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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    The reason why it seems so clear-cut to me is because I always know how I feel that far into a relationship. Either it clicks or it doesn't, and if I were to say that I don't feel what I should feel in a relationship, there's no connection, I would mean EXACTLY THAT. To me that means there isn't anything real or intimate going on, that it's been fun, you're a nice guy, but we're not "in love" though I may like you or care about you.

    As a person who has almost compulsively sought intimacy in her life, even if I am not an ENFP (and this should probably clear up people thinking that I am, that I am not as sympathetic as the ENFP females in this thread seem to be, so likely not) ...if I said those words, it would amount to "I am not feeling it. We have not established the bond we should have, physically mentally or emotionally."

    To me it seems pretty simple, and in the ENFP-INTJ thread, @Orobas said the other day something about an ENFP girl stringing along a guy she really had no interest in, and how she thought he was a tortured INTJ, and the ENFP had a bf, but she kept "leaving the door open" for "possibilities."

    That's a bunch of fucking shit and it hurts people, okay? So she shouldn't be kissing him after she made a declaration like that. I disagree with @OrangeAppled that she's "over empathizing." If she really had empathy, she'd turn him loose instead of being so selfish about being perceived as "nice" or whatever the fuck, or leaving the door open just in case she can't find a solid replacement soon enough.

    That is honestly the way I view the situation. You know guys, ENFPs have flaws just like every other type, they aren't perfect people, and stringing people along opportunistically under a facade of kindness could potentially be one of them.

    It's selfish. It's not kind. Kind is being forthright and honest, and letting him go. This is the kind of thing people do when they have trepidation about losing their cash cow or their regular date, what someone might do when afraid of being alone, not because they actually aren't sure they love the person.

    Maybe I'm more sure of my feelings than an ENFP. Who knows. Maybe that points to Fi dom over Fi aux for me.
    She's not stringing him along, nor does it even sound like she is unsure about her decision once safely removed from his pleading. There's a massive difference between being pulled back in by someone because of misused empathy ("I see how they feel & hate making them feel that way" & "Maybe there is a possibility after all?" ---> agree to keep trying in hopes her feeling may change, then kissing someone she is technically still dating) than deliberately keeping someone around until you find someone else. There are entirely different motives & feelings involved. The OP wants to know what could be going on in her head, and I think "stringing along" is not it. I think it's feeling bad about hurting someone & putting aside her feelings so she maybe doesn't have to hurt him.

    We don't know the full context for the kissing also; maybe HE is using this to confuse her enough to get her to agree to keep seeing him? Why is SHE the manipulative one here?

    I agree she needs to stick to her feelings for both their own good. However she has tried to turn him loose. She essentially broke up with him in the email. How is it fair or nice or kind of him to keep asking her to give it another chance? He's not respecting her feelings or decision either.

    I DO agree it's a flaw to allow herself to be pulled by someone else's feelings, especially when she knows in the long-run it won't work out.
    I also DO believe that an ENFP is probably less clear cut on feelings, at least initially, and that's why it's easy for someone else to keep opening a door she is trying to shut. I DO also see N-dom (especially N-dom NFs) as being rather fickle, because value seems led by potential rather than the other way around.

    But what's going on in another thread with another person doesn't seem really relevant to me here.

    Here, I just see two people who've dated & one who isn't feeling it anymore & keeps trying to end it while the other hangs on. It sucks & it hurts to be the rejected one, but it doesn't mean the other person really wronged them.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    She's not stringing him along, nor does it even sound like she is unsure about her decision once safely removed from his pleading. There's a massive difference between being pulled back in by someone because of misused empathy ("I see how they feel & hate making them feel that way" & "Maybe there is a possibility after all?" ---> agree to keep trying in hopes her feeling may change, then kissing someone she is technically still dating) than deliberately keeping someone around until you find someone else. There are entirely different motives & feelings involved. The OP wants to know what could be going on in her head, and I think "stringing along" is not it. I think it's feeling bad about hurting someone & putting aside her feelings so she maybe doesn't have to hurt him.

    We don't know the full context for the kissing also; maybe HE is using this to confuse her enough to get her to agree to keep seeing him? Why is SHE the manipulative one here?

    I agree she needs to stick to her feelings for both their own good. However she has tried to turn him loose. She essentially broke up with him in the email. How is it fair or nice or kind of him to keep asking her to give it another chance? He's not respecting her feelings or decision either.

    I DO agree it's a flaw to allow herself to be pulled by someone else's feelings, especially when she knows in the long-run it won't work out.
    I also DO believe that an ENFP is probably less clear cut on feelings, at least initially, and that's why it's easy for someone else to keep opening a door she is trying to shut. I DO also see N-dom (especially N-dom NFs) as being rather fickle, because value seems led by potential rather than the other way around.

    But what's going on in another thread with another person doesn't seem really relevant to me here.

    Here, I just see two people who've dated & one who isn't feeling it anymore & keeps trying to end it while the other hangs on. It sucks & it hurts to be the rejected one, but it doesn't mean the other person really wronged them.
    That's just the way I see it, and I was explaining my attitude, if some people saw it as "harsh" or unwarranted, and why I see it that way. You could be right, she could be trying to give a chance because she does have some kind of feelings for him.

    I guess in romantic relationships things are messy, because you bring up a good point about him not letting her go, but I understand his perspective, that he wants to try to make it work if they were just getting along great ten days ago and they had told each other they loved each other.

    So I don't think he's being unethical by asking her to think about it more, to see him and see if she feels different after seeing him in person; however, since they have seen each other in person, I guess he should try to let her go if her decision is final, and stop hanging on, because he has a responsibility ethically also to respect her decision.

    Thanks for bringing that up. I didn't even think about that.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duck_of_Death View Post
    And last I checked, your trademark "charismatic", manipulative hogwash was supposed to work.
    It isn't. So what happened? Huh? What else do you have to fall back on?

    Exactly. That's what I thought.

    I patiently await your redundant wall-of-text response...

    I rarely turn to higher powers, but thank the lord I was made ISTP 9 and not ISTP 6.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanmartin12345 View Post
    I have been dating this ENFP girl for about 6 months. I am an ESTP. She's pretty typical ENFP - easily distracted, has a hard time following through on things she's into because there are too many possiblities, her head is very much in the clouds and not necessarily paying attention to things like rules, details, etc. She is extremely smart though, charming & charismatic, funny, and super social. Like at a bar she'll run around and talk to everyone. She gets easily distracted by sparkly things.

    We got together about 6 months ago in September and then in November she asked me to be her boyfriend. We are both 24. She tends to be idealistic in relationships - like on Valentine's Day when I got her a gift, she told me how much she loved it and how I'm totally the best. She'd often say things like that. She's a very sensitive person as well but is pretty openly sexually liberated (the relationship moved pretty fast in that sense when we first met). We told each other I love you about a week before Valentine's Day. Since then we would say it to each other unprompted. We always did fun stuff together and had a great time. Before I left town for 10 days, nothing seemed wrong.

    However, when I was out of town out of the blue she sent me an email telling me that she wanted to end it because she's just not feeling the emotions she needs to feel in a relationship. I was surprised because the week before when I was still gone, she had called me out of the blue and told me "I love you, I miss you, and I'll see you when you are back". But then I got that email one week later. She told me that I'm an awesome, fun person to be around (she has never been bored with me) but that she doesn't feel the deep connection she wants to. Like that we aren't creating a world together, we don't have the kind of love that can transcend her problems, and she doesn't feel the same way about me when I am with her as when I am not.

    She also mentioned that she doesn't feel like we spend enough time together (which I told her I am more than happy to do), that she feels like her simple dreams of being a teacher are not compatible with my dreams of doing amazing things and that she isn't sure if the reasons I like her are good enough - she keeps saying I could like anyone for those reasons. She also says that she feels self conscious around me. I told her that I'd love to spend more time with her but breaking up seems to be the wrong way to do that and that she can tell me anything so she shouldn't feel self conscious around me. She has also told me that she's not even sure if she should be in a relationship right now because her life is a little up in the air in August and so she's not sure if it's the best thing for her right now. Also, she has really disliked her job ever since I've met her. Finally she's taking steps towards getting a new one and leave soon. I feel like part of her feels that she may need time to work on herself and get through this before being in a relationship.

    I've met with her twice since she sent that email and every time at the end of the conversation we kiss and she says she's going to think about continuing it. I also randomly bumped into her a few days ago and we had a great 30 minute conversation and touched but it doens't really feel resolved. Do any other ENFP's have any idea what is going on/what she is feeling? Or why she could change so quickly? Or if it is worth it to try to keep it alive? She seems a bit confused to me. Thank you.
    Please allow me to simplify and help you find peace. :) Romance is about being with the right person at the right time. If you’re with the right person at the wrong time, or the wrong person at the right time, things won’t work out.

    I believe love begets love. And that being a person of *honor*, *courage* and *strength* is much more rewarding and admirable than being a person of anxiety, fear and anger.

    Which means:

    Not assuming the worst in her.
    Not doing anything to intentionally hurt her, no matter what.
    Not being defeated by fear or anger and exhibiting fight or flight behavior.

    True love is loving someone enough to see them happy; even if that requires letting them go, but do not do so until you have communicated with her and come to that understanding.

    Here's what I propose:
    Get to the root of her feelings. Arrange a one-on-one in a quiet place and talk, where you are leading the conversation.

    Start out with something like this...
    "I'm frankly confused about what is going on between us. Tell me the truth, am I loving and responding in the way you need me to right now?"

    If she rambles on and you get the impression she's not committed or is uncertain about what to do, then say...
    "It sounds like you are considering ending our relationship. Is that what you really mean?"

    If she says "no" and she shares stuff that you did that hurt her, then take responsibility for those things and say...
    "I feel awful about that. Please don't give up on me."

    She may say "no," and that she's confused and needs some time to sort things out. It's up to you whether you want to do that, but make sure you clearly define the terms; such as, if you would be seeing other people during that time. And frankly, I think you should.

    If she says "yes," then don't fight it, but rather, ask her one more time...
    "Is that what you really want?"

    If she says "yes," then simply say...
    "Okay. I love you and I want you to be happy." AND lay down the ground rules. You can't hang out. You can't kissy-huggy. Do that for *you*, so you can move on. You have so many other options. See paragraph 1.

    NOTE: If at any point she is disrespectful to you, interrupt her and calmly-firmly say...
    "Rather than disrespecting me, would you tell me what you want in a kinder way?"

  5. #45
    Paranoid Android Video's Avatar
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    I don't see a monster. I just see a woman saying she isn't ready because, in fact, she actually isn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Please allow me to simplify and help you find peace. Romance is about being with the right person at the right time. If you’re with the right person at the wrong time, or the wrong person at the right time, things won’t work out.
    Thank you. *fist bump*

  6. #46
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    Dear OP @deanmartin12345 How much shit are you willing to put up with? I think you're gonna see a cycle. She's gonna be unsure of your relationship, and that's just going to keep coming up. If you're OK with that, then go for it. If you think that's more than you want to (or can) deal with, then tell her that it'd be best if you parted ways. Don't be mean to her. That'll just give you one more thing to feel guilty about afterwards.

  7. #47
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    Nice post, @Nerd Girl.

    I think it's ridiculous the amount of anger and disdain being brought to this thread. This post was directed at ENFPs so that we could give insight into our particular line of thinking; the ENFPs here have said we don't feel this is intentionally malicious. Spewing a bunch of negativity at this girl isn't good for anyone.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duck_of_Death View Post
    Good Christ...are you people really this pathetic?
    All I'm saying is I think it's unfair to condemn her up front. She sounds young and like she moved too fast. Clearly the way she communicated the feeling wasn't the best, but that doesn't make her badly intentioned. Some of us don't have the gift of such clear-cut thinking and decision making. We struggle to know when things need to end and when there's still hope.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    I think it's ridiculous the amount of anger and disdain being brought to this thread. This post was directed at ENFPs so that we could give insight into our particular line of thinking; the ENFPs here have said we don't feel this is intentionally malicious.
    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    All I'm saying is I think it's unfair to condemn her up front. She sounds young and like she moved too fast. Clearly the way she communicated the feeling wasn't the best, but that doesn't make her badly intentioned. Some of us don't have the gift of such clear-cut thinking and decision making. We struggle to know when things need to end and when there's still hope.
    You leave collateral damage in your wake and then do everything in your power to skeeze your way out of it.
    What the hell do you expect? I mean, honestly?

    You are a pitiable, obnoxious and amoral breed and should be taken with a grain of salt.
    Christ's sake--You're not willing to be held accountable for your actions even when they're harmful.

    You creatures are truly unbelievable.

  10. #50
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    @Duck_of_Death - We barely know the specifics of the situation yet you've crowned yourself judge, jury, and executioner of all ENFPs!

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