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Thread: Cynical INFP's

  1. #41
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    I cant remember a time when I WASN'T cynical.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  2. #42
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    I cant remember a time when I WASN'T cynical.
    Does nothing ever live up to your expectations? Bitter disappointments from the past, yes?

  3. #43
    Senor Membrae Eugene Watson VIII's Avatar
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    not all the time, maybe more so during teh Te phases
    Myers-Briggs: xsFP

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    ~ People don't think it be like it is, but it do. ~

  4. #44
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by minutegovt View Post
    not all the time, maybe more so during teh Te phases
    Oh dem Te phases! This is a first I'm seeing though, care to elaborate on what you mean with your Te phases?

  5. #45
    Senor Membrae Eugene Watson VIII's Avatar
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    Yeah, sometimes I have no faith in people because it feels like they're taking a stance against my morals and sometimes even me. But when I utilize Te mainly, it becomes more like 'what a dumbass, make me a minute late for the movies by waiting in front of me for the car park ahead of me when there's another just a few metres away'. I think the cynicism that comes from Te is a lot more aggressive and obvious than from Fi...if that makes sense.

    I think more things are capable of provoking Te than Fi.

    EDIT: link < 'the grip' I saw just before the 'stress at work' part. Actually a good read, would have to buy it
    Myers-Briggs: xsFP

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  6. #46
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    Haha, I know what you mean with Te aggression, I've read somewhere of it being described as "the grip" where our inferior functions manifest itself in an unhealthy way. However it is also to my understanding that it can also be developed in a positive manner as well. So yeah, certainly making sense! I find my recent Te outbreaks have just been utterly destructive. Drives to become narrow and enforcing of what I believe is morally correct on those close to me, or atleast, the desire to do so.
    All the Fi accommodation, respect and openness just goes right out the window when Te hogs that energy.

  7. #47
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joehobo View Post
    Does nothing ever live up to your expectations? Bitter disappointments from the past, yes?
    Well actually im not an INFP and although there is something of that in there, im more...cynical alongside cheerful. Im cynical over what I think it is a good idea to be cynical over and I judge for myself when it is best to apply that cynicism.

    In all honesty ive never understood why most people live cynicism as if it is a lifestyle....cant you turn it on and off as and where applicable? Or is it that most people are not like me and they need cynicism to happen upon them from negative experiences?

    Of course it might just be that I acknowledge cynicism towards certain things which I feel it is intelligent to be wary of.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    I think the context of this may have been misunderstood, I was speaking in the form of the general interpretation of a cynic.
    You sounds more like the true nature of being a cynic, or reasoning more so.
    This was more related to reinforcing past experiences of disappointment which have led to a developing mindset which borders pessimism. People not living upto expectations (which are considered unreasonable or unrealistic to begin with.) In specific to INFP, it relates to the Fi - Si. However everyone can experience this to an extent but it does seem very habitual in NF's.

    Does alot of the posters experience resonate with you? If so then you certainly fit the context and I'm just misunderstanding you.

    I didn't understand either why, but I am beginning to now because of my own experiences. It's more of a habit or way of dealing things being reinforced, its not so simple to just switch off. You actively have to work through it. Applying cynicism in the sense of placing it only where it is applicable is more on the lines of reasoning or skepticism I think, or the true nature of a cynic in the greek philosophy.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joehobo View Post
    Greetings. This is my first thread, yay me. I half wish it was on something a little more positive but oh well.
    Feel free to share your own experiences here on this, do you as an INFP experience a disturbing amount of cynicism in your life - either from within yourself, or other people in their views on you?
    Please give reasons as to the whys, what and hows. I'm curious to see how people deal with this if it is present within your life and how it manifests itself in your day to day living especially in regards to interpersonal relationships.

    Looking forward to see your replies, any input would be nice especially perspectives from types other than the INFP type and how they see them.

    Sorry if there is an old thread covering this, I am new here still and didn't want to revive any old ones.
    Sorry, I’m just kind of jumping in here and responding to the OP and the subject in general. But I did skim most of the thread. Anyway, on a general note:

    Presumably, cynicism in INFPs comes from having internal models in our head of how people are supposed to behave (our “ideals”). When people don’t behave according to our internal models, we feel disillusioned. Since our internal models are always a little behind the curve (they reflect past experiences and beliefs rather than predicting the future), we can end up being disillusioned pretty frequently and end up cynical about life as a whole.

    The correct answer is that we’re supposed to be using our Ne to take in info about the outside world and update our internal models so that our internal models are current with the way the world is. Without that step, our internal models can get increasingly out of step with the real world. [This line of thought is explained at the following website:] http://www.personalitypage.com/html/INFP_per.html

    So the resulting conclusion would be that an INFP who is frequently disillusioned or cynical probably isn’t using his/her Ne enough. Our Fi and our Ne should be working together, side-by-side: Our Fi constructs internal models to reflect the outside world (in order to find meaning and coherency in the world), while our Ne constantly does reality checks on the models and updates the internal models to incorporate in them new info about real-world conditions.

  10. #50
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    Sorry, I’m just kind of jumping in here and responding to the OP and the subject in general. But I did skim most of the thread. Anyway, on a general note:

    Presumably, cynicism in INFPs comes from having internal models in our head of how people are supposed to behave (our “ideals”). When people don’t behave according to our internal models, we feel disillusioned. Since our internal models are always a little behind the curve (they reflect past experiences and beliefs rather than predicting the future), we can end up being disillusioned pretty frequently and end up cynical about life as a whole.

    The correct answer is that we’re supposed to be using our Ne to take in info about the outside world and update our internal models so that our internal models are current with the way the world is. Without that step, our internal models can get increasingly out of step with the real world. [This line of thought is explained at the following website:] http://www.personalitypage.com/html/INFP_per.html

    So the resulting conclusion would be that an INFP who is frequently disillusioned or cynical probably isn’t using his/her Ne enough. Our Fi and our Ne should be working together, side-by-side: Our Fi constructs internal models to reflect the outside world (in order to find meaning and coherency in the world), while our Ne constantly does reality checks on the models and updates the internal models to incorporate in them new info about real-world conditions.
    Your input is more than welcome.

    I can defiantly see how Fi behaves in that manner, that link explains how the lack of Ne contributes to this really well! I can see how this ties in with the V&A exercise you shared previously by applying the Fi and Ne to it. It is hard to balance out against Si though, takes alot of active reminders. If auto pilot goes on Si is doing most of the spoon feeding for Fi I can imagine.

    I wonder how this works with the NFJ's though.

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