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  1. #11
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    I guess this would scare me silly. I imagine a woman with a iron husband shaped box to push me in. (This happened to me already.)

  2. #12
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Well, the idea of one's highest aspiration being defined by someone else seems sad.

    But I can relate on the level that I deeply desire to be in a loving, formally-committed forever-relationship someday.

    What it really makes me think of is Sailor Moon, because it was Serena/Usagi's stated dream to be a wife, and of course it turns out that she's also the future monarch of a huge realm, the leader of a band of soldiers, and the reincarnated savior of the universe.

    Not bad.

    I suspect most people, like her, will end up self-actualizing to the extent that they are called to do so. If wife doesn't cut it, they'll keep searching.

  3. #13
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    I don't relate to it either, but it's not sad to me. It's actually surprising someone would openly say it though.

    I don't even think it's a social expectation for women anymore (as evidenced by most people's reactions to it). People who want families instead of careers or fame or achievement are often seen as sad now, as if they're wasting themselves. I think that's kind of sad too. It's like anything in the intimate realm is not regarded as satisfying or fulfilling; it must be public achievement as measured by others instead of your own internal experience.

    But most people don't think it's sad if you were to say, "I'd like to be a doctor so I can help people in pain" or something like that. But why is it pathetic to nurture, help, care for, etc, in the wife role? Because it's unpaid, without prestige?

    Or it's generally not seen as sad to say, "It's my dream to find a lasting, deep love with someone." But having a dream where you're in a loving, committed relationship as a "wife" is sad?

    I imagine someone who says this has possibly examined their needs & aptitudes & decided "wife" is a good fit for them. I think nowadays, it may even take some courage to say that, because ideals have shifted so much in a different direction.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  4. #14
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I think nowadays, it may even take some courage to say that, because ideals have shifted so much in a different direction.
    That is certainly the message I got from my conservative church as a teenager.

  5. #15
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    It depends on the context.
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    So you can let go when you give it

  6. #16
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    That statement is so vague, how could it disturb me?
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  7. #17
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    That is certainly the message I got from my conservative church as a teenager.
    That ideals have shifted? I think they have, even if there are some still promoting old fashioned ways, and people will be judged as old fashioned in a pathetic way by everyone else. Anytime you oppose the majority philosophy & leave yourself open to their criticism, whether by trailblazing or sticking to what they call outdated, there's some courage involved. That doesn't always make it noble courage.

    Personally, I'm not saying all old ideals were better either (because they aren't my ideals). I just see a real false dichotomy created between the modern & old ideals, as if it's one or the other & they always oppose each other. It also makes it seem as if a certain path means one thing & one thing only. The assumption that someone would come from a conservative church to have such a "dream" is exactly what I mean... Because I don't think someone saying their dream to be a wife means "1950s housewife" or giving up their own identity & needs/wants. Perhaps someone saying this has a different idea of "wife" (which is kind of what I was getting at in my comparison to being a doctor or finding love, etc).

    To me, what takes courage is saying, "I know what suits me, regardless of these popular, external ideals of the moment". So that's why I wouldn't think it's sad. Do I fully get their dream? No. I personally see it as a bit naive, but I see a lot of "dreams" that way now, especially when they involve roles to reach personal fulfillment (including most careers).
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  8. #18
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    It depends on the assumptions associated with that statement. I can feel a few reactions. There are many traditions associated with marriage that diminish a woman's identity as a full human being. These include becoming "Mrs. John Johnson", being given away from father to husband at the wedding ceremony as property transfer, and even wearing the white dress and veil has numerous implications. The institution of marriage has a history of being a way to define property and inheritance and in many ways requires an unequal power balance between the genders in order to function. The concept of becoming a "wife" is expressing a desire to fit into a socially defined role that has grown out of all of the above.

    It is true that becoming a "wife" also has to do with being a loving member of a family community and helping to provide stability for the upbringing of children. In our more modern context people define the role in additional ways, but if it strays too far from the original ideals, it does cause a ruckus in society.

    Does it disturb me personally for a specific individual to make that statement? No, because it is their life and I would just wish their best happiness. Also, their meaning could be much different from how I might think about it. I would be happy for them if that person were able to find their happiness, but I also think it is worth examining the broader social implications in discussion.
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  9. #19
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    Yes, because it sounds like they are more concerned about following the social protocol than in finding the right person.
    This.

    Also, I wonder if she could be happy just being independent and not in a relationship.
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  10. #20
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    But most people don't think it's sad if you were to say, "I'd like to be a doctor so I can help people in pain" or something like that. But why is it pathetic to nurture, help, care for, etc, in the wife role? Because it's unpaid, without prestige?
    The unpaid part is the key. Its almost like if a woman says "I want to be a doctor" its implied to mean "I want to be a doctor... And a wife too if that works out". So when someone says, "I want to be a wife (As a career)" it's sort of like saying "I want to be rich". A one income household with a stay at home wife/mom tends to be something that requires $$$$. Anyone that says "I want to be rich" tends to get a reaction.

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