is not only for flavor it's also a preservative and keeps things suitible for eating...)

    I think in my head of many things I could say...alot of them would be cutting..what's the point unless it's someone who is being a complete jerk...and even then it's not worth it sometimes people like that seldom ever think they are wrong and it's pointless to argue with them....(lots of examples of this on this forum...and from all the types) Someone said once on here that they've never heard me say anything mean to anyone on the forum...I've definately thought it...BIG TIME...and if I feel strongly enough about something I'll say it...tactfully but definately with force so they get the point. People generally can't handle when I don't censor myself because usually it's very pointed and it usually ends the convo.

    Your friend who says it's inconsiderate to not pay attention to your words and who you say them to is correct (in my book and maybe it's an ENFJ thing) Perhaps it's not that she can't catch up with your thoughts...maybe she's with and beyond your thinking in terms of she gets it..she gets it a joke but she's thinking about how your words "could" be construed.

    It's hard to censor yourself for oversenstive people...it's alot easier to just say what you want and tell people to get over it.
    for my life is slowed up by thought and the need to understand what I am living.

  2. #12
    Senior Member IEE623's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlelostnf View Post
    Your friend who says it's inconsiderate to not pay attention to your words and who you say them to is correct (in my book and maybe it's an ENFJ thing) Perhaps it's not that she can't catch up with your thoughts...maybe she's with and beyond your thinking in terms of she gets it..she gets it a joke but she's thinking about how your words "could" be construed.
    ENFJs are seemed to be always right, aren't they?

    i know she gets it, what i mean as a joke. but she doesnt put herself in my shoes. she doesn't know that my thoughts are like jumping frogs. she doesn't know that i can't be like her, so focused... she expects me to act like her, think like her, and be considerate to everyone like her.... basically she just doesnt know i use NeFi while she uses FeNi

    anyway, don't take it in a wrong way... she's my closest friend i just hate it whenever we're in a fight.... otherwise, we're so cool
    "Adversity makes men, and prosperity makes monsters"

  3. #13
    Senior Member chris1207's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlelostnf View Post
    People generally can't handle when I don't censor myself because usually it's very pointed and it usually ends the convo.
    I've run into this before. It's so often the case that I end forum topics because of it. I don't care about what the mbti says, Js and especially EXXJ's are the most judgmental of all the types. I really hate when I'm hanging out and I want to express my thoughts and I realize before I open my mouth that they're critical. I hate that that's my knee-jerk reaction. I don't like the idea of constraining the way that others are. I just like the idea of guiding people towards activities and ways of thinking that would be beneficial to them (in my mind at least.)

    But yeah, me and my ENFP friend were talking about headphones and I had just gotten over the ear ones. I had been using the stock buds that came with my mp3 player but the SQ sucks. My Fe was torn between wearing the over the ear ones in public or staying with the buds cuz I think that people with fullsized headphones in public are kinda douchebaggy. I told my friend this and he got offended and as we continued to talk he got more defensive about other stuff we moved onto.

    Point is, that's why I hate being spontaneous. Fe spontaneously judges those around me.

    P.S. you spelled "definitely" wrong! What a dumbdumb head! *shut up Fe* Sorry about that!
    "... you think deeply about stuff [that] nobody cares about and hardly anybody can understand you." ~ Peguy talking about Ni users. So true.

  4. #14
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    omg.

    this slightly being careful with my words talking one on one people i don't know as well, is like... doing hella good things.

    cus then its like this slowly opening up process? for them? or me? or both? lol

    dood, crazyness.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Littlelostnf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris1207 View Post
    P.S. you spelled "definitely" wrong! What a dumbdumb head! *shut up Fe* Sorry about that!
    Ha I'm a teacher and a notoriously bad speller. If I don't go over things with a fine tooth there is always something spelled wrong. That's Fe telling me I've spelled something wrong...

    I thought Fe would be hacking into the system and my account and changing my poor spelling before anyone else found out I can't spell....?

    for my life is slowed up by thought and the need to understand what I am living.

  6. #16
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris1207 View Post
    I've run into this before. It's so often the case that I end forum topics because of it. I don't care about what the mbti says, Js and especially EXXJ's are the most judgmental of all the types. I really hate when I'm hanging out and I want to express my thoughts and I realize before I open my mouth that they're critical. I hate that that's my knee-jerk reaction. I don't like the idea of constraining the way that others are. I just like the idea of guiding people towards activities and ways of thinking that would be beneficial to them (in my mind at least.)

    But yeah, me and my ENFP friend were talking about headphones and I had just gotten over the ear ones. I had been using the stock buds that came with my mp3 player but the SQ sucks. My Fe was torn between wearing the over the ear ones in public or staying with the buds cuz I think that people with fullsized headphones in public are kinda douchebaggy. I told my friend this and he got offended and as we continued to talk he got more defensive about other stuff we moved onto.

    Point is, that's why I hate being spontaneous. Fe spontaneously judges those around me.

    P.S. you spelled "definitely" wrong! What a dumbdumb head! *shut up Fe* Sorry about that!
    I've thought about the EJ=judgmental conumdrum for awhile. I know that I give parameters to my decisions and people often get the benefit of the doubt but after awhile I give no more.

    What gets me is people act like all judgments are incorrect or prematurely obtained. You can make a decision about someone, a situation, an idea and just because you reached your conclusion faster than others doesn't mean you didn't accurately access the situation. You can gather information into infinity and still pick the wrong pieces of information and make the wrong decision. I think what people think is it you do it quickly, you did it wrong. Ultimately for me it's about making the best decision I can make and I look for information to help me make it. I actually do a lot of sorting and sifting through my perceptions. I guess it's like going to a garage sale, or junk yard, or buffet and picking out the best stuff.

    If I paid attention to what was said on the forum about EJs I'd be useless. And for a while I was highly self-conscious in the way I engaged with my world because I was listening to the whinging of forumites. But I'm going to be me and I'm an EJ gotdammit. I make decisions, I typically go into situations with a clear head and a plan. I reach conclusions faster than other people and when I've know I've made a sound decision or conclusion I'm not going to second guess myself.

    Areas of improvement for EJs are making sound judgments, working on their discernment of situations, picking the most useful and pertinent information from their perceptions and then proceeding. You can revise as you go. I mean this completely feeds a an irrational pet peeve of mine: I hate when I see I line opening up and people are just milling around confused like they don't know what to do. I'm thinking don't just stand there with your teeth in your mouth! Move, do something! Yeah, that annoys me.

    As that relates to Fe, I'm not going to say I haven't made premature and inaccurate decisions about people. But honestly, 8 out of 10 times I'm not far off so I doubt I'm going to change the way I do things and I think I'm a pretty good judge of character. I enjoy being pleasantly surprised so I'll keep those other two open. I have managed to avoid a lot of problems many of my peers face(d) because I'm very selective about the people who get close to me and are capable of influencing me. So while that may look judgmental to somebody else the only thing I've got less of is the baggage they're toting around.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  7. #17
    Senior Member IEE623's Avatar
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    OMG why the hell are all of you ENFJs so much alike? :steam:
    "Adversity makes men, and prosperity makes monsters"

  8. #18
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I've thought about the EJ=judgmental conumdrum for awhile. I know that I give parameters to my decisions and people often get the benefit of the doubt but after awhile I give no more.

    What gets me is people act like all judgments are incorrect or prematurely obtained. You can make a decision about someone, a situation, an idea and just because you reached your conclusion faster than others doesn't mean you didn't accurately access the situation. You can gather information into infinity and still pick the wrong pieces of information and make the wrong decision. I think what people think is it you do it quickly, you did it wrong. Ultimately for me it's about making the best decision I can make and I look for information to help me make it. I actually do a lot of sorting and sifting through my perceptions. I guess it's like going to a garage sale, or junk yard, or buffet and picking out the best stuff.

    If I paid attention to what was said on the forum about EJs I'd be useless. And for a while I was highly self-conscious in the way I engaged with my world because I was listening to the whinging of forumites. But I'm going to be me and I'm an EJ gotdammit. I make decisions, I typically go into situations with a clear head and a plan. I reach conclusions faster than other people and when I've know I've made a sound decision or conclusion I'm not going to second guess myself.

    Areas of improvement for EJs are making sound judgments, working on their discernment of situations, picking the most useful and pertinent information from their perceptions and then proceeding. You can revise as you go. I mean this completely feeds a an irrational pet peeve of mine: I hate when I see I line opening up and people are just milling around confused like they don't know what to do. I'm thinking don't just stand there with your teeth in your mouth! Move, do something! Yeah, that annoys me.

    As that relates to Fe, I'm not going to say I haven't made premature and inaccurate decisions about people. But honestly, 8 out of 10 times I'm not far off so I doubt I'm going to change the way I do things and I think I'm a pretty good judge of character. I enjoy being pleasantly surprised so I'll keep those other two open. I have managed to avoid a lot of problems many of my peers face(d) because I'm very selective about the people who get close to me and are capable of influencing me. So while that may look judgmental to somebody else the only thing I've got less of is the baggage they're toting around.
    Of course, a good life is based on good judgement.

    But I was wondering - what happens when you slow down - and I mean really, really slow down - so slow time seems to stop.

    Do you or can you imagine going slower and slower and slower, until you can't go any slower without stopping?

    What happens at that moment?

    Does the thought embarrass you? Or does the thought interest you? Can you feel yourself going slower as you read this, or are you skimming over the surface like a gadfly.

    But most of all, what is your judgement, what is your judgement of this?

  9. #19
    Senior Member Littlelostnf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I've thought about the EJ=judgmental conumdrum for awhile. I know that I give parameters to my decisions and people often get the benefit of the doubt but after awhile I give no more.

    What gets me is people act like all judgments are incorrect or prematurely obtained. You can make a decision about someone, a situation, an idea and just because you reached your conclusion faster than others doesn't mean you didn't accurately access the situation. You can gather information into infinity and still pick the wrong pieces of information and make the wrong decision. I think what people think is it you do it quickly, you did it wrong. Ultimately for me it's about making the best decision I can make and I look for information to help me make it. I actually do a lot of sorting and sifting through my perceptions. I guess it's like going to a garage sale, or junk yard, or buffet and picking out the best stuff.

    If I paid attention to what was said on the forum about EJs I'd be useless. And for a while I was highly self-conscious in the way I engaged with my world because I was listening to the whinging of forumites. But I'm going to be me and I'm an EJ gotdammit. I make decisions, I typically go into situations with a clear head and a plan. I reach conclusions faster than other people and when I've know I've made a sound decision or conclusion I'm not going to second guess myself.

    Areas of improvement for EJs are making sound judgments, working on their discernment of situations, picking the most useful and pertinent information from their perceptions and then proceeding. You can revise as you go. I mean this completely feeds a an irrational pet peeve of mine: I hate when I see I line opening up and people are just milling around confused like they don't know what to do. I'm thinking don't just stand there with your teeth in your mouth! Move, do something! Yeah, that annoys me.

    As that relates to Fe, I'm not going to say I haven't made premature and inaccurate decisions about people. But honestly, 8 out of 10 times I'm not far off so I doubt I'm going to change the way I do things and I think I'm a pretty good judge of character. I enjoy being pleasantly surprised so I'll keep those other two open. I have managed to avoid a lot of problems many of my peers face(d) because I'm very selective about the people who get close to me and are capable of influencing me. So while that may look judgmental to somebody else the only thing I've got less of is the baggage they're toting around.

    what ^ she said.
    for my life is slowed up by thought and the need to understand what I am living.

  10. #20
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Modern Nomad View Post
    hey guys and gals...

    so sometimes i realize that i have to be very very careful with my words...

    especially with people who might take it the wrong way...

    mmm... u guys know what i mean?

    dang, yeah what a random comment tho... lol
    TOTALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I mean, I have stuck my foot in my mouth more times than I can recall.

    DOH!!!!! Is this an ENFP thing or a Carolyn thing?!?!?!
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

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