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  1. #41
    Senior Member Gabe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    If I had said something like this with NFP replacing NTJ I would have been flamed to death.
    bick fuckin' deal. Talk about feeling sorry for yourself (it is your other comment's that have incurred this tone, in case you're wondering).

    with that in mind, Cze's comment about ENTJs is not true. What I will say is that some ENTJ's when caught up in tertiary Se will think themselves a lot cooler and with-it than they are.

    And other ENTJs will be awkward and nerdy.

    And other's will be niether of the above.

  2. #42
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    ^^ That's why you lub us.
    I first read this as: That's why you lube us.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  3. #43
    Scream down the boulevard LadyJaye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    But from the forum, it seems to me ENTJ, especially young ENTJ male can just as likely be the typical obnoxious, smart-ass who puts more energy into proving how bad-ass he is then actually being a bad-ass. Me no likey. In fact, it's annoying. It's like an INTP on roid rage. Not cute.

    If I ever try to do 'type dating' for dudes, I'll specify 'ENTJ male over 30'
    Immature ENTJ's are not to be borne. They frequently mistake their opinions for law, because they flatter themselves into believing that no one else could have possibly thought a situation through as much as they have, ere go, all other opinions become invalid. I am a Feeler, but that doesn't mean that my logic or my reasoning skills suddenly get sucked out of my brain the moment I have a feeling. Anything reasoned or felt by a human being is subject to the flaws of the human mind, which can come out in the form of logic that is not objective ( as usually there is a subjective goal in mind, in the first place ). Feelings do not necessarily create faulty decision making skills. My best friend is a hard core ENTJ, and she frequently counsels with me about what to do when situations arise.

    Anyone who believes their logic to be so far above everyone else's that they can do no wrong, is simply arrogant.

  4. #44
    Branded with Satan murkrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabe View Post
    bick fuckin' deal. Talk about feeling sorry for yourself (it is your other comment's that have incurred this tone, in case you're wondering).

    with that in mind, Cze's comment about ENTJs is not true. What I will say is that some ENTJ's when caught up in tertiary Se will think themselves a lot cooler and with-it than they are.

    And other ENTJs will be awkward and nerdy.

    And other's will be niether of the above.
    My other comments were spoken in a very similar tone that her's was, except not personally insulting to anyone.

    Your claims that I'm "feeling sorry for myself" are entirely baseless, it's as if you think feelers are allowed to speak whatever comes to their minds without any reasoning applied because reason is not their primary method.

    Your understandings are selfish and ignorant, they refuse to take in the varying methods of determining ideas that others have and instead force your own ideas as fact in a vagrant display of hypocrisy.

    What is the expected reaction to a post claiming that all ENTJs under the age of 30 are immature and not worth anyone's time? Defending myself is not the same as feeling sorry for myself.

    The only reason my response to Cze's comment was so short is that I am TRYING to show a little bit of compassion here and instead of attacking everything she said simply showing the baseless double standard she is building.
    wails from the crypt.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Gabe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    My other comments were spoken in a very similar tone that her's was, except not personally insulting to anyone.

    Your claims that I'm "feeling sorry for myself" are entirely baseless, it's as if you think feelers are allowed to speak whatever comes to their minds without any reasoning applied because reason is not their primary method.

    Your understandings are selfish and ignorant, they refuse to take in the varying methods of determining ideas that others have and instead force your own ideas as fact in a vagrant display of hypocrisy.

    What is the expected reaction to a post claiming that all ENTJs under the age of 30 are immature and not worth anyone's time? Defending myself is not the same as feeling sorry for myself.

    The only reason my response to Cze's comment was so short is that I am TRYING to show a little bit of compassion here and instead of attacking everything she said simply showing the baseless double standard she is building.
    O really? 'Cause it sounded a lot like complaining to me. You were complaining about what you think is an unfair double standard. And if you weren't complaining, you would have wrote a REASONED response to Cze Cze. You were complaining.

    Anyway, have you been on this forum for one day, a couple weeks, or what? You just might have noticed that self identified NTs probably account for the majority of posts on this forum, and there are many posts (even repititious topics) with bullshit about feeling and sensing. So then some self-identifying feeling types call them heartless bastards. And then the self-identifying pricks who think that they're NTs agree.
    That's a fairly simplified narrative, but it's essentially true.

    You wanted to comment on the sociology of the forum. I'm saying that some of the NT stereotypes stem from NTs proudly agreeing with them (thier own damn fault).
    And the rest stems from people having rudimentary and misinformed type knowledge (which is nobody's fault).

  6. #46
    Senior Member Gabe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    Everyone can determine their own decisions, but doing so without the support of logic when that support is made readily available to you (as it always is by an ENTJ) is ridiculous and immature.

    An ENTJ who is applying their reasoning on you is trying desperately to get you to make sense so that they can live with themselves and their decision to be with you.

    Why is running over others not acceptable? Others allow themselves to be run over, they make the choice of being susceptible.

    Not arguing with an ENTJ is pretty much exactly what you should do if your goal is to make them control you. If you want to have any control over your position in the relationship then you need to compete for that control, and your competitor is cold reasoning.

    ENTJs are often immature, but we develop in bursts. We aren't actually as set in our ways as most types, only set in the way of determining our ways. If you think we're immature then don't just say "You're immature!" and assume it will trigger self analysis leading to maturity, instead point out our immaturities and make your case against them.

    All ENTJs I know are more concerned with being right and victorious than being "themselves", show us the wasted potential in our actions and we will change them quickly and zealously.

    The path that leads an ENTJ to the emotional maturity you guys like so much (compassion, empathy blah blah) isn't developing a genuine care for the feelings of others but realizing that such a care is the most efficient way of satisfying their personal goals. If I respect someone and see that we have the potential of building something worthwhile together then I can alter my methods... I hope.
    So basically, even though type is supposed to be partially about learning the language of all the cognitive processes, you're insisting that anyone around you adopt the language of extraverted thinking.

    Sheesh.

    Good relationships aren't about control in the first place. I don't compete with my friends. I compete with my enemies. And I wouldn't even bother being friends with someone who's main concern is saving face.

  7. #47
    Branded with Satan murkrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabe View Post
    So basically, even though type is supposed to be partially about learning the language of all the cognitive processes, you're insisting that anyone around you adopt the language of extraverted thinking.

    Sheesh.

    Good relationships aren't about control in the first place. I don't compete with my friends. I compete with my enemies. And I wouldn't even bother being friends with someone who's main concern is saving face.

    The ENTJ should be making their own efforts to understand the NF, but this thread is about NFs dealing with ENTJs, not ENTJs dealing with NFs.
    wails from the crypt.

  8. #48
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    The ENTJ should be making their own efforts to understand the NF, but this thread is about NFs dealing with ENTJs, not ENTJs dealing with NFs.
    meh,

    i don't think there is nothing wrong with speaking your mind...

    but sometimes people have bad intentions speaking their mind.

    i just think u wanted to clear things up.

    btw, what is it like for an entj to deal with an NF?

    that entj girl used to call me a flirt who goes from girl to girl... lol

    but when it comes down to it, i am actually a pretty loyal guy...

    well the entj girl is callin me again... she always does this thing where she calls me, then when i call her back, she's like "I'll call u in a bit" and makes me wait.

    sheesh, the only way I can deal with waiting tho is to keep myself occupied with another girl... lol

    she should just call back immediately so i don't go thru this cycle again...

  9. #49
    Senior Member Algora J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LadyJaye View Post

    Anyone who believes their logic to be so far above everyone else's that they can do no wrong, is simply arrogant.
    This isn't a trait that is very particular to ENTJs.

    First of all, ENTJ males make up 4.5% of the population, whilst ENTJ females make up 1.5% of the population. It is very unlikely that most people here even know an ENTJ in person.

    Because of the ENTJ's dominant Te, that function allows to integrate other people's perspectives and viewpoints before coming across a judgment/ assessment.

    If anything, people with IXF would be more likely to think that their opinion is correct and not be open to others' opinion as opposed to someone who is Te dominant if we are to think about how dominant functions influence thinking style.

  10. #50
    Scream down the boulevard LadyJaye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Algora J View Post
    This isn't a trait that is very particular to ENTJs.

    First of all, ENTJ males make up 4.5% of the population, whilst ENTJ females make up 1.5% of the population. It is very unlikely that most people here even know an ENTJ in person.

    Because of the ENTJ's dominant Te, that function allows to integrate other people's perspectives and viewpoints before coming across a judgment/ assessment.

    If anything, people with IXF would be more likely to think that their opinion is correct and not be open to others' opinion as opposed to someone who is Te dominant if we are to think about how dominant functions influence thinking
    style.

    A very well stated opinion. But I have to disagree, I'm afraid. While I will give you that arrogant assumption of the absolute rightness in one's opinion is something that any type can fall prey to, I think perhaps the overarching and constant debate about one's logic and reason being more sound than anyone else's is a Thinker pitfall. I know several ENTJ's in real life, and they all fall into the same rut if they don't stop themselves from immediately ruling other people's feelings and perspectives as invalid. My best friend ( a female) regularly checks with me to be sure she's not automatically invalidating people just because she feels impatient with them.



    Your claims that I'm "feeling sorry for myself" are entirely baseless, it's as if you think feelers are allowed to speak whatever comes to their minds without any reasoning applied because reason is not their primary method.
    Reasoning is not just for Thinkers - reasoning is not a "type" skill. If one can use the inductive and deductive methods of thinking, then one is reasoning. Everyone is capable of doing that. Not just NT's.

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