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  1. #11
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    I'm much better when I see a purpose.

    In those cases.. If I can 'have my say'--either in having a turn to speak, commanding an audience, or leading a group--then I'm pretty good. Everyone gets a say and we get shit done. When there's a fat lot of chaos and no control, I 'know my role' and can adhere to it but am not comfortable with it.

  2. #12
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    I don't function well in groups because I can't feel the rhythm of interaction. I can't participate because I'm not able to feel when to jump into the conversation. Also, there are just too many signals going on, so it is overwhelming.

    I'm also not that skilled at internalizing the social rituals of the norm. I have noticed that most surface communication is based on different memes that are almost like rituals to say. When someone shows pictures of a new baby or graduation, there are certain things that are said. When people go on a date, there are certain phrases that are repeated. People repeat the same phrases every week at their churches, and repost memes on Facebook with rarely stating what they think about it. Strangers talk about the weather, sports, and movies. I can observe these, but can't seem to internalize them very well

    I can doing very well one-on-one, especially when the person is neuro-atypical. Because I can construct from the ground up a sense of how they operate internally. I have a high level of focus with an individual and can internalize their world better than the norm. I can also do this better than a group of signals because it is harder to create a cohesive whole. With people I interact with, I tend to know a great deal more about their internal system of processing thought and emotion than I know about the concrete facts of their life.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  3. #13
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    I'm pretty decent. I'm very good at the one-on-one, but I'm generally shy in groups until I really get to know everyone, or I'm really familiar with the group's mission. I enjoy having others around, but I prefer close relationships, and that really shows. I think that NFs tend to do fairly well because we're typically good at reading people's holistic attitudes, and picking up on minor emotional changes. I was also lucky to have been brought up by an ESFJ mom and an INTP dad, so I'm not totally at sea when it comes to S, Fe or T. I feel fairly well-balanced in that respect - I can get along with almost anyone, though STPs are the most challenging for me! They tend to be very raw and present-oriented, while I am neither.

    And yes, I do think that intuitives probably struggle more with social groups in general, as a result of being a little more detached.

    However, I also think that there are different kinds of social skill and ease. Se doms certainly have a kind of social fluidity, @Abbey's point about present hyperfocus is a good one. They can tend to disregard contextual appropriateness, and create an uncomfortable situation for others. Fe doms also have definite social skill in terms of fostering certain interpersonal environments. I think my ESFJ 2w1 mom is one of the most socially-skilled people I have ever met - she's positive, genuine, practical, and she can walk into a store upset and wanting a return, and walk out with her money, a pile of coupons, and everyone loving her and feeling happy about the social exchange. She's excellent at focusing on the problem itself, allying with people who can help her instead of projecting her upset at people, and trying to find a solution that will make everyone happy. ENTPs also often have a quirky social likeability - a la Tosh.0.

    As an aside, I do enjoy hearing gossip, because I like knowing what's going on in my environments, and I enjoy discussing the significance with my close friends, my boyfriend, and my family. I try to discourage "bad" gossip, in terms of talking negatively about others, but I think sharing information is a natural part of any social environment, and it's better to be part of the loop than out of it - at least if you're in the loop, you can impact the information if you don't like it. I'm also one of the apparent few who enjoy small talk - it can be a pleasant mood-booster to share a positive emotional exchange with another person, and it can be the threshold to deeper communication.

    Quote Originally Posted by fia
    I have noticed that most surface communication is based on different memes that are almost like rituals to say. When someone shows pictures of a new baby or graduation, there are certain things that are said. When people go on a date, there are certain phrases that are repeated. People repeat the same phrases every week at their churches, and repost memes on Facebook with rarely stating what they think about it.
    A Si thing, perhaps? It's true that there are "standard" phrases - I find them useful because they're little prewrapped packages of positive sentiment that are almost universally acceptable. For example, one writes "happy birthday, I hope you're having a wonderful day!" on a friend's Facebook wall to essentially say "we're not close enough that it was important for me to see you on your celebration day, but we are friends, and I wanted to acknowledge your special day, and I hope you have been enjoying it". It's a gesture of goodwill, but it's implicit that you're not close enough that a customized response is necessary. It smooths things out for everyone... makes it easier to have positive, non-awkward exchanges with people on the further levels of social closeness.

  4. #14
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EndlessNameless View Post
    NFs in general are described as people oriented, likeable, and socially skilled. I think it's half true.
    I am an ENFP and I like company of others, I am sociable, but I literaly wouldn't call myself socially skilled. I still think this is a gift of Se people. Mostly ESFPs and ESTPs. Because of their Se, they can easily adabt to community and are well aware of current situation and "what's going" in the moment. I've noticed that intuitive people react on things like that a little bit slower. It's better for Fe people, becauce they can use their empathy and instict to feel what's going on in social situations, but it is also more complicated for Fi, to stay aware of sociaty rules and acceptations. So here is a question for you. How socially skilled do you consider yourself? Don't you think, that intuitives have it harder in social groups, than sensors?
    Most of the NFs I've known have been like that, too. Everybody loves you all, but it's not because you're necessarily "socially aware." Still think you're better off than NTs though.
    You lose.

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  5. #15
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    I'm on and off socially. Many see me as socially adept and skilled at playing that game, but it's more to do with forfeiting or suppressing my natural tiredness when socialising with others as a sort of...conciliatory attempt to get along with a group of people better.

    So far so Fe I suppose. But online it is easier for me to be natural as there I can just shut off when I feel like it and people aren't as bothered.

    Recently offline it has become easier for me to do this as well because the group of people I interact with in my hobby don't take it personally when I don't respond to their every social whim or gesture.

    Essentially it's here and there, but I do find it getting easier bit by bit, so far ive managed to bring myself out of myself and become more natural in most social arena's, which is immensely liberating I find.

    No matter how off-putting or strange people find me. This is in spite of the fact that I am not really an introvert.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by EndlessNameless View Post
    NFs in general are described as people oriented, likeable, and socially skilled. I think it's half true.
    I am an ENFP and I like company of others, I am sociable, but I literaly wouldn't call myself socially skilled. I still think this is a gift of Se people. Mostly ESFPs and ESTPs. Because of their Se, they can easily adabt to community and are well aware of current situation and "what's going" in the moment. I've noticed that intuitive people react on things like that a little bit slower. It's better for Fe people, becauce they can use their empathy and instict to feel what's going on in social situations, but it is also more complicated for Fi, to stay aware of sociaty rules and acceptations. So here is a question for you. How socially skilled do you consider yourself? Don't you think, that intuitives have it harder in social groups, than sensors?

    Intuitors have a natural ability to paddle information back and forth. They've got the definite edge (particularly Ne users) in social settings because of this. ISTJ's probably have it the worst, in ability of assimilation, ENFP's having it the easiest.

  7. #17
    Senior Member pinkgraffiti's Avatar
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    not very but i don't really care. i'd rather focus on the individual, one on one, and i dont' care much about social circumstance, unless i can't escape it and then i just try to be on the side and not be noticed and at least enjoy it for what it is. ENFP here.

  8. #18
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    A friend of mine described me as a diamond in the rough. I think that I need approximately five more years before I've reached the level that I desire, if my evolution continues at this current speed that is.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Habba's Avatar
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    I don't really like being in a group, I think something like 5 is already getting too crowded. On the other hand, I do enjoy (board/card) gaming in a group. Maybe because it is object oriented and somewhat slow-paced.

    I do think that I have skills to analyze and realize people's personalities rather quick, helping me to understand the group dynamics. I usually try to be actively inclusive of all members in the group. I've been told that I'm a good listener. I also think I have somewhat narrow mind when it comes to people with out-of-ordinary lifestyles. I usually am not interested in people's lifestories or backgrounds.

    All in all, I think I have good set of tools, but lack the motivation to be a great in social skills.
    I usud the be very poor before I get to know MBTI and cognitive functions (= learnt how people are drive by varying motives and fears).
    "The present is theirs; the future, for which I have really worked, is mine."
    -Nikola Tesla

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by EndlessNameless View Post
    How socially skilled do you consider yourself?
    I have a hard time when it comes to social interactions. I tend to be off in a corner observing others, but never joining them.

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