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  1. #171
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I loooooooooove interacting with them because they are always surprising and secretly gooey on the inside like me. The most loyal friends of mine have always been INTJs who may not always understand why I am having some emotional breakdown, but are always willing to listen patiently and then help me see solutions. They aren't the types who cheer me off of the cliffs of insanity.
    Just yesterday I used the term gooey in an email about an intj.

    I so rarely have a conflict with an INTJ that I remember the one time I did with my very close friend. I was understandably upset (don't remember what now) and I told him I was really mad. He said that I had good reason to be. And that ended the whole argument. I didn't have to spend time explaining myself because he already understood.

    I have to wonder if different types of INTJs are at play here. I've run into intjs on this forum that seem very different from the close INTJ friends I've made over the years.

  2. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by xenaprincess View Post
    I get you. But some INFPs are really, really sensitive, and some INTJ's tell it like it is in the most brutal way.
    (Disclaimers abound!)

    After the first dinner I cooked for my INTJ (spinach lasagna), he dropped his fork in the bowl, stood up and declared 'I don't like it!' and proceeded to make himself a bowl of cereal. Yowch.

    Some INTJ's just don't pussyfoot around or consider...feewings.
    (not ranting at you my dearest of the dear.)


    Ugh. I am so sick of the "INFPs are magical fluff balls who float around at the merest whim of their emotions." INFPs need to grow an exoskeletan formed from the remains of their enemies like a lobster version of the Iron Throne and will be called the delightful name of "carapace" adhered to their soul.

    Then, and only then, a Jedi will they be.

  3. #173
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    (not ranting at you my dearest of the dear.)


    Ugh. I am so sick of the "INFPs are magical fluff balls who float around at the merest whim of their emotions." INFPs need to grow an exoskeletan formed from the remains of their enemies like a lobster version of the Iron Throne and will be called the delightful name of "carapace" adhered to their soul.

    Then, and only then, a Jedi will they be.
    not all INFPs are like this
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  4. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    (not ranting at you my dearest of the dear.)

    Ugh. I am so sick of the "INFPs are magical fluff balls who float around at the merest whim of their emotions." INFPs need to grow an exoskeletan formed from the remains of their enemies like a lobster version of the Iron Throne and will be called the delightful name of "carapace" adhered to their soul.

    Then, and only then, a Jedi will they be.
    Agreed. Completely. This is one reason I've always abhorred the traditional INFP type descriptions. I have an exoskeletan. Always have. There are relatively few things that can rouse an emotional display out of me as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I don't understand half of this thread.

    Like, WHY are INFPs "afraid" of INTJs?! You have got to be kidding me. INTJs are deliciously awesome. Ni = mysterious candy allurement like a stranger in a strange van in an even stranger land ringing a siren bell of CANDYYYYYYYYYYYY that you must investigate or you will DIE.... Te = in the hands of a dom or aux is nothing like the obnoxious crazy of tert or inf. They will defend you will cunning amazingness if they like you and you get attacked by some dumb person who doesn't realize you have the universe's equivilant of the "get out of jail free card" standing next to you.... Fi = Not going to demand your emotions off the bat, and wonder why you aren't snuggling with them on date #1. Se = open to new ideas and challenges and stuff.

    Anyone who thinks NTJs are scary needs to befriend a few. I loooooooooove interacting with them because they are always surprising and secretly gooey on the inside like me. The most loyal friends of mine have always been INTJs who may not always understand why I am having some emotional breakdown, but are always willing to listen patiently and then help me see solutions. They aren't the types who cheer me off of the cliffs of insanity.

    THE END.

    P.s.
    Preach it sista.

    Quote Originally Posted by xenaprincess View Post
    I get you. But some INFPs are really, really sensitive, and some INTJ's tell it like it is in the most brutal way.
    (Disclaimers abound!)

    After the first dinner I cooked for my INTJ (spinach lasagna), he dropped his fork in the bowl, stood up and declared 'I don't like it!' and proceeded to make himself a bowl of cereal. Yowch.

    Some INTJ's just don't pussyfoot around or consider...feewings.
    I think your INTJ and my ESTJ should get together and go bowling, hehe.

    I think it is a TJ thing. Not sure how long you’ve been together, but have you found he’s mellowed or grown at all in this area over the years? My ESTJ has very much. When we were first married and throughout the first 5 years, stories like the one you just gave number in the hundreds. He’s much more developed and balanced than he used to be, and just keeps getting better. He’s really sexy, too…. in case that’s relevant.

  5. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laurie View Post
    Just yesterday I used the term gooey in an email about an intj.

    I so rarely have a conflict with an INTJ that I remember the one time I did with my very close friend. I was understandably upset (don't remember what now) and I told him I was really mad. He said that I had good reason to be. And that ended the whole argument. I didn't have to spend time explaining myself because he already understood.

    I have to wonder if different types of INTJs are at play here. I've run into intjs on this forum that seem very different from the close INTJ friends I've made over the years.
    Enneagram and instinctual stackings make a HUGE difference.

  6. #176
    Senior Member Turtledove's Avatar
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    Fine, I don't want y'all anyways.
    Let people be themselves unless they are psychologically in need of help.
    Save Thundercats 2011 petition. Because we do what we can. HO!!!:
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  7. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mia. View Post
    Enneagram and instinctual stackings make a HUGE difference.
    Thank you.

    I wanted to mention this earlier, but didn't want to be the first one bangin this drum again.

    Having finally gotten really into the enneagram, I can't stress enough how much it explains intratype differences.

    @Nicodemus: INTJ 5w4 sp/sx
    @Kalach: INTJ 5w? sp/sx
    @uumlau: INTJ ? ?
    @highlander: INTJ 6w7 sx/sp
    @Coriolis INTJ 5w6 sp/sx
    @InvisibleJim INTJ 6w5 sx/?
    @Engineer: INTJ 6w5 sp/sx
    @Edgar: INTJ ? ?
    @Within: INTJ 5w6 sp/so
    Me: INTJ 6w5 sx/so

    The only person I've been compared to on this forum is InvisibleJim; coincidence that he happens to be an INTJ 6w5, and likely sx first?

    These three factors together don't explain everything about a person, but they explain far more than just MBTI type alone.

    Btw, INTJs: if you know your enneagram/instinctual variant, and aren't afraid to let me know, let me know.

  8. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    This sounds a lot like my hypothesis on why ESFPs are the better choice for INTJs than ENFPs. In that pairing, Se is the driver for "calling an INTJ on bullshit" (not that I don't think your TP mind is highly tainted regarding this matter), which at least makes some theoretical sense, as it's bringing in elements of the INTJ's blindspot, forcing him to reconcile/balance out whatever high-minded imaginings Ni is coming up with with a fair dose of Se realism (which, if an INTJ is balanced, healthy, and developed, he should be doing independently, anyway). What's the greater enabler of this ability for an INFP? How is dominant Fi better at "calling bullshit" than dominant Se, or auxiliary Se? Frankly, I never really have associated INFPs with the sort of tough-minded realism that would be useful for calling bullshit on an INTJ. I associate them with strong subjective opinions which are often high-minded imaginings in and of themselves, so how would these really be helpful for "calling bullshit", as opposed to simply forcing the INFP's highly subjective Fi cognitive bias on the INTJ?

    Everyone else in here keeps on talking about INTJs and their Te-harshness/bluntness/realism. What exactly are you talking about that needs to have bullshit called on?
    (Now it’s my turn to have the INTJs mad at me I suppose.)

    There are several reasons for this to be the resulting dynamic.

    Tough-minded realism is Se, you’re right. It has nothing to do with that.

    INTJs play bullshit with their Fi. On a regular basis. Contrary to what most people think or suppose, INTJs are not unemotional or lack feeling. They feel very deeply, and it drives much of what they use the rest of their functions to do. They often have a set of values that heavily influences their feeling of mission in life, and heavily influences their emotions. However, despite having this and it performing a huge role in their life and actions, because it is lower in their hierarchy, sometimes they experience a disconnect, fuzziness, or obliviousness to it. They sometimes stumble in application of their own values and emotions. This often results in a lot of dissonance for the INTJ, and screws up their equilibrium, and makes them a less effective individual, and hampers their own self-imposed goals, including their Ni vision.

    Many INTJs are also prone to depression, very low self-esteem (while seeming confident, even overly so, on the outside to most people), and denying/suppressing/drowning their emotions, especially negative ones. Paradoxically, the more an INTJ tries to divorce themselves or numb themselves to their feelings/emotions, or pretend they have no emotions, the more intrusive these emotions become in asserting themselves and start to spill out all over the place in unhealthy ways.

    I think you have an incomplete understanding of what it means to be an Fi dom. It’s not just having high-minded imaginings. We get a whole kit of tools and perks that go with this package.

    One of them being, Fi is very attuned to Fi. We constantly have our feelers out, searching and scanning for a match and congruency between our values and the values of others. In addition, we run analysis on an individual’s values and their actual behavior.

    Enter Ne as the helping function, and INFPs are natural lie detectors. This includes when someone is lying to themselves as well. Often we won’t say anything about it, but just assimilate the information into the matrix. But if the bullshit threshold is reached, or we see someone we love harming themselves or getting frustrated and going in circles, we will engage on this. How an INFP does it will depend on their own preferences and development. With me, it tends to be very Te, albeit gentle and patient, with a desire not to go there if it is truly not welcome. Ne (being an NF) also helps us - in conjunction with the individual - brainstorm a roadmap for troubleshooting and creative solutions to the problem.

    We see the INTJ’s inner drive in terms of their values. We also see their emotions. We see them doing the opposite of what they actually believe, or what they know, even unconsciously, would be in their best interest or health to reach their goals. Or we see them avoiding it because of being overwhelmed and ill-equipped to handle it, causing untold chaos. There is a discrepancy between what they believe, or feel, and even what their Ni and Te would tell them to do, and what they are doing.

    Nah dude. That’s some bull-shee-it.

    To go back to the movie Onegin, here is a very light and brief (yet momentous) example of an INFP calling an INTJ out on this issue. It happens at the end of the scene, where he is about to exit and go back to the party.

    Likes lulabelle liked this post

  9. #179
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joehobo View Post
    Is that really an INTJ thing, or just bad table manners?
    It is bad manners. INTJs, however, are less inclined to observe manners for their own sake than many other types. We generally understand what the most commonly expected manners are, though, and if we care about you, will at least try to avoid the worst offenses. (I'm told my ISTJ father said something similar to my ESFJ mother, one of the first time she cooked for him.)

    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    Anyway, I can see that all as a big problem. INTJs interact with the world via Te, which is a solution-oriented or organization-oriented function. They’re probably not going to be happy with the INFP’s traditional Ne approach: open-ended, playful, wait-and-see, I-want-to-be-courted. If anything, INTJs seem to need to be courted in return: They need the INFP to put on a Te facade and show that they (INFPs) can keep up or at least not be turned off by an organizational, results-oriented approach to the world.
    This seems plausible. If an INTJ sees something worthwhile and appealing in an INFP, however, perhaps through extended casual interaction (school, work, neighbors, etc.), we won't be deterred by their reticence and hesitation. We can be very persistent in going after what we consider worthwhile. As people who don't tend to rush headlong into relationships ourselves, the idea of protracted courtship shouldn't put us off, as long as the INFP continues to respond and interact. Slow and steady wins the race. (My INTP relied on this strategy as well.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Laurie View Post
    I have to wonder if different types of INTJs are at play here. I've run into intjs on this forum that seem very different from the close INTJ friends I've made over the years.
    Well, INTJs minted before 1991 are noticeably different from newer ones since that's when the factory made the last significant upgrade to the system kernel, and added some new human interface utilities. Not all the utility modules were compatible with Asian language systems, though, so if your INTJ comes from Asia, he/she will have a different interface toolbox.
    Last edited by Coriolis; 06-04-2012 at 03:17 PM. Reason: fixed critical typo
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #180
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    (not ranting at you my dearest of the dear.)
    INFPs need to grow an exoskeletan
    omg, yeah, hmmmmmmmmmm, hmmmmmmmmmmm......*thinks*
    exoskeleton.................insect...............p est...........bug spray..........murder........brazillian prison..........conjugal visits.............dates, omg, INFPs are murder-mongering pests who think dates are same thing as one night stands and annoy fuk out of you with their unicorn fluffnballs when they aren't laying on backs with legs open???

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