[MBTI General] short rant on NFs

[Jack Flak]

eh, I was only playing. everyone knows that, right? ... right...?

Of course, buddy. *knowing look*

 

[substitute]

*hides signature*

I HAD to be playing - I'm not even a Te type!

*kicks Te under the rug, stands on rug*

 

[Lizzy1813]

*hides signature*

I HAD to be playing - I'm not even a Te type!

*kicks Te under the rug, stands on rug*

Of course not!

 

[Haphazard]

yeah, I thought it'd go down well

eh, I was only playing. everyone knows that, right? ... right...?

That was SO ENTP.

 

[substitute]

That was SO ENTP.

Yeah? What you gonna do, go all Si and MEMORIZE stuff at me??

 

[SuperFob]

I don't know any real life people who I would honestly label as 'friends', so I guess the OP has a point that for a supposedly 'people-oriented person', I'm a complete loner.

If I did have a friend, though, I like to imagine myself as being fiercely loyal to him/her. I always imagine myself in situations where someone shows up with a gun, tries to shoot my friend, and I end up taking the bullet and dying instead. I like to fantasize about myself making sacrifices like that. The thought of whether I would actually do it in a real situation has been a big cause of distress and self-doubt for me

 

[Sniffles]

He's lucky you're all NFs. Otherwise you might have clubbed him like a baby seal.

Damn, you just had to remind me of this before I was able to grab my bat!

 

[Haphazard]

Yeah? What you gonna do, go all Si and MEMORIZE stuff at me??

I don't have enough of that to do anything of note with, sorry.

 

[substitute]

I don't have enough of that to do anything of note with, sorry.

Haha, now THAT was very INTJ

okay okay okay okay, I'll STFU and behave already...

 

[Nonsensical]

Jack Flak: Nope, the post was to the overall thread in general, I have no problems with your thread. Hope that solves things

 

[Udog]

Jack and substitute, I find myself agreeing with you for the most part. It's not that I haven't received the same type of apologies from other types, it's that when I'm dealing with NFs I expect them. Our rudeness can become attached to our values and character, making it rather difficult to deal with the issue directly.

I've not only had to deal with it, but I was often guilty of this myself until I was able to start working on fixing it.

 

[Anja]

Forums are different because I can't perceive the tone of voice. But in RL I look askance at "I was only making a joke" kind of stuff. Especially if a person repeatedly does it and if the "jokes" cut too deep for light humor. Like, "I hope your grandma dies!" (I'm immune to that particular one. It hurts in grade school, though.)

Gotta know someone sometimes tell the difference.

I don't know about other NFs but, if I like someone and want to be friends, I tend to look at what I think are flaws as "What it is, is what it is."

 

[Jack Flak]

I don't know about other NFs but, if I like someone and want to be friends, I tend to look at what I think are flaws as "What it is, is what it is."

Well I'm NT, but that's exactly my stance as well. I'm extremely "Come as you are," if I'm inviting you at all. And I appreciate the differences--they are the essence of interesting relationships.

The philosophy may have a loose correlation to some types, but I think it's more wisdom based.

 

[phoenix13]

Rationalizing bad behavior is an NF thing? NFs are somehow better at it? Humans rationalize bad behavior. It's theoretically conceivable that an NF with Fi may use morality to do it (although I've never seen anyone do this... perhaps you should give me an example of it). That doesn't in any way raise the stature of this thread above bitter rant. I also hope your own baggage hasn't led you make such vast generalizations, or so-called tenedncies that embrace INFPs, ENFPs, INFJs, and ENFJs.
...

Points:

1. Everything I've posted (or will post) in this thread has been generalization with consideration to both groups of people and tendencies. I'm often misunderstood as saying things "are..." as opposed to saying things "often tend to be..." It's the latter.

Check out the bold/italic/underlined portion. You weren't misunderstood.

2. It is also primarily detached, abstract analysis in the INTP style. The analysis is its own goal. I might as well be discussing a mental creation as actual people.

As a P, I can go with that.

3. I would say NFs have less of a need to rationalize than others. To use function terminology, their dominant judging function is Feeling, so if something strikes the NF as right, it will likely forever be considered to be right. There is less of a felt need to make excuses for actions. SFs tend to be less influenced by the concept of chasing ideals, and therefore show dissimilar inclination here.

If by "feel" you mean see whether or not an action fits into your value-system, then kudos. Otherwise, you're probably confusing Feeling and feeling.

For my own clarification, are you assuming that
A) NFs are behaving badly because their F tells them to. IOW they genuinely believe they're doing the correct, morally just thing.
B) They're repressing their F function. This is something you could theoretically attribute to ENFPs or INFJs simply because feeling is not their dominant function (thus easier to ignore).
C) It's self-delusion. IOW, they're manipulating their F function to justify what they want to do. (similar to repression except you're corrupting the F instead of ignoring it)

I ask because when you say Fs don't TEND to need to justify their behavior, you're suggesting repression. However, then you say in point 5:

5. All types can demonstrate behavior similar to this. As stated earlier, it is the method of justification which is somewhat unique.

and supporting point 5 is your example in point 4 where:

They have followed their heart, and feel justified in doing so, which leads to...

(where "followed their heart" is the justification. Iow, they value following one's heart)

Those are in conflict, so I'm confused.

 

[Domino]

I'm grabbing Phoenix's boobs right now. Feelers.

 

[Jack Flak]

I'm grabbing Phoenix's boobs right now. Feelers.

Guiltlessly, naturally.

 

[Jack Flak]

If by "feel" you mean see whether or not an action fits into your value-system, then kudos.

Precisely.

For my own clarification, are you assuming that
A) NFs are behaving badly because their F tells them to. IOW they genuinely believe they're doing the correct, morally just thing.
B) They're repressing their F function. This is something you could theoretically attribute to ENFPs or INFJs simply because feeling is not their dominant function (thus easier to ignore).
C) It's self-delusion. IOW, they're manipulating their F function to justify what they want to do. (similar to repression except you're corrupting the F instead of ignoring it)

A, primarily. But I refer to not just "bad" behavior but all behavior.

I ask because when you say Fs don't TEND to need to justify their behavior, you're suggesting repression. However, then you say in point 5:

and supporting point 5 is your example in point 4 where:
(where "followed their heart" is the justification. Iow, they value following one's heart)

Those are in conflict, so I'm confused.

Repression is the last thing I had in mind. It is the full acceptance of the Feeling judgments as truth.

 

[phoenix13]

Precisely.

A, primarily. But I refer to not just "bad" behavior but all behavior.


Repression is the last thing I had in mind. It is the full acceptance of the Feeling judgments as truth.

WOAH WOAH WOAH! You've just blown me away, Mr. Flak! So the Feeling judgements are unreliable in decisions involving people, and cause them to be flaky...

I can see "the full acceptance of the Feeling judgments as truth" being an issue with holding opinions with no fact to back them up... but as for flaking out on your friend and all the stuff OP talked about...? What "feeler" won't have PEOPLE as a high value? It's getting late, and I don't know if you actually care to pursue this, but I still don't understand where this "observed trend" is coming from. Perhaps you could give me specific observations/examples from your life or find some other way to explain it...sheesh.

Note: I tend to sound outraged and super-invested when arguing or debating things. I'm not... just really excited.

 

[cafe]

Holy necromancy, Batman!

 

[Atomic Fiend]

What she said.