User Tag List

12 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 12

Thread: infp and istj?

  1. #1
    Junior Member icefireinsanity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    2
    Posts
    4

    Question infp and istj?

    I'm an INFP chick currently with an ISTJ guy. We've been together for about 2 years now, but lately (meaning the last few months) I've been unsatisfied with the relationship. I feel like he doesn't understand me and what I need, even though I understand him. It's really hard to tell him how I feel because I've tried so many times the best ways i know how (through letters, mostly, and once with a talk) but he never changes the way he does things. It's like talking to a brick wall.

    This guy has been one of my closest friends for years, and in all these years he has never changed. He still acts like a 20-year-old kid. I'm 19 and sometimes feel like his mother, which I really don't think is good when I'm trying to have a fun, romantic relationship.

    So my question is... As two almost completely opposite personalities, are we just destined not to work in the long run?

  2. #2
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,489

    Default

    Any type combination can work. It sounds like communication is your biggest problem, which is completely normal for a teenager. You tend to improve that as you get more experienced with relationships. You can use type to understand a little more about where he's coming from, but you're both a lot more complex than your type as well. Learning ways to improve communication in general is probably the best idea. You say you've only talked about it once, and you two might not be getting through to each other very well.
    -end of thread-

  3. #3
    Junior Member icefireinsanity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    2
    Posts
    4

    Default

    What would you suggest to help improve communication?
    ¿qué es el amor? ¿quién puede comprenderlo?

  4. #4
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,489

    Default

    You'd probably do better with google than with me, but I'd suggest things like:

    -bringing up problems early and in a non-emotional, non-attacking way that clearly explains why you are upset and seeks understanding/solutions rather than blame. ie "I feel rejected when you do X thing because it makes me feel like you don't understand me, why do you do X thing?" (subtext: this is a miscommunication that we need to solve together), not "you just don't understand me, why not?!" (subtext: what's wrong with you, you don't care about me, etc)

    -compromise is super important. You say "he never changes", but unless he's doing something abusive, there generally needs to be some flex on both sides. He can make more of an effort to make you feel understood (whatever you mean by that), and you can make more of an effort to accept responsibility for making yourself more clear to him, and accepting that there will always be misunderstandings etc.

    -speaking of which, have you made it clear what tangible things you need in order to feel "understood", and why you don't feel understood now? Are those tangible things even something he's reasonably capable of? (i.e. not blatant mindreading or writing down your every word?) I'm not at all sure from reading your post what your actual issue is with the situation since "feeling understood" is about the vaguest phrase possible - are you sure he is clear what you're unhappy about?

    -communication is a two-way street. The person talking has at least as much responsibility as the person listening to ensure that the message is understood correctly. This includes listening to your partner carefully and making sure they have the right impression of what you've said.
    -end of thread-

  5. #5
    Senior Member tkae.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Socionics
    IEI
    Posts
    762

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by icefireinsanity View Post
    I'm an INFP chick currently with an ISTJ guy. We've been together for about 2 years now, but lately (meaning the last few months) I've been unsatisfied with the relationship. I feel like he doesn't understand me and what I need, even though I understand him. It's really hard to tell him how I feel because I've tried so many times the best ways i know how (through letters, mostly, and once with a talk) but he never changes the way he does things. It's like talking to a brick wall.

    This guy has been one of my closest friends for years, and in all these years he has never changed. He still acts like a 20-year-old kid. I'm 19 and sometimes feel like his mother, which I really don't think is good when I'm trying to have a fun, romantic relationship.

    So my question is... As two almost completely opposite personalities, are we just destined not to work in the long run?
    Expecting change and growth from an ISTJ is like expecting forgiveness from a brick wall.

    The key here to remember is that you two are almost polar opposites. Where your decisions and reasons are made based on personal values that have an extreme importance to you, his decisions are made on traditional ways of doing things that he knows are tried and true, which is of equally great importance to him. Where your values aren't necessarily rooted in tradition, his traditions aren't necessarily rooted in personal values.

    So from an INFP's perspective, ISTJs are illogically rigid over things that shouldn't be issues (ironically, they see us in much the same way), and they have a lot of trouble seeing other ways to do things. Compare that to how we can see a million different ways to do things, and... yeah. I've heard of this type working before though, and I also know a couple that's failing miserably because the INFP is unhealthy.

    So I think the biggest issue you'll have at the core of your relationship is the chronic feeling of emotional unfulfillment. At the same time, you need to look at the things he does to provide for you as his way of expressing his love and loyalty to you. ISTJs I know of tend to do it by being responsible about the bills and providing you with things you need to survive, which for an INFP can be easily overlooked. We're notorious about getting lost up in the clouds, right?

    But he does those things because it's his way of showing his love for you. When ISTJs get asked if they love the person, most of the ones I've heard of tend to have an "I'm still here, aren't I?" response. To an INFP that's a weird reaction. We consider that to be the bare minimum of a relationship and not a valid expression of devotion. But to them that means everything. They really care, they just show it in extremely utilitarian ways.

    So you'll feel lonely at times. But that's the worst it'll get, other than being frustrated by his rigidity in problem-solving and being bored, like you said. ISTJs aren't the most exciting people to INFPs. The thing to look at to make the relationship work is if you can be happy knowing that he'll love you by working to provide for you and take care of you in the ways that are important to him.

    Like one example I heard of was when the ISTJ had died and the partner started trying to get everything taken care of after the death, only to find out that he'd already arranged all of the insurance stuff, organized all of the funeral and cemetery payments, and dealt with all of the finances to make sure the wife had a stable financial arrangement for a good number of years.

    That's how they show love, and they mean it. If you ever challenged their love for you, they'd get really offended. It's just a kind of love language that you need to learn, something you need to sort of figure out to really appreciate.

    It's sort of sacrificing emotional care for physical and financial care, but the love is exactly the same. So the real question is do you could be satisfied by the way he expresses himself to you?
    "Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away." -Ekaku Hakuin
    http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b1...psdunkqmep.png
    5w4 . IEI . Chaotic Good
    Right-Libertarian Minarchist

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    MBTI
    STP
    Posts
    10,501

    Default

    I know one and its not a pretty relationship. Would do better if he was a mature ISTJ though and the sad part is he is around 45 or 50 years old. He would actually be closer to the ISTP "stereotype", but his functions scream ISTJ and an extremely unhealthy one.
    Im out, its been fun

  7. #7

    Default

    Save yourself a lot of years of anguish. (Voice of experience here.) Use your inner Fi to work on you, not him. Why does he need to be the one to change? Don't get me wrong - if he's doing something harmful to you that is NOT okay - but if it's just annoying things that's a whole different story. The mothering feeling sounds to me like you're expecting him to change and nursing/enabling/focusing on him instead of taking care of yourself. Let me ask you a question. If he NEVER changes, can you accept him exactly as he is? If not, than he's not the one for you. He is PERFECT for somebody exactly as he is. Is that somebody you?
    Quote Originally Posted by icefireinsanity View Post
    This guy has been one of my closest friends for years, and in all these years he has never changed.
    Men date women hoping they will never change but they do. Women date men hoping that they will change but they don't. At some point, he was awesome enough for you, right? So what changed? You or him?

    Can your needs be met in other ways? Can you seek out like-minded female friends for some of your emotional needs? Is it a fair expectation to put on the relationship? I don't know - you haven't given enough details. I just know from experience that I am much happier when I accept instead of expect.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,153

    Default

    I agree with what PrincessButtercup said. Find out what changed and if the change has made the situation volatile, see if you can change it back.

    I personally think you should dump him. He will have trouble doing things your way and understanding you because FiNe are his inferior functions, they will exhaust him and he will have trouble trusting them (perhaps for the next 10-20 years or so, if not more.) Plus the Si-dominance means he will be partial to what has worked in the past, don't expect him to change his lifestyle into a man who would tick all the boxes anytime soon as who he is now is probably a lifestyle for him which has produced the most advantages and benefits historically.

    See if your FiNe can re-negotiate the situation. Sadly you cannot expect him to do it.

  9. #9
    i love skylights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6w7 so/sx
    Socionics
    EII Ne
    Posts
    7,835

    Default

    I'm not really a fan of the idea that an ISxJ can't/won't change because of type. Si relies on past data not because it is in the past, but because it is concrete and readily available static data. If presented with equally compelling data in the present, Si should be equally open to integrating it. In other words, an ISTJ will by preference seek rational, specific, presently-pertinent information. As an NFP, you probably tend to communicate emotionally, holistically and tangentially - not what the ISTJ is seeking to use for decision-making (not that he is dismissing your thoughts - they are just not in his preferred "language"). If you can work on presenting your information in a format that is more intuitive to him, he will be better able to act on it. Speaking of, I don't see your types as polar opposites - you share Introversion, and strong preferences for Si and Fi. Nor do I feel like opposites are an automatic doom - in many ways they can be preferable, covering for each others' weak points while helping each other learn your strong points.

    A couple more thoughts - for one, girls mature more quickly then men into early adulthood - so you might want to consider giving him some time to catch up. It's not really your right to play his mother any more than it should be your responsibility to play his mother - do you know what I mean? He's going to need room to grow up, too, and he needs that freedom to make choices that might not be the best, even if he's looking to you for help. You guys are also only in late-teens/early-20s, and that's a time of much transition - changing roles from child to adult, from dependent to individual, from student to career seeker, from teenage dating to the possibility of more serious relationships. It's hard to focus on the changes in regards to another when you're already going through a lot yourself, and he might be embroiled in tension under a calm surface.

    To me it sounds like you've tried a handful of the same thing (the letters), and one talk - that's not much variation in communication. Have you asked him how best to get through to him, or what he prefers in terms of talking about issues? My SJ is a 9, and has a strong preference for non-confrontational communication. I used to wait until I was really upset until I raised an issue and then would be hyper-sensitive, emotional, and defensive, but now I try to be calm and reasonable about choosing my battles and try to present him with the situation as a question (will you help me in this way) instead of a demand (I can't do this anymore unless you change this). Mutual problem-solving has improved a lot for us since then, since he doesn't feel threatened and I don't feel desperate.

    It really depends on what, exactly, the problems are, and why he's not adapting. You have almost 2 years under your belt, so it's probably a pretty good time for re-evaluation. I wouldn't be quick to throw that away, especially because of superficial type assumptions, but I also think @PrincessButtercup offered excellent advice in terms of, if he never changes, can you still be happy and fulfilled?

  10. #10
    Junior Member grenouille's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    5w6
    Socionics
    idk Ni
    Posts
    4

    Default

    I literally joined this online community and am posting on this thread almost immediately after joining for the exact same dilemma. I have been dating an ISTJ for two years; they've been pretty conflict-free, but there have been issues that he gets really mulish about, like not eating cooked onions in any form, and one fight regarding Valentine's Day (he feels like Valentine's Day, anniversaries, and most holidays overall including Christmas are just "manufactured holidays where you have to buy more crap you don't really need." He does celebrate birthdays, though. I am not one of those people that's super invested in holidays either, but God forbid he actually spends time with me during an actual holiday, even if it's just playing Mario Kart and chilling out). As @tkae said, he tends to demonstrate his caring in very subtle ways, like getting me practical gifts, and stating that he would like to move in together after I graduate from my AA program. During this entire time, he has never once told me he loves me, and I was wondering if that is as serious issue as it would be for most people. It feels really embarrassing to have to ASK him whether or not he does, and at this point I think I would be really upset if he said, "No." So it's turning into this thing about semantics that is becoming a larger issue in my head than maybe it needs to be.

    I am thinking about seeing if he wants to go to couple's counseling before we move in together so that we can be more on the same page about things, and discuss it in kind of a neutral environment with a referee, because as @skylights said, "I wouldn't be quick to throw that away, especially because of superficial type assumptions, but I also think @PrincessButtercup offered excellent advice in terms of, if he never changes, can you still be happy and fulfilled?" There is a lot about being with him that is really great; whenever I'm upset, he listens; we share a lot of the same interests and make each other laugh. He did cave and agreed to celebrate the fourth of July with me, as well as celebrate his ten year anniversary at his job with a homemade pinata. So, it could be that there is gradual progress already being made. It's not that I'm on the verge of breaking up with him -- in fact, I really want to try to make it work, and be able to understand him better so we have a better chance of being together for a long time. The thing is, he's pretty close-mouthed about emotional stuff, and I can sense waves of discomfort emanating from him whenever I bring up stuff that makes him uncomfortable. However, there are always going to be uncomfortable times in any long term relationship, and I wish we could get to a point where he feels less threatened by those kinds of questions.

Similar Threads

  1. INFP and ISTJ Relationships
    By chubber in forum Intertype Relations
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-04-2016, 04:26 AM
  2. [INFP] INFP and ISTJ Relationship Issue
    By Starrynight5 in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-19-2015, 11:56 AM
  3. [INFP] INFPs and flirting
    By briochick in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 02-08-2009, 01:10 AM
  4. [INFP] INFPs and the "disappearance" syndrome
    By Dwigie in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 45
    Last Post: 09-24-2008, 10:14 AM
  5. [INFP] INFPs and the Lack of Initiative
    By nolla in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 09-02-2008, 01:38 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO