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Thread: Ask an INFP

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by chubber View Post
    How traditional can INFPs get?

    How important is family structure to INFPs?
    I don't see myself as very traditional, however I especially appreciate traditions connected with holidays, i think it is very nice when things like pumpkin decorations, or christam trees, or carols have been held over the centuries and connect many different people from many different parts of the world and create that special "magic" of a certain holiday. But I think this has to do a lot with me being very sentimental, almost childlike about the past and traditions.

    I personally like a familiar comfort and a comfort of a home, but i just see a family as that warm fuzzy feeling around people i know well and have special feelings for them, but some kind of family hierarchy, or structure do not fit into my idea of family, so I do not even know how to answer this... what family structure? like mom and dad? yeah sure kids...be nice at your momma... i do not really see a point in anything else
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  2. #22
    failed poetry slam career chubber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inis Mona View Post
    yeah sure kids...be nice at your momma...
    Are you saying that kids are a possibility for you?

    I'm asking structure, which implies, tradinational family. Depending on how they were raised or did INFPs build their own idea, was it built on top of something that they inherited? How much does background influence them?
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  3. #23
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsomething View Post
    Hi!

    Help me understand youuu! Do you guys agree or disagree with this statement? If you agree, would you change something or you think it's pretty spot on?

    I feel generally good about all people, but am afraid they could let me down. I don't necessarily like people more as I get closer to them, I just trust them better and feel more secure with them, and/or from very far away. I usually don't even know I dislike people until they've let me down or done something that hurt/offended me. It catches me by surprise a lot of the time. I'll have thought, or wanted to believe that they were better than that.
    I don't really associate with that at all. I am annoyed by stupid things people do, but I am fond of humanity and invariably I like people on an individual basis. There is a middle range of have-heard-of-you-but-not-connected-with-you where I tend to dislike people the most, but I don't think I've ever connected with anyone and not felt at least some tinge of affinity towards them. So I tend to like people more the closer I get to them. I don't really have expectations for most people besides being decent, respectful humans, so they don't really let me down. I just hope they'll live in healthy and happy ways and I try to help them get there if they're not there already. I do have expectations for people I have close relationships with and I can be hurt/offended by people close to me, and that is very painful at times, but I always want to patch the wounds and reconnect. We all make mistakes and I like to work towards positive relationships. There have been just a handful of times when I have basically cut someone out of my life because I felt our personality matchup was so bad that it was basically irredeemable, but I still wish them happy and healthy lives, just far away from me!

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by chubber View Post
    Are you saying that kids are a possibility for you?

    I'm asking structure, which implies, tradinational family. Depending on how they were raised or did INFPs build their own idea, was it built on top of something that they inherited? How much does background influence them?
    no... i was just speaking generally, advising kids to be nice at their parents considering this as the only family "hierarchy" i find important... kids respecting their parents...
    I grew up only with my mother, she's been a single mother for all of her life, so this might had caused my disinterested in marriage, or traditional family. I think when you're in love with someone you do not need a paper to prove it, unless you're religious there's no need for a wedding in my opinion. I am not religious so my idea of family is a couple living together without a need of a marriage and maybe 1 kid.

  5. #25
    Member unsomething's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    I don't really associate with that at all. I am annoyed by stupid things people do, but I am fond of humanity and invariably I like people on an individual basis. There is a middle range of have-heard-of-you-but-not-connected-with-you where I tend to dislike people the most, but I don't think I've ever connected with anyone and not felt at least some tinge of affinity towards them. So I tend to like people more the closer I get to them. I don't really have expectations for most people besides being decent, respectful humans, so they don't really let me down. I just hope they'll live in healthy and happy ways and I try to help them get there if they're not there already. I do have expectations for people I have close relationships with and I can be hurt/offended by people close to me, and that is very painful at times, but I always want to patch the wounds and reconnect. We all make mistakes and I like to work towards positive relationships. There have been just a handful of times when I have basically cut someone out of my life because I felt our personality matchup was so bad that it was basically irredeemable, but I still wish them happy and healthy lives, just far away from me!
    Thanks! Your answers are really helping me understand. I *think* I was writing off INFPs and ENFPs as being way more similar than they really are. I have definitely noticed that INFPs can feel almost like strangers for quite a while until they surprise me by suddenly feeling very close. And we can have these ruptures and misunderstandings but always come back stronger. But it seems like it takes a while for them to stop thinking I'm out to get them or will betray them (which I feel like is invariably what causes the rupture-gah.) If so, what would you think if someone just legit and genuinely said they truly care about you and would never want to betray/hurt you? Weirded out, like you wouldn't get it? It's just something that time has to prove, yah?

  6. #26
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsomething View Post
    Thanks! Your answers are really helping me understand. I *think* I was writing off INFPs and ENFPs as being way more similar than they really are. I have definitely noticed that INFPs can feel almost like strangers for quite a while until they surprise me by suddenly feeling very close. And we can have these ruptures and misunderstandings but always come back stronger. But it seems like it takes a while for them to stop thinking I'm out to get them or will betray them (which I feel like is invariably what causes the rupture-gah.) If so, what would you think if someone just legit and genuinely said they truly care about you and would never want to betray/hurt you? Weirded out, like you wouldn't get it? It's just something that time has to prove, yah?
    (Well, first a disclaimer: I might not be the best example of INFP versus ENFP. I am fairly ambiverted - INFPs are more commonly e4 and with a lower ranking for the Social variant - and while INFP was my first identification and I have returned to it, I also identified as ENFP for a while in between.)

    I'm glad if my answers are helpful, though.

    Anyway, I suspect just out of general experience that most INFx tend to go quickly from distant to close. I don't know exactly why... maybe something to do with instinct variant correlation... or maybe something to do with being reserved plus idealistic NF having a tendency to identify resonance in others and opening accordingly. I do agree with that pattern for INFPs oscillating between far and close.

    Regarding distance and rupture, I actually do think most people do care about me, or at the very least do not wish me harm. I don't think I've ever felt like anyone is intentionally out to get me. I would certainly believe someone who said they truly care about me and would never want to hurt me, and I would appreciate that sentiment very much. But, at the same time, I wouldn't just open myself up to them because they said that. If anything, it might put me a little on guard, because I think that we all unintentionally hurt others, and someone encouraging me to open up quickly again after being hurt would make me feel especially vulnerable.

    Actually... I am surprised that you seem to feel discomfort that they seem distant after being hurt - isn't that a rather natural response, to avoid what hurt you, and to be wary of whether it will hurt you again? At least personally, when I have felt hurt by others, it has often been because they treated me in a way that communicated a devaluation of me or the things important to me. As far as I understand it, I think they just decided other things were more important... which is fine in their personal sphere, but not okay if we're in a close relationship, because it means they're going to be willing to sacrifice my wellbeing for their preferences. So I won't get close with them again until it's established that they understand how they hurt me and until I trust them not to treat me like that again. Just telling me that they care doesn't demonstrate to me that they understand how and why they hurt me, though. A deep breakdown of what happened, what we both felt, and how we can prevent it in the future would go much farther with me - that, or time, yes. If they can show over time that they won't hurt me like that again, that can encourage me to get close again, too.

    Does that answer your questions adequately?

    PS I love love love your avatar!

  7. #27
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chubber View Post
    How traditional can INFPs get?

    How important is family structure to INFPs?
    Without reading the other responses on this yet (on purpose)...

    I will say that I don't do or value things according to whether or not they are traditional (or a "norm"), so that some of how I am may be traditional and some of it may not be. There are things I may be traditional about because I simply haven't given thought to another way, perhaps finding it trivial or not having it register as problematic. I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel....

    So I think I am more "normal" than anything, never caring to be a rebel without a cause, because I'm not really attention-seeking and I admit to a large amount of indifference at times. I will assert that the Fi type likely doesn't break with tradition in open defiance unless there is a violation in it of something they recognize as very significant to the human experience. Otherwise, we may be more likely to put personal flair on things over doing an overhaul to the very structures of society. My experimentation is heavily edited by my sense of morality and human nature, which are concepts I've mulled over and refined since, oh, birth. I easily recognize whether something will lead to a violation or fulfillment of these, without actually doing it. Often I choose communication in an artistic form over embodying it in a lifestyle. I think I analyze and identify problems in tradition more than I act against it, so that I'm more likely to rant about something in theory than adopt a non-traditional mode in life.

    The structure of family is not terribly important to me as far as roles go (although I recognize the logic in having parents as authorities over children, etc), but family members as individuals are important to me if I have genuine relationships with them. I wouldn't have an issue with not having a relationship with someone related to me if we did not have a genuine rapport. I do have gratefulness and loyalty to those who have cared for me and my needs when growing up and into adulthood, so this bridges the gaps in rapport with some. There are family members I have such loyalty to whom I don't imagine I'd care to be friends with if we were not related, and it's because of the history of unconditional love offered. I don't think this is a very traditional view of family dynamic, which seems to be more about roles, not rapport; however, it doesn't reject the traditional family structure either.

    I've never desired a very traditional family life for myself. I don't want to have children, be a SAHM, live in the 'burbs, etc.
    I do believe in marriage and am religious, both for spiritual reasons. I don't see the husband-wife dynamic as being the provider/protector-nurturer/homemaker dynamic that tradition seems to dictate. I think that those are more social roles than intimate roles, and marriage to me is about intimacy, not social function. I should say that's how I approach it, not that it doesn't have a social function. The social function to me is more about raising healthy, functional adults, and I think that the biological mother + father is most ideal for this, with certain conditions of course. When people choose less than ideal options which affect the well-being of others significantly and for selfish reasons, aka no other reason than their personal preference, then it may become a moral issue to me.

    So I guess you could say I sometimes find meaning in tradition that may or may not be connected to its origins or the meaning usually given it, and if I find no meaning at all, then it's a matter of whether it's actually offensive, easily ignored, etc.

    I don't care much about traditions as far as celebrations or institutions go. I can enjoy the aesthetics or social aspects of some of these things, but it doesn't have much meaning to me in itself (could be replaced with something else), and I'm not attached to repetition. I don't feel sentimental about something just because it's been around awhile. I need reasons to do things a certain way; repetition in itself doesn't give it meaning or reason. I admit that I am more novelty-driven and will find novelty in and of itself meaningful, in that I will see it as giving me more life experience to draw from.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe
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  8. #28
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsomething View Post
    Hi!

    Help me understand youuu! Do you guys agree or disagree with this statement? If you agree, would you change something or you think it's pretty spot on?

    I feel generally good about all people, but am afraid they could let me down. I don't necessarily like people more as I get closer to them, I just trust them better and feel more secure with them. I usually don't even know I dislike people until they've let me down or done something that hurt/offended me. It catches me by surprise a lot of the time. I'll have thought, or wanted to believe that they were better than that.
    No. None of it rings true, except a few vague spots which I'd heavily edit and clarify. I'm not a security-oriented person. I don't fear being "let down". My brain is somewhere else totally. I'm slightly misanthropic at times too, so I wouldn't say I "feel good about all people" in a personal way. However, I care about humankind.

    As a child, I had a repulsion to new people, disliking them almost immediately, but it was an annoyance at social expectations to adjust my state to others; as an adult, I experience it more as indifference. I push past that as I rationally know I should be polite, and sometimes I do desire to expand my social circle. I do like people more as I get closer to them; my affection certainly grows, as it generally starts with polite indifference.

    I generally always know how I feel about everything and am not caught by surprise with my own feelings. If I don't have a clear cut feeling, then I have a great indifference, so that I wouldn't care enough to be hurt/let down. I am not above being duped or shocked by someone else (those who claim they read others well are prime for duping), and I do prefer to give the benefit of the doubt, but personal taste (ie. "liking") is not the same to me as a moral evaluation of their character. Because of this, I am not usually caught by surprise that much if someone transgresses, but I also don't worry about it happening. In friendships/relationships, most hurt/betrayal was not a sudden shock so much as a slower process where my perceptions of them gradually changed as things became clearer.

    Because I am pretty clear on how I feel, my concerns tends to focus on how others are seeing me. My assumptions are heavily negative, thinking people dislike me, find me boring, etc. My problem is being interpreted poorly and judged negatively for it, and then I become paranoid about avoiding those misconceptions so that I become inhibited/unsure/awkward - and then I am judged negatively for it.

    It's partially because I am read so poorly so often that I extend benefit of the doubt to others. I don't tend towards final judgments unless someone really, really, really crosses a boundary, so instead I sort of have an impression of someone which is not static, and it adjusts over time, getting clearer and more detailed the more I am exposed to them. I think I deal with people in Ne terms (as evolving patterns with potential) over Fi valuations, as Fi is more about creating/refining value-concepts than applying judgment. Few people are counted as real friends to me, because they have to attain a level of significance to me as well as meeting certain ideals, and if they do that, then I am definitely clear cut on liking them.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe
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  9. #29
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsomething View Post
    Hi!

    Help me understand youuu! Do you guys agree or disagree with this statement? If you agree, would you change something or you think it's pretty spot on?

    I feel generally good about all people, but am afraid they could let me down. I don't necessarily like people more as I get closer to them, I just trust them better and feel more secure with them. I usually don't even know I dislike people until they've let me down or done something that hurt/offended me. It catches me by surprise a lot of the time. I'll have thought, or wanted to believe that they were better than that.
    That doesn't resonate with me at all, really. Certainly I have standards for myself and others and most of the time, I'm noting how I and others fall short of this internal yardstick I carry. However, even though this aspect of noting how things do or do not live up to my internal ideal exists, I also have a template of "human" inside of me that continually releases the ideal to the real and the result is a high degree of acceptance to the reality of what being human means. So, the ideal is more aspirational and less judgmental.

    On the outside, my tolerance of other people is very high yet I will still always perceive the difference between the ideal and reality (eta: sometimes this can be perceived as acceptance of bad behaviour which can cause problems for me). I seldom project my version of ideal onto others, as I feel this is an internal measure one must find within oneself to live to one's own (hopefully high) standard. My preference is to try to "walk my own talk" and maybe even be inspirational in some ways for that. (eta2: reality is way more complex than this para and I'm not including a lot of nuance here but hopefully the gist of things is understandable).

    I cannot think of a time where I've felt afraid someone could "let me down". It's more a matter of acknowledging that we are all human and being able to hold open forgiveness within me at all times. Because everybody is going to let down somebody, eventually.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching
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  10. #30
    Senior Member oneandonly's Avatar
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    Do you really need another person to take care of your affairs? or is there any way you can be independent as opposed to codependent?

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