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  1. #101
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    So, what do we need to do to help your map along, nightning? Do you want new concepts or explanations?

  2. #102
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seawolf399 View Post
    ENTP/ENFP relation:

    Generating Ideas. Thinking Feeling boundaries are not very thick. So they can relate well, much more efficiently than the ENFP/INTP bonding.

    ENTP/ENFP share common ground on the primacy of Extroverted Intuition whihc is basically a raw idea engine. Both tend to have a very high social consciousness, and both are primarily concerned with finding problems in society and coming up with powerful visions of change.

    The ENTP will use his critical thinking skills to point out what is wrong in society, and offer solutions on how it can be done. ENFP will envision the situation, and recommend the most humane ways to go about it, and how impersonal ideas about how those problems can be solved can be tied to the personal problems and how the human element can be taken care of.

    The ENTP/ENFP bond is the synthesis of imeprsonal vision on how to carry society forward with the personal. Again the theme is laying out a powerful vision of change.


    Now here are some general comments on your chart:

    ENTP: The innovator-Comes up with impersonal ideas on how to solve many of the objectively observable problems in society.

    ENFP: Same notion as the ENTP, although with a personal approach. Mostly concerned with the elevation of social consciousness and making the external world a better place.

    INTJ: An internal visionary. Concerned with impersonal ideas in regards to how the individual can make the world a more accomodating place for himself. Unlike the ENTP, he insists not on changing the external world and seeing how you measure up to it, but by how you can make yourself a more adept person to the point where you could twist the world to your liking. So the INTJ is the same kind of a visionary as an ENTP, although internally focused, yet just as dispassioned and impersonal, and thus more individualistic because of Introversion. And sees the final goal as the state where the world conforms to your principles, and not you working towards social consciousness and making it a better place yourself. This is a salient distinction of the Ne and Ni, introversion/extroversion. A great example of such INTJ prophets would be embodied in the teaching of Friedrich Nietzsche's Zarathustra, and Rand's ethical egoism.

    INFJ:The type that is the most concerned with bringing meaning to one's individual vision. Same notion as the INTJ, though the vision must be lived out personally with no other task than giving the individual meaning to life. Unlike the more theoretical INFP, who just tries to weigh out what is important, the INFJ is concerned with actions that need to be taken in order to find the meaning in life that the INFP longs for.

    INFP: The most theoretical about the human element. Primarily concerned with weighing things out for the sake of finding inner harmony of feelings. And knowing on a cerebral level, what is necessary in order for one to be at peace with oneself, and find meaning in life. Unlike the INFJ, the INFP is much less concerned with acting out on their beliefs. In many respects, the INFJ expounds and seeks cerebral implementation of the vision of the INFP.

    ENFJ:The implementor of the ENFPs vision, the popularizer.

    ENTJ:The implementor of the ENTP's vision.


    INTP: As analogous to thought as the INTP to feelings. The most theoretical about impersonal ideas, yet not strongly concerned about acting out on convictions. As analogously to the INFP-INFJ relationship, the INTJ is oftenly the expounder and the cerebral implementor of the ideas of the INTP.

    So the INTP first propounds a theory. The INTJ gives it more depth and points out the practical implementation and sends it back to the INTP. The INTP tweaks it up and gives the INTJ criticisms, and then they strive for the synthesis of ideas and prepare their theory for presentation to the outer world. Than the ENTP connects it to the world of ideas and passes it down to the ENTJ, who is the primary implementor.

    Same diagram applies to the way NFs handle personal affairs.
    This should be a good start for whatever it may be.

  3. #103
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    So, what do we need to do to help your map along, nightning? Do you want new concepts or explanations?
    Both... mainly to flesh out the existing concept map, corrections on it if there are inconsistencies. I want a confirmation on whether typical relationships (as indicated by the arrows) exist between types both in terms of typology theories and in real life people. Since SW provided some theoretical ideas for me to work with, some comments on typical real life behaviour of various types would be nice.

    Quote Originally Posted by SolitaryWalker View Post
    This should be a good start for whatever it may be.
    Thank you... I'll sit and think about what you wrote. The main purpose here is to find relationships between the approach of life taken by different types. Kind of building a framework relating all the types together. After that, fill in the details pertaining to specific types... then further split up each type to subtypes (if possible), e.g. subcategories of INTPs based on ennergram wings etc... After that resynethesis of all subcategories together into working spectrum of "types"... kind of like circumpolar personality traits. Except conceptually this will be 3D spherical like. Final step, if possible, link that to the Big 5.

    I might have been overly ambitious... lol we'll see how far along this I get to before my attention wanders off on to something else.

  4. #104
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    INTP-Understand the world/Seek the truth
    INTJ-Vision for how to become a superman
    ENTP-Find a vision for how to change the world objectively
    ENFP-Vision to make the world a more humane place
    INFJ-Transform the world into paradise (like INTJ vision only with humanitarian purposes)
    INFP-Seek human perfection
    ENTJ-Become as powerful as possible and implement your vision to bring order to the world
    ENFJ-Implement your vision to make as many people as happy as possible on a larger scale



    Generally Ns are the ones concerned with the big purpose, Sensors tend not to be big picture thinkers.

  5. #105
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    man needs predator, space is a hard sell

  6. #106
    homo-loving sonovagun anii's Avatar
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    empathy
    humane
    emotional-intelligence
    caring
    insightful

  7. #107
    Junior Member Sequestered's Avatar
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    turmoil
    abnormal
    alone
    seeking
    yearning


  8. #108

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    consciousness, reality, existence, truth, freedom

    The rest falls out of them. The post above listing each type was interesting. I'd never thought about it that way before, but as ENFP I'm not Mother Teresa. The goal is humanity. The ultimate goal is that people connect on a higher level and see the things they miss when making the choices that cause the destruction. Deep down I want society to take the next step socially and cross all those barriers and break down all those walls that hold us back every day and we waste most of our lives dealing with. Answer the questions like why do people fight over the same issues constantly when there are obvious solutions. Why so much time is spent in mourning and groaning about things that are easily fixed. Why people get angry at crap and unsettle whole rooms of people. And why whole rooms of people are unsettled by people getting angry at crap. Truth isn't that scary. In a way I've got a feeling most ENFPs just want them to see what we see in a crowded room and how simple complexity can be.

  9. #109
    Senior Member Dwigie's Avatar
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    self-aware
    sensitivity
    "ideal seeking"
    determined
    harmony needing
    Sometimes I feel like I'm "on Mercury"-

  10. #110

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    Constantly seeking tranquility and harmony.

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