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  1. #31
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    @OrangeAppled and anyone else interested.

    I've been trying to think of a way to explain this issue more analytically than speaking from frustration.

    When anyone describes their experience with an MBTI type that is negative, including multiple experiences with a particular type, that information is not verifiable or falsifiable by anyone else. It is your experience and perception and should be accepted as such. My experience and perception with the same type in this instance is different, so who is right? I have zero desire to invalidate anyone's experience, especially if it is painful and unpleasant.

    Where the line is crossed is when personal experience/perception is universalized. Your experience/perception and mine are both infinitesimally small in the context of the whole of reality. Whatever an INFJ is as an entire category, neither of us knows. Each person should be free to share their experiences with a type, but stop there and not impose those experiences onto new unknown people. Edit: Also in your post that triggered my reaction you appear to be actively trying to get people to think badly about INFJs in general, which is a form of trolling. Sharing experiences is one thing, but this active attempt to tear down an entire type is not right, rational, or reasonable in the least. /Edit

    As far as the witch-hunt threads you mentioned at the INFJ forum, that sounds terrible, and I abhor those threads, although I do think it is important to call people out when they cross the line, but it should not be done by ganging up on them. Leave it between two people of comparable power. The power imbalance created by witch-hunt threads is really horrible. I didn't see those when I was on the INFJ forum, but I would go after anyone who started one there. Those were common at the INTP site, and I took on Hustler directly a few times for it and got slapped down pretty hard. Not every INFJ wants to do witch-hunts. I will take you at your word that it happens, but please don't universalize it or any other behaviors. Leave those data points exactly as they are in reality and be open to obtain new data points that could contrast with the old ones instead of using confirmation bias to continually reinforce previous assumptions. That goes for all of us that think with MBTI.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  2. #32
    Warflower Nijntje's Avatar
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    I'm really not sure why an infp would want to be an infj, it would mean we have dirty, dirty Fe.

    Yuck.




    (edit - i haven't read this thread)

    Terrible things happen to good people every day.
    Consequentially, I am not one of the good people.
    I am one of the terrible things.
    .



    Conclusion: Dinosaurs


  3. #33
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    The cognitive functions are a shit show when it comes to introverts. This is largely on part due to incompetence of MBTI itself.

    ENFJ's and INFJ's are very similar in behavior, except INFJ's are functional percievers and ENFJ's are functional Judgers. So unfortunately you have a lot of INFP's who should be INFJ's, and likewise, you have a lot of INFJ's who should be INFP's, as Fi Ne makes you a functional judging dominant personality, and INFP's have much more functional similarity to ENFP's for this reason.

    I don't know if I should completely cast aside function theory and just go for the good ole stereotypes again, or if I should ignore the stereotypes and go strictly by the functions, because the stereotypes and the function definitions are not consistent.

    All I know is I made a rant video on how annoying it is that on INFJ forums across the internet, the behavior of people is exactly the same as it is with INFP forums across the internet. The same personalities are inhabiting all of these forums.

    As INFJ's have Ni Fe Ti Se, I can very clearly see their use of Fe which makes them very welcoming, accepting and non judgemental people. With Se and Ti they tend to have a more crass and douchebag sense of humor than not.

    INFP's on the other hand do not have Fe on their to do list. They tend to use Fi to judge others based on their internal emotional construct than use Fe to make someone feel welcommed and accepted into the group.

    So when I enter an INFJ forum and the only thing I hear is "omg ESTP... ew, estp r mean!" and then that person proceeds to talk about why they're an INFJ because they eat mint chocolate chip ice cream over vanilla, it makes me want to burn down the forest and rape all the animals... figuratively speaking.

  4. #34
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    I think it's the same thing as how minority groups are allowed to get away with blatant racism against white people, and women are allowed to get away with blatant racism against men. If you are railing at people who society perceives to be in a more fortunate position, you can usually do so without guilt. If your type is constantly getting unfairly smacked, it is normal to develop that kind of mentality. The problem is no one realizes that other types are also constantly under attack and that there is no "the man" to stick up to, so every represented type here develop this 'minority misunderstood type' mentality and the mudslinging starts.

    Stereotypes are terrible. Even 'good' stereotypes are terrible. I'm actually glad no one thinks INFJs are all that great anymore so people can stop expecting me to be a prophet and start treating me like a person.

    Right now my reaction to any type-bashing is that the person needs time to heal from real-life hurt, like when someone just broke up with their boyfriend and declare that all men are evil. It's normal human behavior.

    We just need to spread the love
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  5. #35
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I'm happy with being INFP, I like INFJs but i don't want to be them, that's like a cow wanting to be a duck, it's not possible
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  6. #36
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    I love INFJs. I would love to be more like the INFJs I know. But I wouldn't really say I want to BE an INFJ.

  7. #37
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Hooray it's now fluffy again
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  8. #38
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Can we haz sexxy time naow?

  9. #39
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    We used to have that around here though, years ago. Then the INFPs were the overemotional, sensitive, whiny bunch with no practical skills and INFjs were treasured as altruistic and saint-like.

    These days, much less so.
    I don't remember that time, but have taken two hiatuses from here. You mentioned not seeing the other recent attacks, one of which inspired me to leave for close to a year, so perhaps they are more localized? During the time you describe, it could have been a reaction against the extreme negativity INFJs had experienced at the INTP forum. INFPs were "annoying", but there were death wishes for INFJs and they were explicitly described as "evil". I'd rather be a whiny and overemotional snowflake than a cruel, narcissistic, arrogant Hitler. There is an issue of both quality and quantity of attack. INTJs get some similar attacks of being evil. SJs have it the worst around here, and there are all sorts of dismissals, but I'm wondering if there is some other place online where INFJs are immune to this because I don't see it here. I'd say INFPs are as immune as anyone because the nature of the criticism is lacking substance. I think it is worth standing up for all types that are unreasonably attacked.

    As a side note, it is a well established fact that adoration and contempt are two sides of the same coin. Celebrity and royalty are the extreme example of this. I distance myself from people who are too praising towards me because it is human nature to desire to be first (especially in modern culture), so if someone sets you above them, it typically results in jealousy and contempt. This is true whether or not the praising is objective in the least. I'm not going to speak for other INFJs, but I find both extremes nauseating and just prefer to be ignored and share ideas rather than tearing down or building up social power.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  10. #40
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    What INFP (and other Fi users) calls passive aggressive is what INFJ (and perhaps other Fe users) call civil conversation; in other words, you get the message across without actually calling the person a name. You leave your statement open enough that the person you're thinking of has a chance to recognize what you're talking about and address it on his own. This saves face for both people, and leaves open the chance that the conversation can take a better turn. We're subtle; we do things indirectly; we work behind the scenes. If you want to label that "passive aggressive," fine, but to me, that's just Fi talking, which doesn't get us. It's fine if you don't get us, but the name calling gets a little oppressive...

    And it's nice to be among people that actually read walls of text and don't respond with tl;dr to anything over a sentence or two. We can be funny. I just think when we're with our own kind, we like to hunker down, because nobody else finds it as interesting as we do.

    Anyway, yeah -- to the OP -- not around here, they don't.

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