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Thread: Te + INFJ = !

  1. #1
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Default Te + INFJ = !

    INFJs, pls help...and Te-users, too. i'm trying to avoid breaking an INFJ's heart. he's a friend. we've tried dating before but i just never felt it* and somewhere along that path he fell in love.

    INFJs:
    1 - if you were to fall in love with a friend, what is the best way for that friend to tell you she doesn't see a romantic future between the two of you? (short explanation? in person or written?)
    2 - have you ever tried pressuring someone into a relationship, by making yourself hyper-available/-accommodating or turning on the big saucer eyes? oblique/indirect displays of romantic feelings that may be difficult to pick up on?
    3 - if you are rejected by a friend, does that usually mean the end of the friendship?

    Te-users:
    1 - how do you reign in your Te in relationships? are you able to soften the blow when rejecting someone for a relationship? (my tendency is to lay out specific reasons why it won't work, but the more manipulated or pressured i feel** the more heartless the Te becomes. i dislike this but Te just wants to solve a problem, after all.)
    2 - do you find yourself becoming less of a feeler with the more Te you develop? more emotionally objective? as an ENFP, it seems that sometimes Te is the only recourse...and anyway, if we're already at Te you're kinda fucked: my Fi won't help you and chances are good my Ne helped get us in this situation to begin with!


    thanks for your help folks. i feel like i'm about to eviscerate a baby goat.



    *that is not a euphemism.
    **i think there's a problem with Te and the negative reaction to feeling manipulated that goes beyond explaining it away by claiming tertiary temptation. i have developed a certain amount of Te and in certain situations feel disgusted by irrational displays of emotion. which is odd for an NF, but makes its own perverse kind of sense: you've worked your ass off to *get* some damn Te and someone comes and ruins it with subjective emotion. it's like finishing a beautiful painting and a dog comes along and sprays it. <- rather ectopic thinking but you get the picture.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


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  2. #2
    Undisciplined Starry's Avatar
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    My advice would be to tell him how you feel in the way you would like to be given the same information if the roles were reversed.
    And then prepare for this INFJ to never talk to you again.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starry View Post
    My advice would be to tell him how you feel in the way you would like to be given the same information if the roles were reversed.
    thanks for your advice. i've tried this. many times. the more i do, the more stubborn he gets.

    And then prepare for this INFJ to never talk to you again.
    i'm figuring. which chaps my hide: if you claim to love someone, and they haven't wronged you (they just don't see a romantic future with you) why can't you go back to being friends?

    ETA: maybe that's silly, but from my understanding INFJs just hit the goddamn road. seems so punitive.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  4. #4
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentfurrina View Post
    i'm figuring. which chaps my hide: if you claim to love someone, and they haven't wronged you (they just don't see a romantic future with you) why can't you go back to being friends?

    ETA: maybe that's silly, but from my understanding INFJs just hit the goddamn road. seems so punitive.
    The INFJ just needs time to get over the feelings, which sometimes can take a while. In the meantime... for those X number of months, it's difficult to be around the person and try to be 'just friends', while knowing or seeing that person date other people or become involved romantically with others. It's probably why it's easier to cut them out completely for that interim, until feelings are worked through / no longer cause a stumbling block to true friendship. For me this has really only applies if I was actually in a relationship and it ended, but I suppose the same could apply for INFJ's who fall for someone and the relationship never happens? It seems odd on one level, but plausible.

    Is this different for non-Fe-er's? Do Fi-ers have the ability to switch instantaneously into friend-mode and watch the other person be involved with others and be perfectly ok with that?
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  5. #5
    Undisciplined Starry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentfurrina View Post
    thanks for your advice. i've tried this. many times. the more i do, the more stubborn he gets.


    i'm figuring. which chaps my hide: if you claim to love someone, and they haven't wronged you (they just don't see a romantic future with you) why can't you go back to being friends?

    ETA: maybe that's silly, but from my understanding INFJs just hit the goddamn road. seems so punitive.
    Ooohhh so you’ve got one of them more persistent/powerful/prevailing INFJs. My sister is this kind of INFJ…but I find it difficult to get meaningful advice online regarding how to deal with her because many people don’t seem to…even believe me…that this kind of INFJ does exist. I’m almost wondering if reaching-out to some ENFJs for some advice on how to communicate with this person would be more effective. The good news, however, is that I find this specific kind of INFJ to be less retiring and less likely to end the relationship when all is said and done. (edit: I should add that there will be some dramatics though...and then the friendship should be able to return to normal. And it's awesome to see you again!!!)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    The INFJ just needs time to get over the feelings, which sometimes can take a while. In the meantime... for those X number of months, it's difficult to be around the person and try to be 'just friends', while knowing or seeing that person date other people or become involved romantically with others. It's probably why it's easier to cut them out completely for that interim, until feelings are worked through / no longer cause a stumbling block to true friendship.
    this makes sense. thank you! i will resist the urge to invite him out to play during his convalescence...which would have been my [possibly insensitive] impulse.

    Is this different for non-Fe-er's? Do Fi-ers have the ability to switch instantaneously into friend-mode and watch the other person be involved with others and be perfectly ok with that?
    not sure about other Fi users but i can flip flop pretty easily in most cases. i see relationships as evolving and highly elastic. i also invest a lot in my relationships and want them to last a long time, regardless of what form they take along the way. sometimes ENFPs are accused of being casual about relationships, but i don't see it that way. if you're in my life it's for the long haul and i expect us to be changing each other's diapers one day. cc: @violaine

    Quote Originally Posted by Starry View Post
    Ooohhh so you’ve got one of them more persistent/powerful/prevailing INFJs. My sister is this kind of INFJ…but I find it difficult to get meaningful advice online regarding how to deal with her because many people don’t seem to…even believe me…that this kind of INFJ does exist. I’m almost wondering if reaching-out to some ENFJs for some advice on how to communicate with this person would be more effective. The good news, however, is that I find this specific kind of INFJ to be less retiring and less likely to end the relationship when all is said and done.
    yes. this guy is like a piece of bubble gum i can't get off me shoe. he's a lovely person but JESUS is he proud and stubborn! not sure about women INFJs but i've read that INFJ males sometimes develop that pride+stubborn combo as a way of compensating for the effeminate rap they sometimes get. try giving this guy advice on something (i'm a 7w6 so that is what i do): he just digs his heels in and only listens when i pull out the Te hammer. but by then i've lost a wee bit of respect for him because i've almost had to assume a goddamn pulpit to get him to listen. it's almost like i'm trying to tell him that reality isn't the way he's envisioned it to be and he gets resentful.

    anywhosies, NF on NF is just messy.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  7. #7
    Undisciplined Starry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentfurrina View Post
    not sure about other Fi users but i can flip flop pretty easily in most cases. i see relationships as evolving and highly elastic. i also invest a lot in my relationships and want them to last a long time, regardless of what form they take along the way. sometimes ENFPs are accused of being casual about relationships, but i don't see it that way. if you're in my life it's for the long haul and i expect us to be changing each other's diapers one day.
    I was answering @cascadeco 's question and then my computer had to shut down for updates (so irritating haha)...but then lookey here...you answered this the same way I would. I get the sense an INFJ starts out with a vision/ideal of how they want a relationship to proceed...and if it looks like that will not be lived-out...they will close-up-shop (INFJs can certainly come on here and correct me if my understanding is faulty though). For me...while I do have hopes and dreams surrounding my relationships...I'm much more 'go-with-the-flow'. I don't have a desire to control/guide the relationship in one way or the other. As long as the individual is in my life...I'm happy and can make adjustments as necessary. Now I've gotta get my head-screwed on straight and take a look at the other part of your message.

  8. #8
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    ^That's interesting, to both of you.

    I guess I was focusing in on the feelings element. In the event that you harbor feelings for someone and they do not, it's just a blink of an eye and you can kind of quickly work through those so they no longer exist, so that you're not jealous/bothered/upset seeing the other person dating someone else? Just curious.

    I mean, I feel like I'm able to adjust to what I'll call relationship 'realities', but that's at more of an intellectual level. The feelings don't adjust at the same rate.

    @agentfurrina -- while I think I can understand your losing respect by the very fact that you have to wield the Te-hammer (as you put it), on the other hand, if you simply convey a message in a more feeling-ish way so as to try not to hurt his feelings, he might see that as something he can 'work with' and that has maneuvering room. By being blunt and direct, you're actually being more helpful in the long run, imo.

    Basically - if trying to let him down easy isn't doing much, then try the blunt method. That'll make things crystal clear for him so that he doesn't have any wiggle room, thinking '...well maybe,', or '.. she wasn't that harsh, so maybe she isn't super solid on what she's saying...'

    Does that make sense? I don't know if I'm an unusual one or not, but I actually appreciate directness.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

    My Photography and Watercolor Fine Art Prints!!! Cascade Colors Fine Art Prints
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  9. #9
    Undisciplined Starry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentfurrina View Post
    yes. this guy is like a piece of bubble gum i can't get off me shoe. he's a lovely person but JESUS is he proud and stubborn! not sure about women INFJs but i've read that INFJ males sometimes develop that pride+stubborn combo as a way of compensating for the effeminate rap they sometimes get. try giving this guy advice on something (i'm a 7w6 so that is what i do): he just digs his heels in and only listens when i pull out the Te hammer. but by then i've lost a wee bit of respect for him because i've almost had to assume a goddamn pulpit to get him to listen. it's almost like i'm trying to tell him that reality isn't the way he's envisioned it to be and he gets resentful.
    Yah...I mean I'll just say...INFJ males are not for the faint-of-heart. Although the INFJ male I knew irl...while he had some serious issues with anger, pride, bitterness and stubborness...he was also very retiring and if I even looked at him sideways he would basically stop talking to me. But like I said...I do have some experience with this more persistant variety...and honesty I don't really know what to tell you as I've attempted and failed to get good advice here myself. My sister...she just won't listen at all and rejects all incoming information that doesn't line-up with her 'idealistic world'. I'll think on this some more my dear.

  10. #10
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    I guess I was focusing in on the feelings element. In the event that you harbor feelings for someone and they do not, it's just a blink of an eye and you can kind of quickly work through those so they no longer exist, so that you're not jealous/bothered/upset seeing the other person dating someone else? Just curious.
    our flexibility is probably due to having explored many possible scenarios with a given person --> having accepted the possible outcomes (just imagine what bisexual Ne-doms go through!). but there's probably some scary truth underneath it all: if we are able to maintain some degree of objectivity in a romantic context...you probably never had us to begin with. we just didn't realize it until it's too late, or never at all. or maybe we did and struggled to communicate it. this is entirely possible. perhaps we were intellectually willing to consider the relationship, but our full machinery wasn't employed.

    maybe we were waiting for the unicorn of love to appear and take us f̶r̶o̶m̶ ̶b̶e̶h̶i̶n̶d̶ away...

    while I think I can understand your losing respect by the very fact that you have to wield the Te-hammer (as you put it), on the other hand, if you simply convey a message in a more feeling-ish way so as to try not to hurt his feelings, he might see that as something he can 'work with' and that has maneuvering room. By being blunt and direct, you're actually being more helpful in the long run, imo.
    word.

    i think my compassion has been mistaken for hesitation...and he's met that with persistence and determination that he will somehow prevail. it's a rare kind of romanticism that borders on quixotic. he doesn't understand that my Fi is filtering everything and you simply can't tell Fi it doesn't feel what it feels. in this case, a lack of compatibility.

    problem is, he responds to my being blunt with weird little comments about disappearing. and even sent me an email saying "our friendship is in jeopardy more than ever" because i hadn't communicated with him in over a week! wtf. there are odd little manipulations here and there that on one level crack me up (who does he think he's manipulating? i'm a ENFP for fuck's sake. we wrote the goddamn playbook even if we choose not to use it) and on another level piss me off (is this the face of love? because if he can't handle a little bit of rejection how's he going to handle a LTR and the external shit that will inevitably test it?).

    i think INFJs commit too soon romantically. i do not understand the means by which they commit, but it seems that they try superimposing a reality on the "relationship" before confirming that it's even there.


    or maybe i'm the most unromantic ENFP that ever was.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

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