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  1. #11
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Once I'm in a relationship, I'm in.
    would you care to elaborate? what have you learned about what you need to make a commitment and how you can follow through with it?

    i'm getting better at a lot of things, but i find consistent acceptance is still really difficult for me to give. it's like, i still have to learn how to let go of needs/wants at times, and if i overspend in any way, this becomes exponentially more difficult to keep up with.

  2. #12
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    the only pattern i've noticed is that the withdrawn types, 4s, 5s, and 9s often have some boundary issues.
    I think 3-6-9 do the jump in/out thing more. It's like their initial win-you-over strategy is for their benefit, and then after that they consider what they want to do with the established connection or how they actually feel. This looks inconsistent from the outside.

    I can agree with @Gingko about being in once I'm in.... but I don't commit quickly until I've considered what that means in a situation. I think "slow to warm" is more INFP than "slow to commit". Of course, from my perspective this makes sense - the growing warmth means I feel a growing bond. But other people can be warm & enthusiastic about things & it has no correlation to their level of commitment. That's confusing to me. I frankly don't see 4s or 5s do this so much. The level of energy needed for that is too much.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  3. #13
    Member Curtis B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    the only pattern i've noticed is that the withdrawn types, 4s, 5s, and 9s often have some boundary issues. a long, long time ago, i dated a 9w1 sx/sp infp, and we both made each other's lives hell with our constant push/pull. feeling engulfed and feeling abandoned. without recognizing your own needs, it's very difficult to take ownership of yourself and be at all realistic at what kinds of boundaries you need in order to be able to best function.

    the sx thing, i think, adds its own unique spin, a very addictive quality. where we will only want the best, and keep wanting it, rather than diversify and find more balanced, more flexible ways of meeting our needs. we can be kind of exhausting in terms of how much conflict we bring into our own lives and those of others as a result. i'm still just scratching the surface of how to deal with this. always wanting more sometimes is just a sign of impatience and inflexibility. trying to own this seems really helpful, but again, it seems like a lifelong work. relationships don't always have enough time to evolve with such challenges. they just get burned out by the constant elevated blood pressure, the constriction of sx. <--i don't exactly know what kind of metaphor this is supposed to be. just too much crisis.

    the one thing i have found is having an ongoing "needs" conversation. it's really helpful at undermining entitlements and resentments, offers a consistent opportunity to ASK for empathy (which helps me relax and realize i'm not just running on my own schedule anymore), and helps get at the underlying needs that can move us away from right/wrong resentment-filled assessments and help us see the core process of continuing to relate most clearly. it's so much easier to accept a "no," when someone needs to ask for a boundary not because they don't care about you but because they have their own shit and are communicating that in a way that is first owning that. when you offer your own vulnerability, it makes the movements of giving more accessible and much, much more rewarding for both sides. the recognition is just there.
    I'm a 9w1, Sx/So, but i don't exactly understand what the varients mean, would you mind explaining to me? perhaps it would allow me to better understand what you're trying to get across. Thanks!

    I think 3-6-9 do the jump in/out thing more. It's like their initial win-you-over strategy is for their benefit, and then after that they consider what they want to do with the established connection or how they actually feel. This looks inconsistent from the outside.
    I think you've nailed it. I'm starting wonder if "commitment issues" aren't my issue, but rather what you're described here. I don't always understand my feelings and perhaps this is one case where I'm rationalized my jump in-jump out patter by categorizing it as commitment issues.

    I'm currently in a relationship with another INFP, whom i belive is a type 4 enneagram. I have never felt so wonderful in my entire life.

  4. #14
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I think 3-6-9 do the jump in/out thing more. It's like their initial win-you-over strategy is for their benefit, and then after that they consider what they want to do with the established connection or how they actually feel. This looks inconsistent from the outside.
    i see what you mean about 3-6-9. to me, they tend to focus on the whole of the interaction, and don't really see themselves for themselves or the other for the other separately. 1, 4, 7 seem to be pretty "what i am trying to do"-focused, whereas 2, 5, and 8 tend to overidentify with what is outside of them and underidentify with themselves (even if they're obviously driven by themselves just as much as any other type). like a kind of lack of ownership of their own motives, ascribing their motives to things outside of themselves.

    i guess i would describe the e5 boundary issue thing as a sense of cautiousness and losing sight of self-ownership. maybe this is not jumping in and jumping out as much as it is an ongoing delay of making a decision. maybe 1, 3, and 5 are more likely to test that the relationship can truly stand up to the rigors of their senses of perfect before they are likely to allow themselves to fully recognize the value. this seems to be true for me.

    I can agree with @Gingko about being in once I'm in.... but I don't commit quickly until I've considered what that means in a situation. I think "slow to warm" is more INFP than "slow to commit". Of course, from my perspective this makes sense - the growing warmth means I feel a growing bond. But other people can be warm & enthusiastic about things & it has no correlation to their level of commitment. That's confusing to me. I frankly don't see 4s or 5s do this so much. The level of energy needed for that is too much.
    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis B View Post
    I'm a 9w1, Sx/So, but i don't exactly understand what the varients mean, would you mind explaining to me? perhaps it would allow me to better understand what you're trying to get across. Thanks!
    sx, so, and sp.

    i tend to see them in a more metaphysical way than most. in a social sense, i think sx is identifying with will, so with roles/reciprocity, and sp with space/security.

  5. #15
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    would you care to elaborate? what have you learned about what you need to make a commitment and how you can follow through with it?

    i'm getting better at a lot of things, but i find consistent acceptance is still really difficult for me to give. it's like, i still have to learn how to let go of needs/wants at times, and if i overspend in any way, this becomes exponentially more difficult to keep up with.

    I think, at this point, all of my other needs must be met before entering a relationship, ideally. If I have a supportive network of friends, a reliable environment of trust, a roof over my head and a means to keep happily busy, then I won't find myself armed to the tooth with expectations that my partner ought to fulfill some of these basic necessities. It becomes far easier to forgive my partner for just being human. I don't think that you have to accept behaviors you find to be distasteful, either. It suffices to recognize where your boundaries are and communicate about them, so you neither aid something you don't support nor detonate the entire relationship on the basis of something that may be inconsequential in the long term.

    Aside from that, I just think that if you fear your partner - if you feel they are an incorrigible threat to your emotional or physical well-being, then you should give it the axe.

  6. #16
    The Typing Tabby grey_beard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    the only pattern i've noticed is that the withdrawn types, 4s, 5s, and 9s often have some boundary issues. a long, long time ago, i dated a 9w1 sx/sp infp, and we both made each other's lives hell with our constant push/pull. feeling engulfed and feeling abandoned. without recognizing your own needs, it's very difficult to take ownership of yourself and be at all realistic at what kinds of boundaries you need in order to be able to best function.

    the sx thing, i think, adds its own unique spin, a very addictive quality. where we will only want the best, and keep wanting it, rather than diversify and find more balanced, more flexible ways of meeting our needs. we can be kind of exhausting in terms of how much conflict we bring into our own lives and those of others as a result. i'm still just scratching the surface of how to deal with this. always wanting more sometimes is just a sign of impatience and inflexibility. trying to own this seems really helpful, but again, it seems like a lifelong work. relationships don't always have enough time to evolve with such challenges. they just get burned out by the constant elevated blood pressure, the constriction of sx. <--i don't exactly know what kind of metaphor this is supposed to be. just too much crisis.

    the one thing i have found is having an ongoing "needs" conversation. it's really helpful at undermining entitlements and resentments, offers a consistent opportunity to ASK for empathy (which helps me relax and realize i'm not just running on my own schedule anymore), and helps get at the underlying needs that can move us away from right/wrong resentment-filled assessments and help us see the core process of continuing to relate most clearly. it's so much easier to accept a "no," when someone needs to ask for a boundary not because they don't care about you but because they have their own shit and are communicating that in a way that is first owning that. when you offer your own vulnerability, it makes the movements of giving more accessible and much, much more rewarding for both sides. the recognition is just there.
    Just. Holy. Freaking. Crap.
    A 5w4 sx, trying to make things work with a 9w1 sx/sp infp.
    No disrespect, but how did the two of you ever even manage to achieve *eye contact* let alone anything more?
    And before you get mad, I'm a 5w4 sx/sp myself.
    And even worse, I'm an INTJ.

    The constriction of sx is the insistence on intensity and DEEEEEEEP connection: but both the 5w4 and the 9w1 need acres and -- aw, hell, who am I kidding? -- square miles of space.
    And for the INFP it is at utterly unpredictable intervals.

    And despite one's own need for space, I surmise that one can't help but interpret the other's need for space as a deep-seated *personal* rejection; internalize the rejection; and get even *more* squirrely about daring to take the chance to reach out unilaterally -- even though that would be the one thing that might unlock the other.

    Perhaps -- just a suggestion -- in addition to the "needs" conversation, that one offers -- I hate to use the word -- "meta-cuddles" or "meta-closeness" : that is, when one does something out of love or to reassure the other, or to show affection, to come out and SAY "I'm doing this to express xyz positive feeling."

    Thanks for posting that...! (...and my deepest congatu-dolences, too.)
    "Love never needs time. But friendship always needs time. More and more and more time, up to long past midnight." -- The Crime of Captain Gahagan

    Please comment on my johari / nohari pages.

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