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  1. #101
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    My question is how on earth are they similar?
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  2. #102
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Well I see how they can be confused if you have an ENFP who uses their Ne in a down to earth way (I know that sounds like a contradiction) and a ENFJ who isn't the stereotypical Fe harridan.

    I have about 4 ENFPs at my job ranging from late 20s to late 50s and the older ones have been mellowed by age so that they're not so rampant and all over the place. If you're strictly applying this to youngish versions of a type then Ne and Fe is more pronounced and easier to distinguish and you would think how could they be confused.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
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    Social Penetration Theory 3

  3. #103
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Well I see how they can be confused if you have an ENFP who uses their Ne in a down to earth way (I know that sounds like a contradiction) and a ENFJ who isn't the stereotypical Fe harridan.

    I have about 4 ENFPs at my job ranging from late 20s to late 50s and the older ones have been mellowed by age so that they're not so rampant and all over the place. If you're strictly applying this to youngish versions of a type then Ne and Fe is more pronounced and easier to distinguish and you would think how could they be confused.
    Totally agreed. The first paragraph is a lot like my mom, I initially thought that she was an ENFP, but then I came to the conclusion that my mom isn't one of that stereotypical Fe dominants. That and she's very J.

    Another thing that mislead me about my mom is that she would seemingly get ideas out of the blue. But then after analyzing Ni and such further, I realized that she was foreseeing how an event would play out, and would then get the desire to act on it (Se relief). She would talk to me about these things, and then I would come up with a way to actually do what she wanted to do.

    ENFJs are probably my favorite J's to work with, along with INTJs. We are both concerned with each other's feelings, and have similar perception functions. As you told me before, differing perception tends to conflict. In the case of work and implementing goals, I absolutely agree.

    Ha, I'm just rambling at this point. But I like you ENFJs.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  4. #104
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    It has always seemed to me that the defining difference between FJs (Fe users) and FPs (Fi users) is people pragmatism vs. people optimism. Each has their purpose and I wouldn't say one is overall better than the other.
    Ha, yes, optimism is a defining trait of an ENFP. ENFJs are probably much more likely to call it like they see it and change their actions accordingly. An ENFP will blindly, some would say stupidly, keep on going the way they WISH things would turn out or WISH things were. Speaking for myself, I almost feel bad when I dislike someone when I know they are not doing something intentionally bad to me. I err on the side of giving someone too much benefit of the doubt.

    But, going back to the OP - when I was in highschool I was MUCH more of a striver than I am now. I was also class president and president of some other orgs in college. ENFPs have a need to be in the mix.

    Another woman I lived with (supposedly also an ENFP) also works ALL the time and was described by (another supposed ENFP female) as "type A". The type A ENFP was always on the go, super active, and would wake up early on the weekend to go shop at the farmer's market. I don't know how she did it.

    Being super active or in leadership positions is pretty normal for an ENFP. The energy of an ENFP who is in leadership positions though is usually more kinda manic or active and yes *enthusiastic* OR almost forced? Like, OMG I don't want to be waking up at 5am for this but I am obligated and my Fi tells me that this is right (or I can't let X down) so I'll do it. At least for me, even if it doesn't show, it takes a lot of emotional (?) internal energy to be in leadership positions and I feel the weight of responsibility and it is constantly on my mind. Whereas I think ENFJ's have more of that calm and collected "in control" vibe that has been mentioned and possibly even feed off of the responsibility/duty of being in a leadership position. I honestly think leadership positions are more taxing on an ENFP than they are on an ENFJ in the long term. In the short term unless a position has been thrust upon us, ENFPs run on enthusiasm alone and we're enjoying ourselves too much to realize that "responsibility" is involved.

    Also, you will test differently on the tests through the years. I had the test administered by a school counselor 1x in highschool and 1x in college because I was involved in student leadership. First time the answer was something really bizarre that did NOT sound right AT ALL like ISTJ? INTJ? Then in college I was ENTP (HA, how I laugh and laugh now about that)

    Who knows what your daughter will test as at 23 years old but whatever is helpful to know about her now.
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  5. #105
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    I am much more likely to be open to changing my opinion on a subject and look at the issue from both sides than my ENFJ friends, at least in real life. Once they have decided how they feel about something - they almost never change their opinion. They're also going to have much stronger black and white stands on issues than me. I am surrounded by ENFJs so have a pretty large sample to draw from.

    They are also incredibly compassionate. Very likely to forget about themselves in taking care of their loved ones.

    Can work a room like nobody's business. I don't/can't do that

    Are incredibly quick-witted.

    Instinctively know how to organize a room full of people, closet, party, lives...they just know and they do it. I have more existentital crises and they are always non-judgmental about listening. They don't indulge but they also don't judge. I love them for that.

    Both types thrive on silliness
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  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    My question is how on earth are they similar?
    Passion, intensity, insatiable quest for purpose and meaning, appreciation for all things beautiful, great communication skills, people-oriented, approach things from many angles, outgoing, dire need for regular self-reflection and time alone, at least some concern for what others think about them/strong desire to be noticed and affirmed, leaders, sensitive, curiosity and love for research and questioning, keenly aware of others' behaviors, etc., etc., etc.

  7. #107
    Senior Member TopherRed's Avatar
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    ^This.
    Love is the point.

  8. #108
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    Empathy for the outcast is more Fi than Fe.
    Every time someone says this, an angel loses its wings.

    I support zoosexuals. ZOOSEXUALS. Because there's non-harmful ways to have sex with animals. DO YOU SUPPORT ZOOSEXUALS? NO? Then STFU about Fe users trampling on outcasts!

    (I am NOT interested in talking about zoosexuals, I just want to prove this stereotype wrong. If you even TRY to talk about it, I'll just tell you to go to HELL.)

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatman455 View Post
    ENFJs Fe I think is good at picking up on other people's feelings but not at understanding them.
    Then WTF is Ni?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goatman455
    On the other side ENFP I think is less likely to be picking up on the feelings but shows a greater understanding of the feelings they do pick up.
    I think you're misunderstanding NFJs. If an NFJ seems uncaring or judgmental about someone else's feelings, it's probably because they FEEL THE PAIN SO MUCH that they are trying to compensate by suppressing it. Or, they recognize a situation where they will be potentially flooded with other people's pain and avoid it by passing it off as unworthy. No matter what the NFJ says, they're just scared to admit that the intense pain they're ignoring is valid and needs to be addressed.

    What about NFPs? Do they have a tendency to suppress empathy if it becomes too much, too?

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
    well, if she keeps spilling out strange ideas like "when i grow up, i want to become the minister of health and rid it of corruption by employing an army of 10 million policemen to survey them", or is the more studious type(likes to know a great many things), gets bored very easily, acts all goofy and things like that, then she is an enfp

    dunno how ENFJ's really behave frankly
    This is how my mum knew I was an ENFP. On my tenth birthday I declared I was going to a member of parliment and change the world.

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