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  1. #41
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    i found the canadian "i'm sorry for your loss" to be confusing, and i don't think the time of loss is the best time to expect someone to remember their social graces, often loss is difficult to acknowledge straight after it happens so people don't associate "i'm sorry" with the condition they are in on an immediate basis, and treat "i'm sorry" the way they are used to otherwise.

    so i directly translated the hebrew "i share in your sorrow". it was very appreciated and immoderately understood because there was no automatic response to it. but being a foreigner might have given it legitimacy.

    alternatively, feel free to try this ready-made condolences poetry from south africa's finest.
    Yeah, that is pretty tragic stuff on that link. It makes me want to tell the poets I'm sorry for their lack of talent.

    It doesn't pain me when they say "it's not your fault" - just makes me feel a bit silly and wonder if I've made things worse for them, which is the last thing I would want to do, obviously. It's hard to know what is going through someone's mind when they've experienced something harsh.

    I like "I share in your sorrow" but it does sound sort of "foreign", so might sound strange if you're from an English-speaking country.

    Us Canadians do apologise a lot!
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  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    Us Canadians do apologise a lot!
    it was explained to me by the locals to be an internationally misunderstood hidden sarcastic tone that if expanded upon would be "o i'm sorry was my foot in your way?!", along the same lines as "pardon me", which apparently means "o am i bothering you so much that you need to bother me? find the gas station yourself!".

    little do most citizens know, the government has taken the same approach, declaring canada's uniqueness to be it's welcoming nature and diversity as a melting pot of all cultures, which really means "the most fucked up immigration proccess by the thickest red tape ever, demanding you'd survive at least 8 months without a work visa if you can afford both that and a really good immigration lawyer, or alternatively a few years of back and forth telling you each time about that one error that for some reason we couldn't notice the previous time, and apparently had to do the fact you wrote it in blue pen instead of a red pen and didn't put your initials next to a correction to a detail that is also written a page bellow it and could have clearly being copied and pasted by the bureaucrat putting it into the computer if he was that welcoming".

  3. #43
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    Not really an "NF" topic, but I wasn't sure where to put this and figured I'd get good responses here.

    ...When someone tells me that...they have a serious illness; a good friend just died tragically; their marriage is ending; etc, my tendency is to look at them bug-eyed and say "I'M SO SORRY." (And I mean it, too, especially if I'm close to them.)...

    Thoughts?
    People are unnecessarily nitpicky sometimes, I swear.

    If you got to all the effort to say "Your friend's passing is unfortunate. I hope they had a good life and wish you and their family peace in this difficult time." then there is less opportunity for the person you're conversing with to be unecessarily nitpicky and snarky about your social graces.

    Saying "I'm sorry" or "I regret" both imply remorse, and thus somehow imply you feeling "at fault" when of course there is no damn way you were in such a situation.

    Or, you could be very blunt and say "You know damn well what I meant. I was being polite; stop being nitpicky."

    English is such a fun language.



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  4. #44
    morose bourgeoisie
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    When my sister died a few years ago, this guy I work with came up to me and said 'Man, if you ever want to talk about it, I'm here.' I was really touched by it, and it seemed an appropriate response to me. It was 'I'm sorry' but better...

    I woldn't worry about what people think or how they respond to statements of sympathy. They may push against it ('You don't have to be sorry') but they heard it at a more fundamental level, and that's the intent anyway.

  5. #45
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    I'm socially awkard any way. I'd almost inevitably say something goofy, or seems goofy here. If it's a good friend I honestly don't think social graces matter, not so close acquaintances.....I tend to be very careful with.
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  6. #46
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    It's cultural. I tend to tell people "I'm so sorry" too. If they say "it's not your fault" or "you didn't do anything" I inwardly either think they've never heard that expression, or they're being obstinate....saying "I'm so sorry to hear that" might make it clearer.

    Like @Elaur, it can work to say "that sucks" but only AGAIN to people from a particular age group or culture. You can't say that to your grandma or your aunt, they'd look at you like you're the most disrespectful twat on the face of the earth.

  7. #47
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Well, I can relate to what you've shared SilkRoad.

    When I've been on the receiving end, and someone gives me the big-eye emotional look and generic "I'm so sorry!", I realize it's sincere, and I can appreciate the effort, but I can sometimes feel annoyed because I don't want a misinterpretation of my emotional state reflected back to me. And that emotional expression makes me feel as though I now have to manage your emotional state and downplay things so you don't mirror to me this huge sadness.
    Wow, I'm surprised to see my own reaction worded so precisely. This is exactly my gut response too. I know that the other person is trying to be kind and sympathizing but I have an emotional reaction that is first almost offended (it can feel like the other person assumes they know the situation well enough to make a value judgment on it deserving sympathy), and subsequently responsible to comfort the other person. Of course, I realize mentally that they are just responding socially, so usually I think little of it, even though it twinges a little emotionally.

    But on the other side of the fence, I'm pretty sure I've ended up telling of people "I'm sorry" for lack of more comfortable wording. Like Starry said, I think it's just become sort of a scripted response. Ever since Fidelia explained to me about Fe and the politeness of questions, I have used that as a route, too. I have found that sometimes it feels much easier to just ask gentle questions than provide a judging response, even though questioning is not my native tendency in emotional conversation.

    I think that all exchanges like this are rather touchy anyway and they deserve leeway on both sides of the conversation. Of course it's going to be a little uncomfortable and awkward for both the speaker and the listener.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    Us Canadians do apologise a lot!
    I have never met so many rude, annoying, racist and close-minded people in one place. A looot of issues regarding their inferiority complex to Americans (hiding behind their fake superiority).

    EDIT: Just remembered all the jokes about the brits preparing for the Olympics and warning everybody in the UK how touchy the Canadians are, so not to mistake them for Americans. Canadians took offence (of course . Funny people.


    @Mane
    Pretty spot on

    This is Fi-Te land. Oversensitive Fi backed by brutish, immature Te.


    On topic: People have always said: "Thank you". Sometimes: "Thank you. It's OK".

    Probably you are overdoing the empathy. If they all respond in a weird way, it's probably you, not them.

  9. #49
    small potatoes NotOfTwo's Avatar
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    I faced this recently, a client told me her assistance dog was dying of cancer. Tragic on a lot of levels. I was sincerely sorry for her impending loss and told her so.

    I have grown over the years. I used to back away, mumbling in confusion, when confronted with a grieving person. I have a handle on that now, thank goodness.
    "It's never enough." The Cure

  10. #50
    Senior Member Joehobo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Hahahaha, a fine example good sir!

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